On Norwegian TV2 they had a report from Dullstrom where they ran 300m intervals at 43-45s. Your friend was having a day off maybe?
By the way Henrik complained to his brothers that he found 43s a little fast, and Jakob instantly responded that it was like walking in the park.
That was probably a way of progressing the hills to the flats, starting more track-specific work. 250m hills takes about the same time as 300m flat, it's just a different emphasis. I don't know if they do long (600-1000m) reps at 1500 race pace in comepetition season, but I do know they use 300s at that pace as a way of dialing in the exact rhythm.
Semiler wrote:
On Norwegian TV2 they had a report from Dullstrom where they ran 300m intervals at 43-45s. Your friend was having a day off maybe?
By the way Henrik complained to his brothers that he found 43s a little fast, and Jakob instantly responded that it was like walking in the park.
How long ago was this? He was only there for 6 weeks himself. This was the lead up to the 2016 trials. He went out there to follow Henrik and Filip at the time as Jakob wasn’t yet a superstar.
Former Sub 14:00 wrote:
Semiler wrote:
On Norwegian TV2 they had a report from Dullstrom where they ran 300m intervals at 43-45s. Your friend was having a day off maybe?
By the way Henrik complained to his brothers that he found 43s a little fast, and Jakob instantly responded that it was like walking in the park.
How long ago was this? He was only there for 6 weeks himself. This was the lead up to the 2016 trials. He went out there to follow Henrik and Filip at the time as Jakob wasn’t yet a superstar.
Sorry, not the Trials but in 2017. He contacted them after a botched trials.
Semiler wrote:
On Norwegian TV2 they had a report from Dullstrom where they ran 300m intervals at 43-45s. Your friend was having a day off maybe?
By the way Henrik complained to his brothers that he found 43s a little fast, and Jakob instantly responded that it was like walking in the park.
The guy said he was there 6 weeks during a transitional period between base and race specific phases. Ie hills and not track work.
Former Sub-14,
Your friend sounds like he really overtrained. Overextended on the workout days and slightly higher mileage on the easy days, including the long run. The schedule is already pretty high mileage (160km+). To try to add anything more is insane.
Saturday Long Run? wrote:
Wouldn’t they lose the benefits of the workouts if they do the same exact thing week after week? I think Canova has posted that a workout loses its effectiveness with each repeated time you do it or something like that. Doing months and months of threshold work doesn’t lose its effectiveness as a training pace?
Listen now carefully! Canova thinks he know almost everything about training.At this point he is wrong! At this point it's much better listen to Salazar.
Your head coach wrote:
Saturday Long Run? wrote:
Wouldn’t they lose the benefits of the workouts if they do the same exact thing week after week? I think Canova has posted that a workout loses its effectiveness with each repeated time you do it or something like that. Doing months and months of threshold work doesn’t lose its effectiveness as a training pace?
Listen now carefully! Canova thinks he know almost everything about training.At this point he is wrong! At this point it's much better listen to Salazar.
Link to Canova claiming he knows it all? As far which coach is better, I would go with Canova. But again I have read a lot more about Canova training(mainly because there's a lot more info about it available) than Salazar.
BergLaufer wrote:
Your head coach wrote:
Listen now carefully! Canova thinks he know almost everything about training.At this point he is wrong! At this point it's much better listen to Salazar.
Link to Canova claiming he knows it all? As far which coach is better, I would go with Canova. But again I have read a lot more about Canova training(mainly because there's a lot more info about it available) than Salazar.
Of course he has never told that he knows it all.But here you see a concrete example that in this point he is wrong.And then you have Salazar ; '' My belief is that the human body likes continuity.It responds well to repetitions.''
Former Sub 14:00 wrote:
This is what a week looked like for my friend who trained with them:
Monday: 10 miles am + fast striding, 5 miles pm
Tuesday: 5x(6 min on, 90 sec off) @ threshold am, 7x(3 min on, 1 min off) @ threshold pm
Wednesday: 8 miles am, 5 miles pm
Thursday: 3x(10 min on, 2.5 min off) @ threshold am, 4x(8 min on, 2 min off) @ threshold pm
Friday: 9 miles am, 5 miles pm
Saturday: He only got up to 14 hill repeats, the brothers did more. These are on a very gradual hill. It is about ~250m. They go quite fast but still remain with good form. Jog down and go again. He was always toasted on this day (probably from going too hard on threshold and also not being as good over 1500m as them).
Sunday: 18 miles
That's what he did. The brothers generally did less on the M-W-F-Sun. They ran by kilometers and would go like roughly 6-8 miles and their second run would be the same. My friend was a little more traditional and did longer am runs and shorter pm runs. The brothers also didn't really do a "long" run. That run was usually 20 kilometers on Sunday. The last two weeks of the 6 week period he was up there he had to cut back on his long run because it was unsustainable with the aerobic workload + hills he was putting in. The brothers ran their Mon-Fri-Sun at around 6:20-6:30 pace roughly. Their pm session and Wednesday run was very slow and they just went by HR. My friend said it was tough running with them as he felt like he wasn't running smooth on the recovery runs -- too slow.
The weeks never deviated. Pretty much same thing week after week after week..... very monotonous. The striding they do are very fast accelerations. The lack of a long run is startling, but isn't the purpose of a long run to get you aerobically fit? Why the need for that when they are doing so much damn threshold.
It makes sense their Wednesday’s runs are very slow. I can imagine you would need to in order to recover from a double threshold day on Tuesday for another double threshold on Thursday.
Four workouts in three days is what makes their training uniques. Fascinating stuff and certainly seems to be working.
I’m interested in knowing how much recovery they have between the hill reps on Saturdays.
Also, it makes sense they only do a 20k Long Run cause they are focused on the 1500. There’s no need at their level to go over 80 minutes unless you’re training for a marathon.
Exactly, every time they're threshold increases, their threshold pace gets faster a targeting the same 4 mmol lactate level. The benefits are stagnating but that can be offset by increasing the volume of work. Although it is still a threshold workout, Jakob is not running the same workout he did when he was 12. He is running it faster and with more volume.
Your head coach wrote:
BergLaufer wrote:
Link to Canova claiming he knows it all? As far which coach is better, I would go with Canova. But again I have read a lot more about Canova training(mainly because there's a lot more info about it available) than Salazar.
Of course he has never told that he knows it all.But here you see a concrete example that in this point he is wrong.And then you have Salazar ; '' My belief is that the human body likes continuity.It responds well to repetitions.''
The body get's better via adaptation. You do this by changing variables. For runners these variables will include, but not limited to: volume(how much running are you doing?), tempo(various definition, basic principle is running pretty steady rate for a extended period of time), repetitions/intervals etc. Now if you are to plan out one's goal for the next six months. You generally would go through a phase of building up fitness(Canova calls this general preparation phase), next is to get the body to transition from this phase to the next(Canova calls this fundamental preparation phase) and lastly peaking for your goal race(Canova calls this specific preparation phase). This is periodisation and this is how you get the best results.
better through adaptation wrote:
Your head coach wrote:
Of course he has never told that he knows it all.But here you see a concrete example that in this point he is wrong.And then you have Salazar ; '' My belief is that the human body likes continuity.It responds well to repetitions.''
The body get's better via adaptation. You do this by changing variables. For runners these variables will include, but not limited to: volume(how much running are you doing?), tempo(various definition, basic principle is running pretty steady rate for a extended period of time), repetitions/intervals etc. Now if you are to plan out one's goal for the next six months. You generally would go through a phase of building up fitness(Canova calls this general preparation phase), next is to get the body to transition from this phase to the next(Canova calls this fundamental preparation phase) and lastly peaking for your goal race(Canova calls this specific preparation phase). This is periodisation and this is how you get the best results.
Hehe! Not exactly Renato! )) This is not how you get the best results! I know,you belive that your system is the only 'proper training' but here we see another kind of system that is at least as good as yours.I know, it scratches your fingers to write when you or your system is questioned. Anyway, take care my friend.))
Your head coach wrote:
better through adaptation wrote:
The body get's better via adaptation. You do this by changing variables. For runners these variables will include, but not limited to: volume(how much running are you doing?), tempo(various definition, basic principle is running pretty steady rate for a extended period of time), repetitions/intervals etc. Now if you are to plan out one's goal for the next six months. You generally would go through a phase of building up fitness(Canova calls this general preparation phase), next is to get the body to transition from this phase to the next(Canova calls this fundamental preparation phase) and lastly peaking for your goal race(Canova calls this specific preparation phase). This is periodisation and this is how you get the best results.
Hehe! Not exactly Renato! )) This is not how you get the best results! I know,you belive that your system is the only 'proper training' but here we see another kind of system that is at least as good as yours.I know, it scratches your fingers to write when you or your system is questioned. Anyway, take care my friend.))
Hi coach JS! I'm not Canova, though I am honored by it!
Fascinated by the North, I think you’re on to something here.....
So, LRC.... how would the Ingebrigtsen training method look when applied to the marathon? Longer Sunday runs obviously, but would they also reduce the amount of threshold work and add more overall volume, or keep the same threshold workload but just bump up mileage? Interesting to think about.
Anyone want to take a stab at a sample Ingebrigtsen marathon training schedule?
hi coach JS wrote:
Your head coach wrote:
Hehe! Not exactly Renato! )) This is not how you get the best results! I know,you belive that your system is the only 'proper training' but here we see another kind of system that is at least as good as yours.I know, it scratches your fingers to write when you or your system is questioned. Anyway, take care my friend.))
Hi coach JS! I'm not Canova, though I am honored by it!
Hehe! I'm not coach JS,though I'm honored that you believed it! You try to save the 'Old man'. Nice!
I think it would use singles rather than doubles on easy and workout days to get body used to running more at once. More mileage and and 2-2.5 hour long run at least. Similar to tinman's marathon ideas with CV, threshold will still remain central. There could also be more use of continuous threshold tempos instead of interval type threshold, of course at a slower pace.
Your head coach wrote:
hi coach JS wrote:
Hi coach JS! I'm not Canova, though I am honored by it!
Hehe! I'm not coach JS,though I'm honored that you believed it! You try to save the 'Old man'. Nice!
Not a FBI detector, but in bold gives it away.
in this thread we have Canova ,JS ,Salazar ,Schumacher ,Tin-man ,Daniels ,Simmons ,Mackey ,Lydiard ,Coe and Wetmore all posting anonymously i heard
Jgt11 wrote:
I think it would use singles rather than doubles on easy and workout days to get body used to running more at once. More mileage and and 2-2.5 hour long run at least. Similar to tinman's marathon ideas with CV, threshold will still remain central. There could also be more use of continuous threshold tempos instead of interval type threshold, of course at a slower pace.
Lol, Tinman is just a B figure when the BIG elephants dance.