Run Theo Epstein out of Boston

I don't even know how to start to rip this post apart. If you're not trolling that is.

What about?:

Papi

Foulke

Millar

Mientkewicz

Roberts

Cabrera

Bellhorn

Embree

Myers

I think there's more, but to say that last year was Duquette's team is just a joke.

Getting rid of Nomah was the best move any Boston GM has ever made - hands down. Between Thanksgiving 2003 and the trade deadline in 2004, Epstein made all the move that made that WS title possible: getting rid of Nomah, getting Schilling, Foulke, Bellhorn (who was huge in the post-season last year, and then was dumped when he struggled this year), Cabrera, Dave Roberts (another huge piece of the puzzle), Mientkiewicz, Myers, etc.

Let's not forget that in 2003, Theo signed Ortiz (for $1.25 mil...a steal), Timlin, Mueller, and Millar.

In addition, the Sox farm system is in its best shape in years....Hanley Rameriez, Papelbon, Hansen...all looking like they will contribute next year.

Not much of that 2004 team was Duquettes, except for Manny and his oversized contract.

he'll re-sign today....deal with it

Theo got rid of Duquette's first draft pick from back in '94...

Sending that shortstop to the Cubs...

Minor detail in the turning of the page between GMs.

Derek Lowe chose to go elsewhere. Given his inconsistency, it probably was not a bad call. He was great in the post season but you seem to forget how bad he was during the past 2 regular seasons.

Epstein didn't "Get Rid" of Pedro. They offered Pedro a TON of money (more money than he had previously claimed would make him stay) and he turned it down because he wanted to break the bank with another guaranteed year. And why did he want to break the bank? Pride. Period.

Getting rid of Nomar was a stroke of genius. In one move, they got rid of a guy who was a cancer in the clubhouse, injured all the time, saved themselves millions, and got a guy who produced when they needed it (Cabrera).

Leave it to Alex Space-Cadet Filides to want to run out of town the one guy who brought us a world series. Duquette had YEARS to produce something and he couldn't do it.

Not too sure about Schilling... great talent on the field but a huge distraction in the clubhouse. He destroyed the diamondbacks after they won the series. the main reason the big unit went to NY was so he could face off against Schill.

The Sox were not the same cohesive unit this year as last, the players did a good job keeping their mouths shut but I would be willing to be Damon and the other idiots were POd about losing Pedro and having to endure Schill

Manny Ramirez

Pedro Martinez

Nomar Garciapara

Derek Lowe

Tim Wakefield

Johnny Damon

Jason Varitek

C'mon baseball fans, let's get serious here. Yes, I accidentally omitted Foulke's name Epstein did end up getting him along with Schilling, you guys are right. At least 2/3rds of the WS championship team was Duquettes, his teams had several playoff runs. It takes some luck to win the WS, just ask the Braves how many years they've been to the postseason and that whole time have come out with only one world championship.

But let's give credit here where credit is due, Duquette has at least attempted to put a World Series contender, Epstein got Cabrera, Doug Mientkiewicz and Dave Roberts for Nomar. Mientkiewicz was a bust, Roberts is a career .263 hitter and they got rid of Roberts.

Last, there's no way the Yankees would let "Pedro" leave because Steinbrenner didn't want to give him more money, seriously, what a joke. There are no small market teams in baseball, just cheap owners. Pedro didn't walk, they didn't want to dish out the cash.

*the got rid of Cabrera, not Roberts

hypothetically if the Yankees had Pedro(another correction)

I'll agree that he was often injured, but how could you say Nomar was a cancer in the clubhouse? He's one of the hardest working players in baseball and certainly a role model to everyone else on the team, so I'm not really sure where that came from. I guess we'll see during the off-season what kind of GM Epstein truly is.

Alex Filides wrote:

I'll agree that he was often injured, but how could you say Nomar was a cancer in the clubhouse? He's one of the hardest working players in baseball and certainly a role model to everyone else on the team, so I'm not really sure where that came from. I guess we'll see during the off-season what kind of GM Epstein truly is.

It's pretty clear that you don't really follow the Red Sox that closely if it's news to you that Nomah was a clubhouse cancer. When he was traded, you could almost hear the sigh of relief from the Sox dugout in Worcester.

And as soon as he was gone, the team turned around the season.

Duquette never would have traded Nomar, and the Sox never would have won the World Series. You'll have a hard time finding anyone in Boston that the Sox would have won with Nomar...

Telling Pedro to get out of town another good move. He wanted a contract commensurate with his 1999 numbers, and the reality was that his performance had declined dramatically. As a Sox fan, I definately did not want Pedro back...not for the money he wanted.

Alex -

Theo's teams managed to reach the playoffs three years in a row, something Duquette's teams could never do. Even Schilling agrees that he's a top-notch GM; see

http://www.boston.com/sports/baseball/redsox/extras/extra_bases/2005/10/schilling_on_ep.html

.

On the other hand, the Yankees would be thrilled to see Theo walk.

No GM is perfect, since player valuation is never a certainty, even for players themselves. For example, Garciaparra hasn't put together a decent season in years because of injuries, and has had to take a huge pay cut. At one point a few years ago, he turned down a 4 year $15 million deal! Duquette was difficult to deal with (some agents wouldn't even negotiate with him), made a lot of enemies of players (e.g. Clemens), and made some huge tactical mistakes (overpaying for Ramirez). I'd take Theo any day...

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As a Sox fan, I definately did not want Pedro back...not for the money he wanted.

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Let me ask you something? Why do you care what he makes? You didn't want him back for the money he was making? Who cares, you aren't paying his salary? I don't understand.

Anyways, Theo is out as GM of the Boston RedSox, umm I think the "baseball gods" heard me. Ha! Baseball Gods.

Hey I like the Red Sox too, but isn't there a board on ESPN or CBS or something to have these discussions.

Hey, if Mayeroff can have a sex thread, then I sure as well can have a baseball thread. ;-)

You don't understand baseball much, do you?

Cabrera produced from day one -- hell the man hit a homer in his first Red Sox at bat. The team was much better with him in shortstop than it was with Nomar. And yes, Nomar was clearly a cancer in the clubhouse. He was a prima donna who was always injured. Nobody was sorry to see him go. Cabrera was a welcome replacement. Thanks to Theo.

In order for a player to be a "bust" he has to play far below the expectations for him. Mientkiewicz was an average player when they got him. He played average for the Red Sox. He didn't under-perform, he performed exactly as he always had. He was a stop-gap player but in the end, they wanted something better.

And of course they got rid of Roberts. They got Roberts late in the year for his speed. They needed a guy who could pinch run and steal a base at the right time. That is the ONLY reason they got him. Not for his hitting or fielding. Just for his running. As we all know, it paid off handsomely. Without Roberts stealing that base, the Sox lose that 4th game to the Yankees. Series over. Once he had served his purpose and the year was over, they got rid of him. The entire thing was a brilliant move that paid off hugely. Thanks to Theo.

The Yankees? I think you mean the Sox right? The Red Sox offered Pedro 40.5 million over 3 years guaranteed. This was more money than Pedro had already publicly stated he would stay for. It is DEFINITELY "shelling out the cash". The Mets offered him an extra year. The main problem is that Pedro is a prima donna, like Nomar, who wouldn't stay unless he was paid more than Shilling (who had a much better season that year). Nobody offers almost 14 million a year to somebody they're trying to "get rid of". Pedro walked, plain and simple.

Now Theo has had a power struggle with Larry Luchino and Larry won. So be it. The Sox will suffer for losing him.

It's clear you don't have a clue about baseball, Alex. I wouldd say "stick to running" but you don't know a thing about that either.

Alex, I have been a Sox fan probably longer than you have been alive. Theo engineered the championship and made great moves based on statistical analysis rather than keeping pampered and overpaid stars around too long. That's why we never won under the Yawkey / Duquette regime. It's a damned shame that Larry "Attention Whore" Lucchino forced him out.

Do yourself a favor and read "Moneyball". That will teach you how Theo operates and why a guy with a .550 OBP and a good glove means more in the lineup than an oft injured superstar who hits 30 dingers and whiffs 1/3 of the time. For all his supposed greatness, why hasn't Nomar put the long suffering Cubbies over the top? That's right, he only plays about 100 games a year and then takes a month to find his swing after coming off the DL. Most guys with any Sox info will tell you that Nomar's constant moping about his contract and "respect" was bringing the clubhouse down in 2004.

Thanks for making Red Sox Nation happy Theo! You will be missed.

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You don't understand baseball much, do you?

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I understand baseball much more than you ever will.

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Cabrera produced from day one -- hell the man hit a homer in his first Red Sox at bat. The team was much better with him in shortstop than it was with Nomar

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And you won't get an arguement from this side. Cabrera was one of the best defensive shortstops in the game. If you understand the importance of having a very good defensive middle(ss+2nd baseman) to go along with range at those positions. The hitting was certainly an added bonus. Well let's all praise Epstein for letting Cabrera go. You sit here and praise him for acquiring Cabrera and then you don't have an opinion on Epstein letting Cabrera go.

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Mientkiewicz was an average player when they got him. He played average for the Red Sox. He didn't under-perform, he performed exactly as he always had.

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Sure he did. He was in and around .290-.300 career hitter when he was with the Twins, only for him to bat a whopping .215 with his stint with the Sox. He was a real champion and really provided that spark the Sox needed. Heck even Jackie Gutierez and Ed Romero could hit over .215 and they were shortstops. At least he reached the Mendoza line! Good ole Mario Mendoza!

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And of course they got rid of Roberts

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And that complete's the sweep, no sense of keeping him either I suppose. He was talented enough to keep in 2004, but we ended up letting him go as well. Who exactly did we get for Nomar?

I've also edited the other post if you read below. I could go on, but it would appear to be a waste of my time.

Cabrera was intended to be a stopgap as well. The fact that he performed above expectations was nice but not expected to continue. He wanted too much money and years for a player of his numbers. If he had been a little less demanding, he would still be with the sox. He was far better he was than expectations, but not expected to be worth what he was asking

They got rid of Cabrera to get Renteria, a player who had proven himself the previous two years with great numbers. That's a smart move. Fault Theo for a lot of things but you can't fault him for not being psychic enough to know that Renteria was going to bomb.

Mientkiewicz was also a stop-gap player, just like Cabrera. The difference was that unlike Cabrera, he underperformed. So they got rid of him. He wasn't perfect but he got the job done and frankly, he was the best option available at the time.

Yeah, you really have a deep insight into the game of baseball, Alex. Pay attention now, you'll learn something: Towards the end of each season -- in September -- the major league roster expands. Teams are allowed to have more players than previously. THAT is when the Red Sox picked up Roberts. They only got him then for pinch running ability. That's a LUXURY, Alex. One that they cannot afford when the permitted roster size shrinks back down at the beginning of the year. So they had to get rid of him.

Your understanding of the game is truly astounding, Alex. You are just about the only person besides Larry Luchino (and George Steinbrenner) glad that Theo's gone.