Lonah Chemtai Salpeter of Israel runs 30:05 in Tilburg 10K

PassTheViolin wrote:

She was staying at Kerrio View in January. If that doesn't scream doping nothing does. Most would claim that she's training her ass off at altitude . Doing repeats with some of the fastest women in the world at Tambach. But that wouldn't be any fun

A lot of athletes from different athletes come to Kerio View and doesn't mean that they're doping. For example Marcin Lewandowski was ther with his training group this year.

Renato Canova wrote:

Do you know Lonah and Dan had a baby in the meantime ? Do you know she ran only twice per week till when they married, and the longest "jog" was 30' ? Do you know she had to stop breast-feeding in order to run Olympics, and for that reason she felt a lot of pain during the race and had to stop ?

So, don't do the same mistake of Subway. You can run every year the same race, but when are not trained of course you run very much slower than when in good training (and she already ran, before the start of the collaboration between me and Dan, 32'43", well different from 35'01").

You have to look what there is BEHIND any performance, something the most part of people don't know, if not involved in this type of athletics full time.

Again, you make good points but don't address the missing ingredient - what was the special thing about her training, that allowed her to progress continually, without injury and reach the highest level of the world?

There are more highly talented female runners who can run 35-37 min 10k off little training but they don't get to 30 min 10k or even 32 min 10k even if the train a lot (160+k a week).

What are some sessions that Salpeter did when she was not in current shape, but transitioning from a 35-36 min 10k runner to a 32 min and then to 30-31 min? For example, number of workouts per week, volume and intensity. That would be the interesting thing to know and might help to legitimize her performances in the eyes of suspicious forum users.

Alll wrote:

PassTheViolin wrote:

She was staying at Kerrio View in January. If that doesn't scream doping nothing does. Most would claim that she's training her ass off at altitude . Doing repeats with some of the fastest women in the world at Tambach. But that wouldn't be any fun

A lot of athletes from different athletes come to Kerio View and doesn't mean that they're doping. For example Marcin Lewandowski was ther with his training group this year.

Just because someone is Polish, doesn’t mean they’re clean. And, before you call me stupid again, I acknowledge that staying at Kerio View doesn’t automatically mean that an athlete is dirty. But, it should raise some suspicion, considering the sub-par doping control and sketchy pharmacies in Iten.

Good point, Phil. There are lots of women in the NCAA running in that range for the 10k off of low MPW. By Canova’s argument, the US should be producing Salpeters left and right, if those runners would just run more. What’s suspicious about Salpeter, is that she’s been competing for years, and suddenly goes from being sub-elite to being one of the best female runners in history.

Alll wrote:

Geography matters wrote:

Israel is not in Europe.

I don't know why Israel's teams also participate in European championships. That's weird.

I think it's because they weren't allowed to compete in the Asian Championships, so the European Championships organizers let them in.

Interesting how she runs this fast on the roads and dominates, yet has only run 14:59 (14th at the London DL, 4 seconds slower than the first half of this race) and 31:15 (2nd at the night of 10k pbs, 7 seconds behind Steph Twell) on the track this season. Maybe mentally she’s bad with running a lot of laps? Kind of a weird contrast in performances.

It is almost impossible to exaggerate how extraordinary Salpeter's achievements are. I think there is no precedence for someone "getting serious" about running 10k-marathon in their late 20s after childbirth and within less than three years hitting marks that put one within the top 10-20 performers of all time. So while the suspicions may be premature they are very understandable.

It is OBVIOUS this woman is doping.

OBVIOUSLY you are going to claim otherwise.

Nobody goes from 2:42 marathon to 30 minute 10k without doping. Period.

When I was running 27 miles per week average for my marathon training, I ran 2:53. When I was running 70 miles a week average, I ran 2:41 as my PR.

Your girl is on drugs. She’s a cheater, and you are a cheater too. IMO.

@Renato

Is there a reason why Lonah's track races were quite mediocre this year? I mean, 14:59/31:15 (beaten by Steph Twell) is obviously much weaker than 30:05 now 1-2 months later. Thanks!

Priscialla Welch of the UK, was a smoker, never did a stitch of exercise till she was 34, won the New York Marathon at age 42 and ran 2:28:54 at the time breaking the British record. She ran a best of 2:26:51

Lonah was a jogger with no program and no coaching. She has the talent, as can be seen.

PrZ wrote:

Interesting how she runs this fast on the roads and dominates, yet has only run 14:59 (14th at the London DL, 4 seconds slower than the first half of this race) and 31:15 (2nd at the night of 10k pbs, 7 seconds behind Steph Twell) on the track this season. Maybe mentally she’s bad with running a lot of laps? Kind of a weird contrast in performances.

Less testing on the roads. It’s harder to be fully juiced on the track.

This is due to boycott pressure by Arab/Muslim countries. Israel cannot compete in Asian Championships

There always has to be one Jew Hater in the bunch. What sort's of privileges does Israel get? Being surrounded by those who would destroy her? Israelis see what they do to each other in Syria, Libya, Yemen, Iraq to name just a few. Israel has built an absolutely amazing country and a world leader in many spheres despite enormous obstacles.

No, you are just a terrible runner

canadian wrote:

There always has to be one Jew Hater in the bunch. What sort's of privileges does Israel get? Being surrounded by those who would destroy her? Israelis see what they do to each other in Syria, Libya, Yemen, Iraq to name just a few. Israel has built an absolutely amazing country and a world leader in many spheres despite enormous obstacles.

Aren't most Israelis european in ancestry and not middle eastern? A lot of them are from Russia.

canadian wrote:

Priscialla Welch of the UK, was a smoker, never did a stitch of exercise till she was 34, won the New York Marathon at age 42 and ran 2:28:54 at the time breaking the British record. She ran a best of 2:26:51

Lonah was a jogger with no program and no coaching. She has the talent, as can be seen.

Cilla took up running and had a steady progression, not 6 years of mediocrity and then bam. Canova and his athletes are suspect, no question about it. Do not trust his opinion. The Italians have a history of cheating.

Every time i read comments about performances that for me are nothing else than good (not ecceptional), I find new posters (or same posters with new nick name) looking at doping only.

I think never these people can be educated to know WHAT IS TRAINING, its effects and the performances everybody can achieve, if interested, using in proper way right methodologies.

The problem is that everybody thinks to have talent, to use the best training, to do the maximal volume, to know, perfectly, how the human body works under training, to have the biggest possible motivation.... and at the end runs 10 km 5-7 minutes slower than the best athletes.....

So, in order not to accept the fact that they are LOSERS as top athletes (why, simply, they don't accept this like a FACT, and start to enjoy running at their level ?), of course the only explanation for the performances of other runners is that are doped.

People are not able to recognize what is TALENT, what is TRAINING, what is PROFESSIONALISM, which are the MENTAL STIMULI, what is the effect of ALTITUDE, etc......

Speaking about something you don't know, with the PRESUMPTION to know, is ALWAYS a clear signal of stupidity, and is the normal "status" of the most part of posters.

There are not "special" ingredients, but different quantity and different quality of them.

Till before the birth of the baby, the volume per week was of 30-50 km, and the longest run at max 10 km jogging.

From 2016, the volume grew step by step (currently is around 200 km per week), she started to introduce in her training long intervals, the total volume of intervals in one session grew from 4 km till 20 km, the speed of "tempo" run, at the beginning of 2016, about 3'50" for 12 km and 3'30" for 6 km, gradually increased, the same the distance, following a scheme like this :

A) 6 km at 3'30" / 12 km at 3'50" / 20 km at 4'

B) After 6 months : 6 km at 3'20" / 12 km at 3'35" / 20 km at 3'45" / 25 km at 4'

C) Next year : 6 km at 3'10" / 12 km at 3'20" / 18 km at 3'30" / 24 km at 3'35" / 30 km at 3'50" / 40 km at 4'

D) After 6 months : 4 km at 3' / 8 km at 3'10" / 12 km at 3'15" / 20 km at 3'20" / 25 km at 3'25" / 30 km at 3'30" / 35 km at 3'40" / 40 km at 3'50"

E) At the end of the year : 4 km at 3' / 8 km at 3'10" / 12 km at 3'15" / 20 km at 3'20" / 25 km at 3'25" / 30 km at 3'30" / 35 km at 3'35" / 40 km at 3'40"

So, her training phylosophy was very clear :

A) Never she had to lose what already had (this means to continue to use speed training, also if the main goal was to extend the ability to last at the pace she already was able to run in the shorter distance).

This means that, when she was able to run 5000m in 15'30", the goal for the next season was to extend that ability till 10 km (in this case 31') at the same speed. The same for all the distances : 10 km in 31'40" became 15 km in 47', and HM in 66' ; HM in 1:10' became full marathon in 2:20', and at the same time short distances improved, because she maintains the training of speed, in higher quantity than before.

System not different from the training of Sondre, who improved in 10000m looking at Marathon, already with elements of Marathon in the current training (he went for 40 km in Sestriere 10 days before his 10000m).

People are surprised because their training is ridiculous, normally with volume and intensity very far from the level they could use, if really motivated ; and, when there is high volume, the intensity doesn't exist (people thinking to follow Lydiard, but never knowing and understanding what Lydiard REALLY did), or, when there is good intensity, the volume is good for children 12 years old.

Running is running, there are not secret exercises that can increase at high level the specific endurance. But total volume, length of single runs, density of training, speed of short tests, speed of long tests, recovery, how to mix the different distances, modulation, are all elements at the base of any improvement.

The final solution is if you know or not the methodology, if you are serious or not in training, if you have or not continuity, if you are or not tough with yourself : these are the qualities for running at the top, when you have talent, not doping and, sorry, not pseudo-scientific approaches, that can only create confusion in the minds of the athletes, whose main quality is to be able to train and to compete with high levels of pain and sufference, without giving up.

She done gone full Cherono, wink wink.