Had a millenial turn down a raise today

Without knowing more about the employee, it's hard to judge the 6% compared to the 13%.

When he said the number "sticking in his head" was 13%, obviously this was a terrible choice of phrasing, but what he meant was:

a. I want all that I can get, and based on my research I think that I could eke out 13% to get to the top earning level considering my skills, occupation, and location.

(In this situation, they want to be at the top. Greedy, but nothing wrong with that.)

OR

b. I am embarrassed to tell my friends and former classmates with similar careers what I earn because they all make 20-50% more than I do. I really like where I work, but I just can't justify staying for the 6% raise when I could easily get 15-40% more simply by landing a new job.

Some employers would certainly delude themselves into thinking that "a." must be the answer when "b." is the true answer.

Bro, don't just let him walk. Start a Kickstarter to see if you can pull the 13% raise off.

Let him walk. Everyone is replaceable.

Here's the thing that you have to understand.. at this point, even if he does accept the 6%, he's GOING to leave for something that pays more, since you won't give it to him. Whether he finds this in the next month or three or six, he's going to leave. Cut your losses, be happy he didn't accept the 6% and realize he just saved the company money.

So op is pissed the employer counter offered?

Grow up, this is business not personal.

I literally just did this last month when my company had our annual raises.

I'm a Civil Engineer. Just passed my PE exam.

I was offered a 6% raise at the end of the year. I was told that was the high end for raises at my company. I felt that I should have seen a much more significant increase (upwards of 15% based on what I was being paid and based on what a PE with 4-5 years of experience is worth on the open market right now).

I knew for a fact that if I left my company, I could pull in at least 5 job offers with higher salaries within a week. This isn't a brag about me. It's a statement about the current job market and demand for mid-level Civil Engineers in my area. I also know for a fact that my company has had job openings for 2 engineers at my level that they haven't been able to fill for at least 3 months.

I thanked my manager for my raise and left (Friday). Monday morning, I asked to meet with him again to discuss my compensation. I laid everything above out to him. I basically said that I appreciated the raise, but feel like I was being undervalued. I told him what I thought I was worth, and asked if he could re-consider.

He came back 3 hours later with a higher number (13%). He said he actually appreciated that I had this discussion with him. He said he didn't want to lose me, and that this is a big reason the company has lost employees at my level in the past. People aren't happy about what they're being paid, so they just up and get a job elsewhere. I really appreciated it, and now I feel adequately valued, with more motivation to keep working hard as I have been all year.

Had he come back and told me there was nothing he could do, or if he had disagreed with what I thought I was worth, I'd have job searched, and I'd be working elsewhere today. The point is, I KNEW I was worth more than what they were paying me, and he agreed. I like where I work, and I want to stay, but I want to feel like I'm being valued appropriately. Asking for raises is part of working professionally. Just because you have worked during a bad economy doesn't mean your employee is wrong for asking a raise during a great one. If you can't handle employees asking for raises (or higher raises), then be prepared for a ton of turnover and a toxic work environment where you have employees feeling under-valued, because that's what you're setting up..

Depends how young he is, but he may be gone soon. I'm 25 and after leaving my first post-college job I got a 50% raise. For a younger worker it almost always makes more sense to go somewhere else than expect a decent raise, since the 1-2 years of experience you give them lets them apply to a completely different tier of job. You just bought yourself a two weeks notice from this guy and the need to go through hiring and training again.

Replace him with a woman. You can pay her 78% of what he was making. Next year you can give her a 13% raise and you'll still be ahead.

My first job after college, into my mid 20s, also had the excuses of "this is all the company can do" or "This is a good raise, you should be happy". All the while, everyone was upset that they were not being compensated well...enough.

I finally got up and looked for a new job after they considered a 5% raise on a low salary was "really good and you won't get better anywhere else". Within a month or two, I picked up a new job making 50% more and they were dumbfounded when I told them I was leaving. Just my first year around and my first raise at my new position was close to 9%. I have access to company sponsored training and certification that will bolster my resume and compensation even further.

A previous poster is right, most companies are still hiring and providing raises with the understanding that people are reeling from the recession. Many employees are sheeple that aren't going to leave their decent job, so they won't make a fuss about a sub-par raise.

Jumping jobs is the best way to get a solid raise and tap into the crazy low unemployment numbers. Since the supply of good workers is so low (they all already have jobs), wages that are offered are higher to attract the right people.

Truth Bomber wrote:

Did a performance review today. Gave the guy a 6% raise for solid performance. He had only been working with us for 9 months. He declined and said he felt like he deserved 13% and that was "the number that was sticking out in his head."

If 6% wasn't enough, why even take the job at all at your current salary?

I guess he will soon be on his way out. But when did people start demanding double digit annual raises? I hope the economy crashes soon to bring these kids back to reality.

Wow 6% is a fantastic raise (unless it came with a promotion, in which case I would also be underwhelmed). I'm expecting 2% this year come raise time, but I wouldn't be surprised if they give me 0% since I started 6 months ago.

6% of what wage exactly? I assume it was minimum wage and the Millennial realized he can't make it work for that.

Millennials saw their parents, neighbors and family that showed loyalty to their long term employers unceremoniously kicked to the curb during the 2008-2009 financial crisis. They also see corporations claim that passing a tax cut package will enable them to hire loads more folks only to see those companies trim staffing or offshore jobs to enhance profits once the tax cuts go into effect. To them, business is nothing more than predatory BS with a candy coating of broken promises and outright lies. They understand that their position is nothing more than a line on someone's budgetary spreadsheet that can and will be trimmed when it is expedient to do so. They feel no loyalty to corporate entities. They are not good little groveling drones that produce 20% more each year and just take what single digit pittance "The Man" offers.

They are smarter in this regards than Boomers and gutsier than Gen X. They expect the knife in the back but, they will milk the arrangement as best they can.

Truth Bomber wrote:

Did a performance review today. Gave the guy a 6% raise for solid performance. He had only been working with us for 9 months. He declined and said he felt like he deserved 13% and that was "the number that was sticking out in his head."

If 6% wasn't enough, why even take the job at all at your current salary?

I guess he will soon be on his way out. But when did people start demanding double digit annual raises? I hope the economy crashes soon to bring these kids back to reality.

A 6% raise after 9 months of work is a pretty good offer, but I can see why they would decline as it shows a lack of proper growth in the long term.

Let's assume this employee is making 50k/yr and works a diligent 2000hrs/yr (40hrs per week for 50 weeks; 2 weeks removed to account for sick days, holidays, time off ect) and overtime isn't a factor. That is going to be around $25/hr for pay. A 6% raise is going to net them an extra $3000 per year, which isn't bad as a large sum but in truth that is only an extra $1.5/hr. That increase wouldn't help their life at all. As the salary goes up, the scale becomes worse. A person making 100k/yr, working their ass off, and offered a $6000 pay increase per year would laugh at that and go find another job.

If you actually valued this employee and the hard work he did over 9 months, you would've offered a 10% raise or guaranteed them another raise of 4-5% in 6-8 months if the work effort stayed exceptional. The employee demanding a 13% raise after 9 months was silly and entitled, but you need to realize people aren't going to bust their ass for thousands of hours for only an extra $60 per week.

Would be an interesting story if it actually happened.

It's a strong job market and called bargaining. Millennials see their friends sticking their necks out and being rewarded so they think "hey, I should be doing this".

When the market is in a recession it's the employer who goes "sorry no raise this year". It's just the dynamics of the market.

Don't let it bother you, not worth wasting your time over. I got temporarily angry about a person making a ridiculous salary given his abilities then realized there are plenty of people out there like that, why get obsessed? If you have ever worked in Human Resources you learn very quickly not to care.

That is beautifully summarized. As a disillusioned millennial myself, I just disagree with my older relatives who think loyalty will be rewarded. I see how they are treated these days, and I think they're just too proud to admit things have changed and now they are suckers.

Also the title of this thread was unsurprisingly misleading. Can we get a petition started to change the thread title to "Had a millennial enter into a wage negotiation with me today and it hurt my pride and offended my worldview"

Truth Bomber wrote:

Did a performance review today. Gave the guy a 6% raise for solid performance. He had only been working with us for 9 months. He declined and said he felt like he deserved 13% and that was "the number that was sticking out in his head."

If 6% wasn't enough, why even take the job at all at your current salary?

I guess he will soon be on his way out. But when did people start demanding double digit annual raises? I hope the economy crashes soon to bring these kids back to reality.

I'll be honest if he was good then 6% was insulting. When you first come out of college you are pretty cheap salary-wise. The high performers should get double-digit raises the first couple of years. An employee who has 25 years of experience should be getting 2-4% raises a year. But for a kid right out of college you need different standards. He could likely make the jump somewhere else and get what he wants.

This lack of understanding of compensating these young developing employees is a big problem for employers and its why everyone out of college is jumping around every 2-3 years. Employers aren't getting the same value because they constantly have to restaff and train new employees when the could have just paid up the first time. It's a good economy a demand for good talent is high.

Truth Bomber wrote:

If 6% wasn't enough, why even take the job at all at your current salary?

I guess he will soon be on his way out. But when did people start demanding double digit annual raises? I hope the economy crashes soon to bring these kids back to reality.

If this is your response to something so trivial in the workplace then you probably already know you're deeply insecure in your role and abilities, your employees know it and they trash talk you on the regular.

Honestly salaried employees shouldn't be getting raises within their first year (unless some extreme circumstance). They signed for the job at a specific salary. They should be comfortable at that salary for at least a few years.

I don't really think you can even get a great feel for an employee in less than a year, unless you have some very specific, objective measurements of performance.

Be glad I'm not your boss? wrote:

Honestly salaried employees shouldn't be getting raises within their first year (unless some extreme circumstance). They signed for the job at a specific salary. They should be comfortable at that salary for at least a few years.

I don't really think you can even get a great feel for an employee in less than a year, unless you have some very specific, objective measurements of performance.

have fun collecting all the low-end talent.