Have a 32:11 10k but only 2:21 for 800. Need advice

1. When you ran 32:11 you were able to run faster than 2:21. 32:11 = 12.5 x 2:34/800. Even with optimal endurance for 32:11 it is 99,99 % impossible to run 32:11 with a maxed out 800 at 2:21. I bet een with crappy speed that you could have run at least 2:15 or so. Or the 10k course was short or aided or...

2. For a 3000 in 8:45 you have to get as comfortable as possible at 70'' per 400. So you have to get there. Start out with a couple 200s and extend it. All the other training has to complement this.

Cheers.

I ran 66'05 for the half marathon (chip time, gun time 66'09) and my 800m PB was 2'08.16 - I worked on my speed to get down to this (!), so though unusual isn't impossible for the OP to have done 32'11 on a legit course.

What are your other PBs? What type of sessions were you previously doing?

The 10k was on an iaaf gold label race. Admittedly the 800 was done when I was very sore, not in as good shape and done for a bit of fun with no warm up. But my speed has always seemed to have lacked cause I've kinda neglected it. I've kinda always just stuck to a threshold and an interval workout a week. But this year I think I will periodise more and work on pure speed and mileage in base, then vo2 and speed then lactate tolerance stuff

Once a week do a speed session. It sounds obvious, but really work on speed.

4 x 400m with 5 mins rest

Or 3 x 300m with 6 mins rest.

Or 6 x 200m with 3'30 rest

Also try and throw in strides or short (10s) hill sprints into your runs once per week as well.

These sessions won't tire your body out in the normal way, it will be far less volume than you are used to for a session. I would also do time trials on the track every 4 weeks over if you can't find an appropriate race e.g. 600m, 1k, 2k.

You need to spend more time racing 800m/1500m as well as training for the event. You are what you train to be. Specificity of training is quite a bit different as you realize. So get to work.

Chair1750 wrote:

The 10k was on an iaaf gold label race. Admittedly the 800 was done when I was very sore, not in as good shape and done for a bit of fun with no warm up. But my speed has always seemed to have lacked cause I've kinda neglected it. I've kinda always just stuck to a threshold and an interval workout a week. But this year I think I will periodise more and work on pure speed and mileage in base, then vo2 and speed then lactate tolerance stuff

Just being in a race alone would take 10 seconds off of your 800 time compared to a non-race up.

Granted, that still is way slower than a 32:11 runner should be capable of, but makes more sense.

A slow twitch runner needs a big warm up for an 800. Like a very fast 400, which would require a decent warm up also.

Just stick to distance running. Centro doesn't sit around all day wishing he could run the 100 faster. He is a miler.

Predictor wrote:

Just stick to distance running. Centro doesn't sit around all day wishing he could run the 100 faster. He is a miler.

Umm, Centro has already run fast in the 100 and the 200 300 400 500 600 etc etc.

Many times.

Chair1750 wrote:

So as I mentioned in the title my speed is absolutely terrible. I think that I cloud have some massive pbs if I could drop my 800 close to 2min. I am in the middle of planning my track season. I would love to run 8:45 for 3k. What should I do to get there? I know that it needs to be individualised to have LOTS of speed sessions.

to get speed you should start from the bottom up. work on your 100m time. then 200m time. then 400m time.

Key sprint workouts I used to do were

4x400m 5 min standing rest in between reps. Pretty much ran all out

32x100m sets of 8 jog the curves

24x200m sets of 8 jog 200m in beteween reps. go ran every set progressively faster. Personally would start at 32s

16 x 400m sets of 4 400m jog in between. started at one pace then took two seconds off every set. Personally would start at 72 or 70

16 x 400m sets of 4 1 min standing rest ran at one pace. usually between 66 and 68.

DMulvee wrote:

Once a week do a speed session. It sounds obvious, but really work on speed.

4 x 400m with 5 mins rest

Or 3 x 300m with 6 mins rest.

Or 6 x 200m with 3'30 rest

Also try and throw in strides or short (10s) hill sprints into your runs once per week as well.

These sessions won't tire your body out in the normal way, it will be far less volume than you are used to for a session. I would also do time trials on the track every 4 weeks over if you can't find an appropriate race e.g. 600m, 1k, 2k.

Thats not a bad workout and I do that workout with 10k runners, but that workout is not speed work. If you want to get your 800m faster, you ultimately need to increase your max velocity. Spend 1 day every microcycle doing short sprints. I am a big fan of 600-800m worth of 50-80m hill sprints for distance runners in the general prep and specific prep periods. Take long recoveries to let your central nervous system recover. The goal is to sprint as fast as you can, while also staying relaxed and efficient. Bud Winters talked about being able to feel your cheeks flapping in the wind as you sprint. Make sure that your foot is landing underneath you, so that you are not over-striding and pulling yourself up the hill.

I took a guy who ran 2:21/4:48/9:54 in high school to sophomore year of college also being a 32:24 guy and can run 4:05 1500m runner and can now close the last 800 in 5k's in 2:20, which is faster than his high school PR.

Strengthen your body, especially your posterior chain muscles (glute, hamstring, calf). This will literally allow you to recruit more muscle fibers to contract, thus increasing your ability to run faster.

Who cares? Embrace the fact that you are amazing at longer distances.

pointer out of stupid points wrote:

Predictor wrote:

Just stick to distance running. Centro doesn't sit around all day wishing he could run the 100 faster. He is a miler.

Umm, Centro has already run fast in the 100 and the 200 300 400 500 600 etc etc.

Many times.

Methinks you’re missing out the point entirely

Anthony Randolfi’s gps watch for the 10k?

Mon easy

Tues 4-6 x 5 min hard/ 5 min steady

Wed easy

Thurs 8 x 3 min hard/3min steady

Fri easy

Sat race 15-30 x 1 min on/1 min off

Sun hammer 90 minutes steady

DMulvee wrote:

I ran 66'05 for the half marathon (chip time, gun time 66'09) and my 800m PB was 2'08.16 - I worked on my speed to get down to this (!), so though unusual isn't impossible for the OP to have done 32'11 on a legit course.

I didn't say the OP is wrong. I just said it is unlikely that he could not go faster than 2:21. You have very good stamina as you were roughly able to run 87 percent of 800 speed for 10k but the OP claimed to run over 91 percent. That is a huge difference. The OP's stamina is like a 1:56 800 m runner claiming the 10000 world record.

Then the OP said how the 2:21 came and he obviously is faster.

So all in all he might not be so far away from the 8:45 as he thinks.

I'd incorporate weekly hill sprints (~10") and rotate a normal midweek run and a short fast workout of 200s - 400s to begin with. When the OP is able to run 4 x 400 in 66-64" with 2' jog rest without completely dying he might get into good territory as 70" per lap with good endurance may start to get in sight for 3k.

You don`t need to get a better 800m time . Just concentrate on the longer races.