(Road Racing and) Time Trialing and Training Thread - Week Ending 6/7/20

Sadly no pacer. I don't really have a lot of friends who run. Moreover, finding someone to run 5:30 miles at 4AM on a Saturday morning isn't too easy.

m 43, 6'1", 180lbs

Goal - Tunnel Vision Marathon Aug 16

M - 5 easy,

T - am 5 easy, pm 6 easy

W - am 6 light progression, pm 7 easy

T - 12 @ 95% (7:20 overall avg)

F - am 7.5 easy, pm 4 easy

S - 19.5 fundamental tempo (90%)

S - 8 easy

Total 80 miles

nothing ground breaking this week, just some more consistent miles as we move into 10 weeks out from the goal event. Temps were especially brutal again this week with near record highs.

Wednesday - wanted to actually run something longer with more of a progression but I was running behind and had to cut it short so kept it on the lighter side and decided to run something on Thursday.

Thursday - wanted to get in some work close to MP and begin to stretch out the miles over the course of the next ten weeks. Reality is it should have been a bit faster than MP but at the start it was around 87 with a 64 DP so that just wasn't happening. As is the last couple miles were brutal due to heating up.

Saturday - awesome long run. Temps came down a bit finally and just cruised a steady long run at around 90% of GMP.

WH - Solid, steady week. I think you had mentioned about 'tunnel vision marathon' being a 'go' based on some inside knowledge. Anything more that you can share?

I am looking at the other races that happen on the same course, and was wondering how likely that the races would happen.

HHW - Those are some pretty legit workouts. I know you’re not planning on doing a marathon soon, and marathons are objectively dumb, but I think you’ll be able to do a good one. It’s probably smart to give it a little time to log miles and toughen up the connective tissue. As for what I think I can do in a mile, probably in the 4:40s, but really don’t have a good feel for those gears right now. Getting down around 5:00 pace felt more like 3k. Hopefully will get in touch with that pace over the next few weeks.

RRR - Looks like a good plan for a mile. Watch out for the pantophobia.

imagebearer - Since you were still able to finish strong, don’t see Thursday’s workout being a problem. Good week.

SC - Thanks for starting the thread bright and early again. I’ll second darkwave’s comment on Vets Day. We have a few good 10ks around here. There’s also a fast one in June I’d planned to do (supposed to be this weekend) that usually draws a good field and is on a fast course, but then racing a 10k in June can be horrible if the weather doesn’t cooperate.

GNR1 - Solid time trials the last few weeks.

Rhodium Nights - That’s a great feeling. Hard to maintain. If MCM happens and you end up doing it, I’ll probably be down there cheering.

WHS - Seconding GNR1, also similar to my HS times except much better than my horrid XC (2:01/4:02/9:30/16:37 for 800/1500/3200/XC). Any college running plans?

Smoove - Good consistent weeks

brakz - I’ve been bad about comments the last few weeks, but welcome to the thread and congrats on the PB.

Tyler - Good job doing the cross training. (I tend to get lazy when injured if there’s no immediate goal.)

Cocoon - It’s really hard doing equivalency between sprints and distance. I always used to use Purdy, which would indicate your 5k is a lot better than the 200/400. I’ll agree with HHW that you have the endurance for your goal and think speed would be more the limiting factor.

Older Ramanujen - I wouldn’t worry about the 8 miler being to long compared to the other days. Just keep logging the miles.

BHViking - Still some quality in that base week, which is good.

darkwave - Looks like you’re getting some good use out of the treadmill with the hill workouts. The non-running goals look tough!

CD - Can imagine how draining that heat must be.

Runner Sam - Good speed work. We had some pretty bad thunder and lightning last week too. I had surgery for the sports hernia with Meyers back in 2008. Other than my insurance not covering it, it went great.

JtA - Nice, well-rounded week. Looks like we might have a summer track series of time trials!

Rucker - Hill sprints are always good. I’d like to run the JFK 50 some day.

Bmore - That is a lot of climbing Sat/Sun! Sorry you had to postpone the wedding.

Lanc - Nice 3k! Could be the SI joint?

hardguyxc- Those are some speed kilometers.

pewow - Nice fartlek. Quite the list of activities on Sunday.

WH - Love those fundamental tempos. Glad it cooled off a bit for that.

Popping in. Last 3 weeks have been a little rough. I was out on a 10-miler a week ago with everything feeling great, and the tib just went. Intense, sharp pain. Haven't run a step in a week. MRI scheduled for Tuesday. I can't help hoping there's a tear so I at least have a clear path forward.

tl;dr on the last 3 weeks: Colonoscopy, COVID-19 scare (101F+ fever, shortness of breath, but negative test), tib blew up, stopped running, started Humira. Among everything else, this year has been a wild ride so far.

It's what the Aussie complex model calls for! But I also just actually like the workout because I'm a weirdo

That's so weird to me. Maybe its a regional thing? But the races nearest to me are also big on loop courses. Adding a 10k to an out and back course would be a lot more annoying so that may also be a difference. But I agree about catering to the 5k and half marathon crowd. The 10k is kind of like the ugly step sister that no one really wants.

jewbacca wrote:

Popping in. Last 3 weeks have been a little rough. I was out on a 10-miler a week ago with everything feeling great, and the tib just went. Intense, sharp pain. Haven't run a step in a week. MRI scheduled for Tuesday. I can't help hoping there's a tear so I at least have a clear path forward.

tl;dr on the last 3 weeks: Colonoscopy, COVID-19 scare (101F+ fever, shortness of breath, but negative test), tib blew up, stopped running, started Humira. Among everything else, this year has been a wild ride so far.

Get Healthy JB

Found some Fuel Cell 5280s for relatively cheap ( $110) and used them for a speed workout today. They are pretty fantastic. Probably questionable as to whether they would be better than the VF for 5000 (my guess is no) and I think the VF would be a lot better at 10,000, but the reviews that say you can't run anything more than a mile in them due to the aggressive nature are dead wrong.

Those of us that ran XC in spikes and aggressive flats have always sort of known you can run a quick 5000 in a shoe like that, and I don't always trust reviewers because it doesn't seem like they did run in aggressive shoes for races growing up, but the 5280 is basically like a cushy XC spike without the spikes. I really like them. I may well wear them for 5Ks.

runrincerepeat wrote:

Rucker - As a former Tri guy .. question .. local Sprintish Tri here in September 400-15.6 mile-5k

I know how to swim just not lap swim per se ... how easy would it be for me to get into nominal swim shape w 2 months in the water (after TT to Sept) any books you recommend etc for learning to lap swim? We are having a corporate relay team in the sprint as well .. and I want to dominate them solo.

Can't recommend much in the way of videos other than watching great swimmers swim on YouTube. Best option is find a local swim coach, get a lesson with them at least once a week and have them provide some technique drills for you to do and square you away on them and the basics, then get in the water as frequently as possible and do a lot of drill/swim work with some short 15-30sec sprints at the end (swimming is all about frequency and getting that elusive "feel for the water"). For a book, "Swim Speed Secrets" by Sheila Taormina (sp?) is great, but nothing replaces an actual coach watching you.

As far as getting into swim shape in 2 months...there's a difference between "I know how to swim" and being able to move efficiently in the water...learning anytime after elementary/middle school is tough. I learned at 15/16, was a fast learner, and still never quite "got it" the way your average-to-decent elementary schooler would. I would estimate you could maybe get to 1:50-2min/100 yards (~2:00-2:10/100m) in a few months. Top guys will be <1:10-1:15/100m, "ex-swimmers" will be 1:20-1:35 depending on how much they trained. You can expect to lose ~5min coming out of the water to the front of the race.

Swimming was the death of me as a triathlete...I could stomp at 25-27mph indefinitely and run well afterwards but I was always playing catch-up after swimming 1:25-1:35/100m at best in open water. Best of luck!!

BmoreRunner wrote:

Rhodium Nights - Nice week! Doing the Osaka Marathon would be an amazing experience I imagine, that's quite a goal! What was your inspiration to run there?

Thanks Bmore!!!

Uncle Sam is shipping me to Japan for the next 3 years so I figure I will definitely attack some Japanese Marathons while I am out there! Osaka will be just a train ride away! :)

I leave the country on July 4th. (Oh, the irony haha)

Rucker- I guess I meant more not swim shape but not look like a total joke! The swim is short in relation to the bike and run. So ... maybe I can doggie paddle it.

Rhodium - Okinawa? My little cousin is a newly minted butter bar and is stationed there for the next 3 years. He and his wife love it thus far.

Few more comments/replies:

Sub-6:00: That's awesome that you're from D.C.! Love the MCM course and I hope the race goes on this year but who knows. That was a great 1' on/off session for you on the weekend. Also your easy pace is insane haha I can't imagine running at that pace all the time. You're a Beast!

cocoon: I am amazed at the amount of track sessions you do. Four days in a row!! Very impressive and it will definitely pay off! Has that always been your preferred method of training?

JamesTheAmateur: Nice consistent week! Is 50 mpw your goal for the summer or do you want to keep building form there? I envy your dry heat in California by the way! San Diego is my all time favorite city :D

highhoppingworm: Because of the absolutely bonkers amount of time that I have to train for my next marathon (still 20+ weeks for all fall marathons that are still on), my goal marathon pace is a moving target. I have ambitious goals for the marathon but as of right now, I am developing 10m/HM speed and will transition into marathon-specific training around mid to late August. At that point, I will have a better idea what my goal M pace is.

BmoreRunner: Nice track session! You have great speed at the shorter distances. I think sub 2:37 should be no problem if you can squeeze into a fall race!!

hardguyXC: Sick 1k repeats. Is your ultimate goal to OTQ?

runrincerepeat wrote:

Rhodium - Okinawa? My little cousin is a newly minted butter bar and is stationed there for the next 3 years. He and his wife love it thus far.

Iwakuni!! Haha there's a decent chance I know your cousin, the Marine Corps is a small family

cocoon wrote:

WH - Solid, steady week. I think you had mentioned about 'tunnel vision marathon' being a 'go' based on some inside knowledge. Anything more that you can share?

I am looking at the other races that happen on the same course, and was wondering how likely that the races would happen.

Can one PM here? I'd put it at 50/50 and this is what I've been told as well. Happy to share more info off the public domain.

Oh man, try learning to swim a crawl correctly in your early 30s! I spent a year with a solid coach and was still pathetic as best in the water. As someone that grew up playing golf from a young age I had a newfound understanding of how bad it is for someone later in life trying to pick up clubs for the first time. Also agree that 2 months is not going to be of much benefit for getting better but maybe for just surviving.

Rhodium Nights wrote:

cocoon: I am amazed at the amount of track sessions you do. Four days in a row!! Very impressive and it will definitely pay off! Has that always been your preferred method of training?

?

Just been training this way for the last 3 weeks. Picked up a book called 'Easy Interval Method' based on the advertisement from the author on this message forum. I was looking at ways to get away from my marathon shuffle, so was intrigued with the method. Doing all the repeats on the road after programming the GPS watch. The repeats are never all-out: 200m @ ~3K pace, 400m @ ~ 10K pace, 1000m @ ~ HM/M pace. It is manageable right now, but I will be making a few changes to add in some 'top-end speed' sessions in the next month or so.

Ha, I live in Washington now. But I grew up in California in the beanier parts of LA. But my goal right now is to alternate weeks of 50 and 70. My quarter just ended and my wife is working a week on, week off schedule currently. So on weeks she's off, I'm trying to run 50 and do the typical week of Tues/Thurs/Sat of tempo/Deek's/hills. And when she's on, I want to try running 70 in doubles with CV/repeats/hills on those weeks. But we'll see how it ultimately works out. I definitely want to keep 50 as my current base.

I could run more if I did a longer long run and a medium long run. But I figure its better to stick with something I can do week in and week out versus missing runs. Going from 90 - 100 minutes to 2 hours just obliterates my motivation for some reason.