Is Elle Purrier in American Record shape? Is she Clean?

runderrun wrote:

THOUGHTSLEADER wrote:

You're out of your element. She ran 15:08 on a 90-degree day with major humidity in Austin in February. She destroyed Weini Kelati just running FTW, and Weini ran 14:58 a week later. Pete Julian and her coach Mark Coogan are of the opinion she can run under 14:30. I'd trust them over the guy who thinks she could maybe beat Josette Norris.

How gullible do you have to be to believe everything someone's coach says? Houlihan was ready to break the 5k world record according to her coach, and Muir was in 1500 WR shape earlier this year according to her coach. Coaches blow smoke up their athletes, it's part of the job description

Jerry thought shelby was in 14:30 shape when she ran the 5k AR in 2020..what are you talking about

Preface - Purrier won me ten bucks. I was at the BU Valentine's invitational back in Feb 2018. Sat near Purrier's family who had driven into town for the race and found out she'd just heard that evening that her partner had been in a massive accident. She then proceeds to rip a 4:26 mile, just a few tenths off of Jenny Simpson's NCAA record. I was massively impressed - her ability not just to go fast and beat pros like Nicole Sifuentes, but to compartmentalize and focus despite the stress of it all. I bet my friend $10 over Dunkin donuts the next morning that Purrier wins a national outdoor title within five years. Boom. Thanks Elle, get to buy some more donuts now.

So I'm a Purrier St Pierre fan, but not as big a fan of her as Thought Leader who may or may not be Mark Coogan. I think she's great, and in the driver's seat for bronze in the 15. However to beat Muir she has to either a) get in 3:54 front running shape to run the wheels off Muir or b) hope Tseguy does the 15 so *she* runs the wheels of Muir. 3:58 front run ain't gonna be enough to pop Muir's kick. If it's tactical, Muir's 800 talent will see her through. Her secret weapon though is Muir does sometimes have the tendency to run like a tactical buffoon (see Rio 2016) so if she's patient she's got a real opportunity.

F Hailu looks good, but her 3:57 had wavelight which has gotta be worth a couple seconds at least. Though her 1:57 will def cause trouble in a tactical race. People like Linden Hall and GDS are chasing right now, the latter has been fine, but hasn't looked close to her 2019 shape since... Well... 2019.

I'd also say there's a big difference between 14:30 and 14:3x. I'd say Purrier could do 14:3x but 14:30 itself might be tougher. Yes her 15:08 was in hot conditions, but Klosterhalfen ran a solo debut 10k fresh off an injury at the same meet in 31:01 - worth approx a 14:45 (from someone with a PB of 14:26). Ten is definitely more hurt by heat and humidity than a 5, but Purrier also fitter now than in the winter. Hence I say definitely sub 14:45, but would be (pleasantly) to see sub 14:30.

PS - bet same friend another $10 on a Purrier medal ThoughtLeader before you take too much umbridge with anything I said.

She almost got knocked down at the start and soloed 3:58 flat in 90 degree weather. So, I think that she is in American record shape and will have people to chase to make that happen in Tokyo.

Ellie has been in pretty close to this shape since she beat Klosterhalfen and smashed the American indoor mile record.

belfast1913 wrote:

runderrun wrote:

How gullible do you have to be to believe everything someone's coach says? Houlihan was ready to break the 5k world record according to her coach, and Muir was in 1500 WR shape earlier this year according to her coach. Coaches blow smoke up their athletes, it's part of the job description

Jerry thought shelby was in 14:30 shape when she ran the 5k AR in 2020..what are you talking about

I'm talking about the interview Shelby gave to LRC last year when she said her and Jerry thought the WR would be in reach in 2021. I linked to it in my last post

You know the more I think about it, the more it looks suspicious to me

3:58 in 90 degree heat, front running the whole way, after being pushed off the track, with a slow first 400, after running rounds at the trials. And she ran away from Corey Mcgee with ease.

She is definitely in 3:55 shape right now, 3:54 wouldn't be impossible. The elephant in the room is that 3:54.99 AR is held by a doper. So we would have to believe either

A. Elle is naturally better than someone who doped OR

B. She is doping herself.

runderrun wrote:

First, what you said about her 5k fitness is impossible to refute because it's entirely hypothetical, you're guessing what sort of shape she is in based on second hand knowledge of her training and no details. The only proof we have of her 5k fitness is the February race, which was a 15:08.

Here's Shelby saying her and Jerry felt she could go for the 5k WR this year.

Here's Muir saying the plan for the USATF was to go out at 3:50 pace

I really don't get why you're so defensive about this, I didn't think it would be controversial to say Elle Purrier isn't the 5th best 5k runner in the world right now

You're just not making good points, sorry. 15:08 in February on a really hot day smoking someone who'd run 14:58 one week later indicates good things.

When Shelby said that the World Record was 14:11 and she'd run 14:23.9. She ran 14:23 with no super-spikes in a glorified time trial with a big neg split. And what's your point that because you think this was an outlandish goal by Jerry that mean Coogan/Julian, who are different coaches entirely, thinking 14:30 for Purrier isn't outlandish are invalidated? Dumb.

Muir claiming she was on pace with a 61.55 now is proof her coach thought she was in WR shape and all coaches set absurd goals? What are you even saying? Why does that track at all?

I think you must be stuck in some bizarro-world where breaking 15 is a big deal for women and 14:30 is some crazy time. You have to wake up. Three Ethiopians, not named Gidey, ran 14:15 or faster two weeks ago. Karissa Schweizer has broken 14:30. Elise Cranny can probably run 14:35 or faster right now. Obiri can do it easily. Rengeruk can too. Hassan I mean obviously. Koko can do it when healthy. That is 10 women I can see beating Purrier in the 5K even if she's in 14:30-type shape which I suspect she is.

Definitely not Mark Coogan, though honored to be mistaken for a great coach when I'm just a hobbyjogger track nerd.

I think you are understating Muir's tactical struggles. I could very much see Kipyegon and Purrier pushing the pace hard from 800+ out. Muir's problem pretty much always is she has no self-control and tactical awareness and goes extremely hard to be leading and chasing gold with 200 to go trying to beat stronger athletes like Kipyegon/Hassan (which I can't see happening). Meanwhile Purrier can run within herself and close hard and strong the last 150 like she's done to win from the front or to beat Koko in the past. I think there is a tendency to think 800m speed is all that matters with a 1500m kick. Not so. Centrowitz and Willis both have great kicks superior to many with faster 800m PBs.

As for your 5K quibble, I mean it's fine. I think she can run somewhere in the 14:25-14:35 range. Koko is extremely skinny and probably can survive the extreme heat better than about anyone. She was definitely chasing a mark moreso than Purrier who was cruising to me and running FTW. It was not a good day to run fast. Elle's a very competent 5K runner and her 1500 is built upon her strength not speed as you can see from her barely breaking 2 in the 800. It's crazy to think all of these American no-names can run 14:48-14:51 and Elle would have any trouble doing that.

Well, for all you Purrier fans who think she's in AR shape, the Diamond League in Monaco on July 9th has Hassan and Kipyegon in the 1500. I'm certain Purrier's agent can get the American champion a place if she wants it. She won't get a better opportunity to get the AR - Monaco's super fast track, and she'll be rabbited for the full distance by two women who run 3:53 for fun.

It would be great to see her race some global talents

runderrun wrote:

Well, for all you Purrier fans who think she's in AR shape, the Diamond League in Monaco on July 9th has Hassan and Kipyegon in the 1500. I'm certain Purrier's agent can get the American champion a place if she wants it. She won't get a better opportunity to get the AR - Monaco's super fast track, and she'll be rabbited for the full distance by two women who run 3:53 for fun.

It would be great to see her race some global talents

Sorry not possible. American athletes dont participate in many races. They would have to pause their drug regime

Elle is NOT clean. You can see the TOTAL body transformation just by scrolling through her instagram. It's extremely obvious and unnatural.

Even doped up, she barely beat crappy Cory McGee. Elle will not break the american record.

I don't think she would try to get the AR even if she could. Running 3:54 after easily destroying the Olympic trials field would make her look way too suspicious. She wasn't even going 100% when she left Corey Mcgee in the dust, wasn't even out of breath, she looked completely relaxed.

runderrun wrote:

Well, for all you Purrier fans who think she's in AR shape, the Diamond League in Monaco on July 9th has Hassan and Kipyegon in the 1500. I'm certain Purrier's agent can get the American champion a place if she wants it. She won't get a better opportunity to get the AR - Monaco's super fast track, and she'll be rabbited for the full distance by two women who run 3:53 for fun.

It would be great to see her race some global talents

fake news alert wrote:

Elle is NOT clean. You can see the TOTAL body transformation just by scrolling through her instagram. It's extremely obvious and unnatural.

Even doped up, she barely beat crappy Cory McGee. Elle will not break the american record.

This....

Fanboys want so badly to believe..

Purrier and her running mates are squeaky clean. All girl, all clean, all American!

Well, the Purrier fanboys are about to see if she really is in AR shape. She's on the start list for Monaco on 9th July.

The fastest track in the world for 1500m if history is anything to go by. She'll also be getting smoked by Hassan and Kipyegon so she'll have people to chase all the way around.

I'm predicting 3:56-high to 3:57-low

I’ll admit to being a Purrier St. Pierre fan boy. Did she scratch from Monaco?

I saw her on the start list last week but today I didn’t see her name on it.

I could see her being dirty.

She's been upfront that she wasn't really a track fan (she barely knew who the people were when she raced them, or really that much about the sports history and culture). I could see her talk herself into doping as no big deal "isn't this what I'm supposed to do right? I don't really know that much about the sport but I'm supposed to dope....RIGHT?"

pretty sure she runs with pineda sports (ie, jama aden) and is therefore doped to the gills with epo

JlTahoe wrote:

Did she scratch from Monaco? I saw her on the start list last week but today I didn’t see her name on it.

Well that can't be good.

Time for the LRC boys to hit the phones and find out what is going on.

It will still be interesting to see how MacLean and McGee do.