Man who came up with sub-2 idea, Yannis Pitsiladis, isn't a fan of it anymore: "I think it is all about the shoe now"

rojo wrote:

"I think it is all about the shoe now. My life has been dedicated to the sport's integrity, but this is the complete opposite. My advisors tell me not to be negative when I talk about it but it's not about being negative; it's being accurate."

https://twitter.com/Scienceofsport/status/1182892839769755649

Full article here:

https://www.thetimes.co.uk/article/professor-yannis-pitsiladis-eliud-kipchoge-will-break-the-two-hour-marathon-barrier-but-not-in-a-fair-way-pgjbffwkq

He 'came up' with the idea of running a marathon in under two hours...? What?

So now he doesn't like it since he can't profit from it. For shame!

"After years of targeting the two-hour marathon barrier, re-mortgaging his house and even spending the children’s college fund on his obsession..."

Why/how was this guy spending money on this? Was he paying for coaching, training camps, sponsoring athletes? Can't read the full article due to a paywall, but this does not sound like a person who has his head on straight.

Does he think only Abebe Bikila running barefoot through the streets of Rome should be considered?

Jmujayhawk wrote:

"After years of targeting the two-hour marathon barrier, re-mortgaging his house and even spending the children’s college fund on his obsession..."

Why/how was this guy spending money on this? Was he paying for coaching, training camps, sponsoring athletes? Can't read the full article due to a paywall, but this does not sound like a person who has his head on straight.

Sounds like he lost control of the experiment so now he's knocking it. He would've known from Day 1 it was all about getting every legal edge you could get - why would he draw the line at a specific type of shoe technology?

Rojo you got to call this guy out. Breaking 2 was also about the shoe! He draws the line at 4%? 4% shoe is ok but a 5% shoe is not ok?

Bottom line is that with the same tools (and more shady stuff from Breaking2), his team failed and these guys made it.

Integrity? It's fvcking bouncy shoes!!!

you can't compare times with lousy shoes with these good shoes.

i'm interested in wearing great shoes and not getting injured.

to hell with the old shoes.

go ahead wojo and give yourself the 2740 10k if you had the right shoes.

this dude yannis came up with the sub 2 idea?

everyone came up with the sub 2 idea, once they started going under 205

ex-runner wrote:

He 'came up' with the idea of running a marathon in under two hours...? What?

Nobody else had realized that the world record was approaching two hours.

Epstein wrote about Pittsiladis in The Sports Gene.

According to that he's been researching genetics and sports ability since at least 2001.

I guess he wanted to see it done through natural ability and training.

Seriously now wrote:

Rojo you got to call this guy out. Breaking 2 was also about the shoe! He draws the line at 4%? 4% shoe is ok but a 5% shoe is not ok?

Bottom line is that with the same tools (and more shady stuff from Breaking2), his team failed and these guys made it.

Integrity? It's fvcking bouncy shoes!!!

So you put anyone in the shoes and then they can run 1:59:40 closing in 2:40? Good to know. I’m guessing you couldnt run a 2:40k with roller blades on.

Pitsiladis is a great scientist - over the last two decades, the guy has made incredible contributions to our understanding of running physiology, from genetics to biomechanics to anthropology. He launched the original “sub-2” project before Nike (publicly) did, but with a focus on trying to develop and harness physiology. He even had a project where he was trying to identify promising teenagers in Kenya and Ethiopia early on, to start training them optimally early (essentially the Ingebrigtsen approach on East Africans) understanding that no one today could physiologically do it clean.

He was critical but cordial about Nike’s breaking 2 project when that all happened, and now it sounds like the patience is gone. It’s a bummer, as his work driving towards the “clean and fair sub2” has been incredible.

This sub-2 controversy can be put to rest if Kipchoge decides to dope or use EPO.

http://giphygifs.s3.amazonaws.com/media/84CRvhy2DJlwA/giphy.gif

rojo wrote:

"I think it is all about the shoe now. My life has been dedicated to the sport's integrity, but this is the complete opposite. My advisors tell me not to be negative when I talk about it but it's not about being negative; it's being accurate."

https://twitter.com/Scienceofsport/status/1182892839769755649

Full article here:

https://www.thetimes.co.uk/article/professor-yannis-pitsiladis-eliud-kipchoge-will-break-the-two-hour-marathon-barrier-but-not-in-a-fair-way-pgjbffwkq

Just sour grapes that he wasn't invited to be a part of it. He backed the wrong horse and company.

This "shoe made the difference" argument is just beyond stupid. Why didn't we say the same when Kimetto ran in the boosts (which were also shown to have a noticeable benefit for efficiency), hell, why not just make everyone run the marathon barefoot? The very purpose of cushioning in shoes is to reduce impact and increase energy efficiency, why do we complain when a company manages to improve on that?

TheTrueKing wrote:

This "shoe made the difference" argument is just beyond stupid. Why didn't we say the same when Kimetto ran in the boosts (which were also shown to have a noticeable benefit for efficiency), hell, why not just make everyone run the marathon barefoot? The very purpose of cushioning in shoes is to reduce impact and increase energy efficiency, why do we complain when a company manages to improve on that?

It seems shoe companies spend very little in r&d and a lot on marketing. When one company bothers to spend some money on r&d, we get a shoe like the 4%. Everyone other company is fine with settling on selling shoes to joe jogger.

I read the Sports Gene and who is Yannis Pitsiladis? He went to school outside the US. His "degrees" don't count.

Wolf's Bane wrote:

TheTrueKing wrote:

This "shoe made the difference" argument is just beyond stupid. Why didn't we say the same when Kimetto ran in the boosts (which were also shown to have a noticeable benefit for efficiency), hell, why not just make everyone run the marathon barefoot? The very purpose of cushioning in shoes is to reduce impact and increase energy efficiency, why do we complain when a company manages to improve on that?

It seems shoe companies spend very little in r&d and a lot on marketing. When one company bothers to spend some money on r&d, we get a shoe like the 4%. Everyone other company is fine with settling on selling shoes to joe jogger.

Very good point.

Dril wrote:

Seriously now wrote:

Rojo you got to call this guy out. Breaking 2 was also about the shoe! He draws the line at 4%? 4% shoe is ok but a 5% shoe is not ok?

Bottom line is that with the same tools (and more shady stuff from Breaking2), his team failed and these guys made it.

Integrity? It's fvcking bouncy shoes!!!

So you put anyone in the shoes and then they can run 1:59:40 closing in 2:40? Good to know. I’m guessing you couldnt run a 2:40k with roller blades on.

And after you run in inline skates we can skate in running flats!