Former World Record Holder in Marathon Wilson Kipsang Provisionally Suspended

El Keniano wrote:

I agree 100% NativeSon. Let's wait and see how it plays out. There are two sides to a book and we haven't heard Kipsang's side yet. However, my reaction to the Kiptum bust was utter disgust. But Kipsang who we all know and love? Too painful. Why would he do this when his career is all but over and he's no longer competitive? I'll lay low until we get an answer.

a) Kipsang's story has been heard, and judged to be "fraudulent information", according to article 2.5 and his team's post.

b) Do you really think he just started doping now, "when his career is all but over and he's no longer competitive"? Or, do you really think he coincidentally missed three tests and then provided "fraudulent information" by mistake?

He's self-coached. Not enough know-how to avoid positives.

Stablebullshitter. wrote:

Distance Fan26.2 wrote:

Surprised how inactive this thread is. There's only four bigger names than Kipsang in distance running.

We're all waiting with bated breath for the next Stablemaster prescient revelation.

How is Wilson's head? Have you spent time with him in hospital?

I thought not...

On a previous thread, we chatted about RunCzech and an article was published in a Spanish publication. and I said there was more coming; it's coming, now...

El Keniano wrote:

Hopefully, when the dust settles, the Kenyan and the Kenyan government wakes up and gets strict like Ethiopia, we won't have foreigners posting on Letsrun from Kenya anymore. Some good will have come out of this.

Apologies to sound like a jerk when I say this, but aren't you the one that constantly points out others being racist and prejudiced? Don't you consider xenophobia on par with that? It's not healthy to think that every non-Kenyan coming to iten/eldoret, etc is out to get you. Rather, that's much more the exception. Please don't take that as a lecture or reprimand; but rather, I'd just encourage you to ponder that.

The Stablemaster wrote:

Stablebullshitter. wrote:

We're all waiting with bated breath for the next Stablemaster prescient revelation.

How is Wilson's head? Have you spent time with him in hospital?

I thought not...

We're still waiting.

casual obsever wrote:

El Keniano wrote:

I agree 100% NativeSon. Let's wait and see how it plays out. There are two sides to a book and we haven't heard Kipsang's side yet. However, my reaction to the Kiptum bust was utter disgust. But Kipsang who we all know and love? Too painful. Why would he do this when his career is all but over and he's no longer competitive? I'll lay low until we get an answer.

a) Kipsang's story has been heard, and judged to be "fraudulent information", according to article 2.5 and his team's post.

b) Do you really think he just started doping now, "when his career is all but over and he's no longer competitive"? Or, do you really think he coincidentally missed three tests and then provided "fraudulent information" by mistake?

According to the rules, a whereabouts failure can be a missed test or a filing failure.

This could be three missed tests, or two, or one, or zero.

He was not suspended for possession or use of banned substances or methods.

He could have started doping now, or started before, or not at all.

It would be hard for us to say conclusively, before we have heard Kipsang's defense.

This ^ is classic head in the sand stuff. Seppelt looks at the blood data and sees rampant cheating and so he visits the country and finds easy access to drugs with people willing to confess to cheating, so he reports about it. Subsequent failures just seem to strengthen his case. The El Keniano argument, copy Ethiopia and don't let any transparency into your country.

rekrunner wrote:

casual obsever wrote:

a) Kipsang's story has been heard, and judged to be "fraudulent information", according to article 2.5 and his team's post.

b) Do you really think he just started doping now, "when his career is all but over and he's no longer competitive"? Or, do you really think he coincidentally missed three tests and then provided "fraudulent information" by mistake?

According to the rules, a whereabouts failure can be a missed test or a filing failure.

This could be three missed tests, or two, or one, or zero.

He was not suspended for possession or use of banned substances or methods.

He could have started doping now, or started before, or not at all.

It would be hard for us to say conclusively, before we have heard Kipsang's defense.

Rekrunnerbot has starting spanning.

I think we all know the answer to the question. Well everybody here except Cleo.

Behind a paywall - maybe somebody with a Times subscription could copy and paste the entire article for us?

Why ban a country that is clearly upping its game in terms of testing?

Footinguista wrote:

Why ban a country that is clearly upping its game in terms of testing?

+1

Subway Surfers wrote:

Rekrunnerbot has starting spanning.

Yes, as per usual, defending the accused cheat with obfuscating via trying to re-write the rules.

rekrunner wrote:

According to the rules, a whereabouts failure can be a missed test or a filing failure.

"a missed test..."? Nice try, but no, whereabouts failures can be three missed tests or three filing failures or a combination thereof:

WADA wrote:

2.4 Whereabouts Failures

Any combination of three missed tests and/or filing failures, as defined in the International Standard for Testing and Investigations, within a twelve-month period by an Athlete in a Registered Testing Pool.

And he already started the spamming yesterday, with changing 2.5's "providing

fraudulent information to an Anti-Doping Organization" into "information provided about the whereabouts failure" - conveniently leaving out the "fraudulent".

ex-runner wrote:

Drug Religion wrote:

Really? Raises the limit of thermoregulation? How does that work genius? By magic?Just how deeply entrenched is your Drug Religious belief? And how willing are you to enforce it on young athletes?

What makes you think that body temperature ceiling or energy availability and usage limits has anything to do with current marathon performance? Maybe if humans were running 1:57 that might come into play. Maybe.

At the performance levels we are talking about, greater oxygen availability and uptake will improve performance, even elite athletes like Bekele have shown that they can struggle with acidosis effects in the marathon.

Anabolic androgenic steroids have been shown to improve submaximal running endurance also, and athletes like Matthew Kisorio were caught using just that.

The body is constantly thermoregulating. Unfortunately exercise physiologists didn't learn this when they were evolving their mad theses about creating superhumans with various interventions.

You would be amazed if you realized just how ignorant the vast majority of those who shout the loudest about drugs really are about how the human body actually works. But that would require you to actually want to learn. So feel free to carry on believing that the laws of physics have nothing to do with oxygen uptake.

You don’t understand the physics, Jon.

Leave the. Science to the Scientists.

Physics doesn't apply to running does it? You would know wouldn't you?

Yup, no such thing as thermoregulation. It's just something some weirdos made up, right?

Drug Religion wrote:

Physics doesn't apply to running does it? You would know wouldn't you?

Yup, no such thing as thermoregulation. It's just something some weirdos made up, right?

It does but you don’t understand physiology. Which I why you have zero qualifications in the subject.

That’s why you’ve never progressed beyond these plaintive whining posts repeated endlessly.

casual obsever wrote:

Subway Surfers wrote:

Rekrunnerbot has starting spanning.

Yes, as per usual, defending the accused cheat with obfuscating via trying to re-write the rules.

rekrunner wrote:

According to the rules, a whereabouts failure can be a missed test or a filing failure.

"a missed test..."? Nice try, but no, whereabouts failures can be three missed tests or three filing failures or a combination thereof:

WADA wrote:

2.4 Whereabouts Failures

Any combination of three missed tests and/or filing failures, as defined in the International Standard for Testing and Investigations, within a twelve-month period by an Athlete in a Registered Testing Pool.

And he already started the spamming yesterday, with changing 2.5's "providing

fraudulent information to an Anti-Doping Organization" into "information provided about the whereabouts failure" - conveniently leaving out the "fraudulent".

Everything I wrote is correct. Your distinctions add no meaningful value, but only serve to obfuscate your omission:

- I wrote "whereabouts failure" (singular) while you wrote "whereabouts failures" (plural). In the code we can see how WADA describes a singular whereabouts failure: "7.1.2 Results management in relation to a potential Whereabouts Failure (a filing failure or a missed test) ... "

- I also wrote: "This could be three missed tests, or two, or one, or zero."

- For "tampering", I paraphrased the Voltare statement, which also did not use the word "fraudulent" rather than looking up the article in the code: "The accusation regarding alleged/attempted tampering (article 2.5) concerns an explanation that was given in the results management process regarding a possible Whereabouts Failure"

- Since "fraudulent" is in the article, it is implicit

It was not unexpected you accuse me of "defending the accused cheat", simply for acknowledging that he was provisionally suspended, under articles 2.4 and 2.5 (and not 2.1 or 2.2), and providing another possibility, that of one or more filing failures, that you failed to mention in your response to El Keniano. This is how you troll.

The Stablemaster wrote:

Stablebullshitter. wrote:

We're all waiting with bated breath for the next Stablemaster prescient revelation.

How is Wilson's head? Have you spent time with him in hospital?

I thought not...

What ?! Is Kipsang in hospital now or are you referring to his recent car accident ? And you visited him now/then ? Try to be more clear when you post, thanks.