So was Iowa rigged as the Dem establishment didn't want people to realize Bernie Sanders kicked ass?

Backwards wrote:

Hardloper wrote:

The second round of voting was much closer. To me that just shows that Bernie voters are Bernie-or-nothing whereas supporters of other candidates are more likely to switch to Buttigieg in the second round once their candidate is eliminated.

I think it's more like Bernie didn't get eliminated in many first rounds and the other candidates supporters were more of the anybody but Bernie type.

Right, that's more accurately stated

The DNC is a machine . This is predictable , HRC is hitting the talk show circuits going after Bernie's message of "false hope" . Watching US politics for entertainment , as these politicos are the most deranged ,evil people on the planet. Both entertaining and frightening.

Unfolding as expected wrote:

The DNC is a machine . This is predictable , HRC is hitting the talk show circuits going after Bernie's message of "false hope" . Watching US politics for entertainment , as these politicos are the most deranged ,evil people on the planet. Both entertaining and frightening.

.... on both sides

rojo wrote:

Ernest wrote:

IOWA caucus results with "99% reporting" :

Candidate Delegates Share Count

Pete Buttigieg 13 26.2% 564

Bernie Sanders 12 26.1% 562

Elizabeth Warren 8 18% 387

Joe Biden 6 15.8% 341

So I guess what was happening was I was seeing the delegate count before and now am seeing the total vote count. So funny. Many dems can't stand the electoral college in recent years and now it's popping up at the state level. Here is the vote counts.

1st Round 2nd Round

Sanders 43,671 24.8 45,826 26.6 562 12

Buttigieg 37,557 21.3 43,195 25.0 564 13

So Sanders got 16.2% more votes than Buttigieg in the 1st round and somehow lost the delegate count?

The way I interpret it is that Bernie is the first choice for a lot more people, but not the second or third or fourth choice of the folks who prefer someone else as their first choice. Short for you either love him, or you don’t want him.

Which Dem are you supporting, rojo? You need to choose one living in the people's republic of Maryland.

It wasn't rigged. Shadow Inc. was clearly given a contract due to bogus insider-dealing, but I don't think the intention was to have them tamper with the results. The party leadership can't come out and admit the details of corrupt deal and everything that went wrong, so in the process of covering their ass they are fueling larger conspiracy theories. The IDP's decision to release partial results was completely incomprehensible and inexcusable, but probably the result of panic. The media's decision to report on those results as if they were final was also completely incomprehensible and inexcusable, and I do think it was partly motivated by an anti-Sanders bias.

Even if it was rigged, this whole fiasco undoubtedly benefits Bernie anyway. You couldn't ask for a better way to highlight the need for dramatic change in the Democratic Party's leadership. Furthermore, the fact is that Bernie's people fought to keep the caucus system in Iowa because they thought it would improve their chances of winning; they believe they are better at turning people out. It's not their fault that the Iowa Democratic Party and the DNC totally screwed up the reporting process, but people who support democracy shouldn't be supporting the caucus system. The caucus never should have happened in the first place, so the Sanders campaign shares some of the blame.

The Gallant Pig Man wrote:

It wasn't rigged. Shadow Inc. was clearly given a contract due to bogus insider-dealing, but I don't think the intention was to have them tamper with the results. The party leadership can't come out and admit the details of corrupt deal and everything that went wrong, so in the process of covering their ass they are fueling larger conspiracy theories..

You and I have different definitions of rigged. This is pretty much admitting it was rigged.

Yes, and Trump only lost the vote b/c of 3 million illegals voted... if only he hadn’t disbanded the investigating commission before the had evidence. Everything is rigged I tell ya.

Jesus, Hillary Clinton is cancer. I loathe Trump, but I honestly can't imagine having to listen to that for 4 years either. She needs to shut her fecking piehole - she lost, she's irrelevant and she needs to go the feck away.

14theThumb wrote:

Jesus, Hillary Clinton is cancer. I loathe Trump, but I honestly can't imagine having to listen to that for 4 years either. She needs to shut her fecking piehole - she lost, she's irrelevant and she needs to go the feck away.

Hillary is a very good lady. I could vote for her as president. She has some fresh ideas. Ideas that can improve the country.

Treadhead. wrote:

Staunch defense of Rush Limbaugh, far right conspiracy theories, Rojo your bias is showing.

I find it odd that so many trump supporters jump so quickly to conspiracy theories about Bernie being cheated.

And seriously, if you support Trump you have already lost credibility regarding appreciation for the truth.

Conspiracy yes. Some delegates ended up in a tie that determination of winner was decided by coin toss

Bernie won the popular vote in Iowa, but that didn't quite translate to a delegate win. Close enough. IOWA's importance in elevating a Democratic candidate is mostly symbolic.

Hanlon's razor: "Never attribute to malice that which can be adequately explained by stupidity"

And where the Iowa caucus is concerned, there has been plenty of stupidity/incompetence to go around:

"Even after the initial fiasco with the reporting, Iowa Democratic Party has continued to release false and error-ridden data, casting doubt on the authenticity of the results in such a tight race. On Wednesday, the party had to correct a batch of data it released incorrectly showing some candidates winning votes and state-delegate equivalents where they had not."

https://www.businessinsider.com/iowa-caucus-2020-live-results-vote-counts-updates-2020-2

The Gallant Pig Man wrote:

Furthermore, the fact is that Bernie's people fought to keep the caucus system in Iowa because they thought it would improve their chances of winning; they believe they are better at turning people out. It's not their fault that the Iowa Democratic Party and the DNC totally screwed up the reporting process, but people who support democracy shouldn't be supporting the caucus system. The caucus never should have happened in the first place, so the Sanders campaign shares some of the blame.

That's totally wrong.

The fact is that Bernie Sanders, his staff and supporters successfully worked to have the popular vote publicized in Iowa and therefore no longer kept secret from the public as it used to be previously. Also, they have stated that the total popular vote should be the sole criteria for deciding the delegates, NOT the caucuses. Of course the Sanders campaign would rather there be a primary, because the caucuses make it harder for people to attend and to have their votes counted. A primary would favor the Sanders campaign probably much more than the others.

That Bernie won the popular vote by 6,000 people, and by 2,500 in the second round, yet someone else has about the same number of delegates is totally ridiculous, another example of the DNC purposely trying to change people's votes.

Bib #1 wrote:

rojo wrote:

So I guess what was happening was I was seeing the delegate count before and now am seeing the total vote count. So funny. Many dems can't stand the electoral college in recent years and now it's popping up at the state level. Here is the vote counts.

1st Round 2nd Round

Sanders 43,671 24.8 45,826 26.6 562 12

Buttigieg 37,557 21.3 43,195 25.0 564 13

So Sanders got 16.2% more votes than Buttigieg in the 1st round and somehow lost the delegate count?

The way I interpret it is that Bernie is the first choice for a lot more people, but not the second or third or fourth choice of the folks who prefer someone else as their first choice. Short for you either love him, or you don’t want him.

Senator Sanders was preferred candidate in 1st round. Once preferences (I won't even call them votes) were reallocated in second round, Senator Sanders was still the preferred candidate. You may have heard about complicated Iowa Caucus math. Preferences in rural areas are weighted stronger than preferences in urban areas. That is why D.N.C. Chairman Tom Perez flew into Iowa. Senator Sanders' Campaign caught calculation errors. You may have heard of candidates in 2019/2020 or previous elections bragging about visiting all 99 counties in Iowa. Iowa Caucus want candidates to visit/spend money in the entire state. The theory: If it were one person one vote in Iowa, candidates, would most likely spend the vast majority of their time in Ames, Des Moines and Iowa City.

Truth b told2 wrote:

Treadhead. wrote:

Staunch defense of Rush Limbaugh, far right conspiracy theories, Rojo your bias is showing.

I find it odd that so many trump supporters jump so quickly to conspiracy theories about Bernie being cheated.

And seriously, if you support Trump you have already lost credibility regarding appreciation for the truth.

It’s not a conspiracy.

Bernie got screwed!