RE: Road Racing and Training Thread Week ending 4/8/2018

Forgot to add, good luck to all those racing this weekend. Speaking of which...

RRR - Live to fight another day, man. You are clearly fit. You just need the right race and the right conditions. I am in the camp that thinks you are in 1:18:30-1:19:00 shape.

Smart approach to the week Stone. It's all too easy to try to push through workouts when it isn't clicking. Way too wait for the right day.

Not much for me this week. A 45 minute progression effort on the elliptical Monday and 45 minutes easy Tuesday. My diet is horrendous, but I'm not totally out of control on my alcohol consumption.

One more week of moderation on the exercise front and then I'll test the leg again. It's starting to feel a bit better, but I have no illusions that it's healed yet. Basically, time for me to show the same patience as Stone but on a larger scale.

Thanks stone. Haven’t decided yet on the half on Saturday. It’s not a fast course and it may be a solo effort anyways. I had forgotten how hard that course on Saturday was even w good weather! 500ft total climb w the last two miles being 80 and 145 or so. Upside is of it being a long tempo my legs feel just fine today.

There is a fast course 5k on the 21 May just run that. Call it a cycle and hit the trails.

Good luck on your marathon and way to be patient!

Smoove - good luck w the leg brother

The Stone Cutter: As I do my Canova research, your training has come increasingly under my microscope. So when I see 18 miles at 95% MP, I know where it's coming from, but still, that's a workout I would not have attempted. I know that you have built to that and in addition to the physiological benefit, I can imagine it gives you a feeling of confidence. And with Smoove, I also love to see when people post "aborted" plans; it drives home the idea that being flexible is key.

Smoove: I wish there was something that the power of positive thinking could do to speed your recovery because if that worked, you'd have the karma and mojo of everyone on the thread channeled into your recuperation!

RRR: The selfie you posted on Strava, over your right shoulder... 1:18... just sayin'.

DietBacon: I followed your race via app this afternoon here in Taipei. Looking forward to the race report!!!

Male, 49 yo, 5’7”, 127 lbs

M: 60 m 144 bpm (Road, 325 ft)

T: 75 m 158 bpm (Trail, 1230 ft)

W: 45 m 143 bpm (Road, 60 ft)

T: 60 m 148 bpm (Road, 125 ft)

F: 75 m 157 bpm (Road, 185 ft)

S: 45 m 143 bpm (Road, 70 ft)

S: 146 m 157 bpm (Trail 1900 ft)

Total: 7:49 - 46.7 miles - 3900 ft

With no “workouts” and cool weather, I have felt fresh and strong everyday, just as a guy ought to feel in a base period. I have run 13 days in a row, waking before my alarm and rising around dawn every day. By evening, I’m feeling ready to run again, and maybe will do that if I can get my teenage daughter to come out with me for a few easy miles.

The only deviation from steady-state base building was Sunday. I previewed my upcoming trail race course and ran by feel. On that run, HR ranged from a high of 182 (my recent marathon HRavg) at the highest point to 132 coming down from that ridge.

A solid week for me with one big issue. 80 miles total

Saturday: 20. Run was on an old rail trail. It isn't groomed, so there's some uneveness, etc. Still though, a good place to run.

We ran 5 in the first 10 miles right at 31:00. For the second 10 we ran 5 in 2950. The other miles were in the 620-640 range. This run served as my "dress rehearsal." Total time was 207

My training partners is kind of stubborn, so we only had one water stop, at 8 miles. I drank about 15 ounces of water. I had GUs at 4,9, and 15 miles.

Tuesday: 11.5 miles, 67 minutes. This was a long tempo, 8 miles in 46;00, felt strong enough to tack on some sub 5:00 sections at the end.

The week would have been great, if it weren't for the long run. The weather was coldish (upper 30s with no wind), so I wasn't too concerned about hydration. We ran late in the afternoon, and I was well hydrated. Still the cramps started at about 14, and got rough at 17. While the pace wasn't easy, I could imagine a 236 marathon. The cramping is an issue though. I've cramped as early as mile 6 in Half marathons, and have felt them at the end of 10ks.

Does anyone have experience with a supplement or race day "pill" that is a little more advanced than a salt tablet?

Stone,

Nice week. Your long run this week was very similar to mine!

You also have a great attitude about your training. It could always be better, but of course you put in a nice block, with near lifetime PRS!

Well done, now go execute!

Smoove,

Run w/o a measuring device for a week when you get going again. The slow pace can be demoralizing. Your recent fitness will come back fast, even if you are old as dirt. ;)

Way to kick ass on the eliptical. Cross training sucks!

Male, 33, 5’10” 160 lbs

PRs: 16:02 (2011) 1:14:12 (2011)

Recent: 18:08 (2018)

Goal: June 5K

M: 5 miles easy

T: 3 miles easy plus strides

W: 6 miles easy

R: 3 miles easy plus strides

F: 4.5 miles easy

Sa: AM) 3 miles PM) 3 miles

Su: OFF

Difficult week of transition for me. All of a sudden, on Tuesday, my legs started feeling like crap. I worked through it all week thinking that it could be any number of things like the switch from doubles to singles, working in the sun all day, not eating enough, or even mild overtraining. Yesterday I came down with a low grade fever and had to cancel my planned tempo run. Today I’m going to shut it down completely and just rest.

Apparently, my wife caught a bug over our vacation and she may have transferred it to me. That could explain the muscle aches. It’s just weird because I’ve never had the common cold affect me that way.

I know taking a day off or two is not a big deal but I’m sure you guys understand how frustrating it is to take 2 steps back when you’ve been working hard for several months. As runners I think we’re constantly thinking of building building building and it sucks when it all comes crashing down like a set of legos. I sympathize with Smoove and others who are injured.

RRR you are much tougher than I am. I will not race in anything below 40 degrees. I’m a pansy when it comes to the cold weather. We don’t get much of it here in Florida but the few times it does get that cold I wear a ski jacket and several other layers to stay warm.

This is an exciting time of year to follow the sport! All these spring marathons to follow. Hope everyone has a great week of training and racing.

TDR,

I ran through the flu 2 months ago. Those 8 mile staggerfests most likely DID put me back 2 weeks. YOu taking time off is the smart thing to do! It won't put you back 2 weeks, maybe just 1. The side effect is that you'll get a little mini-taper, and will likely feel like a million bucks in a week.

REst, fluids, etc...!

M38, Boston, Sub 2:40, #stoprupp

M: 4 easy (road)

T: 6 easy (treadmill)

W: 2 up, 3.95 tempo @ 5:35(?), 1 down (treadmill)

Th: 8 easy (treadmill)

F: 6 moderate (treadmill)

S: 13 easy (road)

S: off (maybe 6 tonight)

Total: 44 miles (maybe 50)

Being stuck in a hotel all week was a blessing in disguise as it forced me to run on the treadmill, which was much easier on my lower leg (Peroneal tendonitis...I’m convinced). On the tempo I actually managed to send the treadmill home devastated as it would not get faster than about 5:35 and eventually shutdown just shy of 4 Miles after announcing that it could not reach the desired pace. At the time i had gotten the setting down to 5:15. AJ, FTW.

Perhaps the biggest development this week was my procurement of a pair of Vaporfly 4%s. It turns out they run big so my clown feet fit in a size 13. Veggie boy’s odds at Houston just went to 30-1 while Rupp should probably just pull out of Boston altogether.

AJ,

How big do they run? I wear 12s in most nikes, so I've got feelers out for 12s. should I look for 11.5s too?

Male 50 5'8" 132lbs

Goal Race: Sugarloaf Marathon in Maine, May 20

A Goal: 3:20:00(BQ -10), B Goal: 3:15:00, C Goal: sub 3:10??

PRs

Marathon 3:29:12 November 2016

HM 1:33:14 November 2017

10mi. 1:06:45 March 2018

5k 19:41 November 2017

This week I got back on the training plan. Wednesday was rather windy and I was not feeling it so the workout shifted to Thurs. Since the Sugarloaf course has a nice bump in the middle I decided to put a comparable climb in the middle of the MP portion of Saturday's run to get the feel for the proper effort in the ascent as well as the descent. I was more concerned with keeping the descent under control while keeping the pace up. The hill has 400ft of elevation change over 1.6mi. with mixed grades peaking at around 12%.

Mon. 7.7mi Easy 7:42 avg

Tues. 5.6mi Easy 7:47 avg + (2.2mi run/walk w/ wife)

Wed. 4.2mi Easy 8:06 avg.

Thurs. 12.75mi as 2 Easy + 5 MP + 2x2T + 1.75 Easy, Mixed terrain so splits are MP(6:53, 7:18, 7:33, 6:52, 6:39), T(6:47, 6:17, 6:35, 6:18)

Fri. 5.4 Easy 8:09 avg

Sat. 16mi as 3 Easy + 12 MP (big hill in the middle, run by effort not pace) + 1 Easy

Sun. core/hip strength and flexibility + (2ish miles w/ wife)

Weekly Total 52 mi. + (4.4mi run/walk)

Still Improving wrote:

Since the Sugarloaf course has a nice bump in the middle I decided to put a comparable climb in the middle of the MP portion of Saturday's run to get the feel for the proper effort in the ascent as well as the descent. I was more concerned with keeping the descent under control while keeping the pace up. The hill has 400ft of elevation change over 1.6mi. with mixed grades peaking at around 12%.

I'm a big fan of this! I did something similar in my training and it did make a difference. After the hill near the end of my marathon sent me home DEVASTED three previous years, this year it sent me home merely SEVERELY NONPLUSSED. But the important thing is that I didn't fear it; in fact, I used it to pick people off. May 20th is just around the corner!

Bdubs wrote:

TDR,

I ran through the flu 2 months ago. Those 8 mile staggerfests most likely DID put me back 2 weeks. YOu taking time off is the smart thing to do! It won't put you back 2 weeks, maybe just 1. The side effect is that you'll get a little mini-taper, and will likely feel like a million bucks in a week.

REst, fluids, etc...!

Bdubs how did you know it was the flu?

M58 -- 5'11" 168 lbs

Open PRs (1982) -- 16:04 5K, 2:40:30 marathon

Masters PRs (2003) -- 17:10 5K, 2:56:03 marathon

Most recent (2017) -- 18:58 5K, 3:07:23 marathon

Goal -- Defend M55-59 title in August 15K

Training status -- Injury rehab, mileage build

March 26 - April 1, 2018

Mon -- 7.7 miles @ 10:04/mi

Tue -- 4.0 miles @ 8:46/mi

Wed -- 2 x 20 mins elliptical

Thu -16.9 miles @ 9:31/mi

Fri -- off

Sat -- 25 mins elliptical, 25 mins treadmill; 7.7 miles (roads) @ 7:55/mi

Sun -- off

WEEK TOTAL: 36.3 MILES

Following weeks of 43, 50, and 53 miles, this was a step-back week. I had hoped to introduce some faster-paced work, but was hampered by non-running injuries and weather. I am scheduling a low-key 5K in June; should be able to go sub-20 by then. Maybe?

M34, Goal - first Marathon, 22 April; Target - 2.30-35

M - 7

T - 22 w/miles 20-21 @MP

W - am 4 / pm 5

T - am 4 / pm 8 / weights at gym

F - am 4 / pm 8

S - 8 w/drills + strides after

S - am HM race @MP (+3wu/cd) / pm 3-4 (tbc)

Total: ~90

Last week before taper starts proper, although I knocked off a couple of secondary runs this week.

22 done by feel, with the aim of keeping it real easy to 16, a few miles steady, and then pick up to MP for a couple at the end. MP miles were 5.46/47 into the wind so happy to hit pace without checking the watch. 6.40 avg for 22 (and just a plain ol' nice run out!)

Used a HM race for final 'big' workout today - aiming to practice going off steady (~6.00) for the first few miles, before moving into goal MP pace range. Splits were 5.58/55/48/48/45/47/46/45/48/46/47/40/34. ~75.30 for 13.1. Pleased to have kept pace within such a consistent and narrow band, and cautiously happy with how it felt - it wasn't deathly hard, but thinking about doing it twice over still brings out the shivers.

Time to jump on the taper wagon!

Bdubs wrote:

AJ,

How big do they run? I wear 12s in most nikes, so I've got feelers out for 12s. should I look for 11.5s too?

I would try the 11.5s. I think they are about half a size big. (I normally wear a 14 but am probably more like a 13.5 if there was such a thing). If you’ll post your burner email I’d be happy to share with you my source. They have some in stock and will ship.

BDubs, I race in size 12.5 in the Adios and it has a good snug fit. I typically wear a 12 innother Adidas trainers. Never train in Nikes, although I bought a throwback pair of 180 Airs recently in 11.5 and think 12 would've been a better fit for anything other than a casual shoe.

In the 4%s, I have a size 12 and they feel roomy enough that I was concerned I needed 11.5s. They did work for me though even with the extra room.

My week.

M 35 150ish lbs.

PRs 17:12-36ish(35:12 on short course) -1:22:38.

Goal race was yesterday and ended in bitter disappointment.

My week. End of a 2 week taper

Mon 4/4

Tues 7 w 2x800 + 1xmile at HMP

Wed 6

Thur 2.5 warmup routine + strides (I felt amazing)

Fri 4

Sat 3up 13.1 1:22:58 chip time

Sun just ran 3miles 8:30-7:30-7:00 Legs felt good just a tad tight. No soreness really.

Sat was brutal weather. 24 at gun w 14 degree windchill. The choice of 3in splits now seems questionable. Road was not slick when I awoke so I wore my gomeb speed flats that are slick as hell. Roads got slick and I slid more than a few times getting down to pace. Almost went down at mile 6 but guy I was racing w stuck his hand in my back and saved me most likely.

A pack was running 6:10s early and I had to make a decision to stick or go. I went. And got down to 6flat .. turned north at mile 7 and caught the 20ish mph wind in the face. Managed 2 6:12s into the wind solo then the pack got pack to me. I hung with them on the downhill 2 miles at 6ish flat and then got spit out the back and flamed the last two miles uphill. The solo miles into the wind just took the starch out of me. Felt like 5:50 miles or faster effort wise. Finished 12th OA. Could have hung with the pack and for maybe 7th? But decided I would rather go.

It is what it is. Will not let it get me down hence why I got my ass up and ran. And I will prob jog a few more miles this evening.

Future - I have my trail relay race in a month. Then first of June a 50k. I am going to spend spring and summer running some roads. Some trails race on road and trail. Whenever wherever and have fun. Run volume. Drink beer. And just have fun and then get serious in late summer.

AJ the ..clown shoe flesh eater .. is at min a 30-1 favorite now. Maybe I can run a 5k in two weeks, crack 17, and get the odds down to 20-1.