Foot Locker Watered Down This Year

NXN is usually "Watered Down" wrote:

Our two athletes who ran FL and NXN both preferred FL, in part, because they got to go to the beach.

And that's perfectly understandable San Diego (FLN) is a much better vacation in December than is Portland (NXN). That is FLN's real selling point IMO: NXN is more accessible, which means it ends up being deeper usually, while FLN has nice weather and is a better trip for a vacation (which means it will get about as many of the kids at the very top).

Both of those aspects have value to making the experience what it is. Both draw quality fields every year, regardless of the potential positives/negatives of both.

I think you are confusing teams. The PA girls who qualified for Footlocker were from Northern, Upper St. Clair, and Greencastle-Antrim. The team that came in third at NXN was Fox Chapel. Similar colors to USC and same city -- but different school.

Do we really need a high school championship?

NXR Heartland is a pancake course while FLMW has very challenging hills.

It might not convert to nearly a minute slower, but there's little logic in comparing times on different courses to determine which meet is more difficult to get into.

I think the fact that FL has larger regions makes qualifying harder. (Wolfgram was behind 4 MI runners at FLMW)

While fatigue may be an issue, Gessner and Hirsch ran 14:39 at NXR Heartland and went 2-3 at FL nationals last year.

Lot of it has to do with the destruction of the American Middle Class. The current tax bill in Congress will be the nail in the coffin of the American Middle Class. Parents can see this and opt to send their preps to Nike events to get as much free goods and a free airfare as they can find. It's a sad period in US history.

DI P5 Coach/Recruiting Coordinator wrote:

s. Somehow Footlocker keeps hanging on & it’s good to see. h...

Saying a company that brings in 7.7 BILLION DOLLARS is "hanging on" is hilarious.

There will ALWAYS be a place for footlocker because xc is a collection of individuals that make up a team and there are always OUTSTANDING runners who don't have other good runners on their team.

Two kids in my area who have raced each other all through high school both made it to footlocker nationals. Neither of them have another runner on their team that is within 1:30 of them over 5k.

runn wrote:

Brod Cruz wrote:

LMAO. POTW.

On a side note- most states limit what the kids at NXN can receive and stay eligible. It’s usually very meager. A pair of shoes, a shirt and jacket, something similar.

Unless you're a senior and have committed to a college.

If you are from Michigan and you want to run track on a MHSAA team your senior year you will either pay full retail price for whatever FL or NXN gear you take home or you will give the gear back before going home. Starting this year if you are from a MHSAA school then you had to compete unattached at the NXNMW race because the MHSAA said Michigan teams could no longer compete as a team at NXNMW.

This is not a weak time for HS. Just looked at my HS Issue of Track and Field News and there were 40 or so boys that broke 9:00 for 2 miles (and that is the list -- a 2-mile list, not 3200m). Unbelievable.

About 10 of those sub-9 boys are back as seniors this year. You used to be an all-time great if you broke 8:50y and many all-time greats did not (McChesney, Chapa, Salazar...). Now there are TEN a year that do it.

https://trackandfieldnews.com/index.php/tafn-lists?list_id=6&sex_id=M&yyear=2017

The people complaining about having two races: NXN is primarily a team competition (it started as NTN) and it's about finding the best team in real cross country conditions, while footlocker is the real individual championship where people go to run fast. I think having both is good for the sport -- certainly not bad. Although it can dilute the talent Footlocker is still generally where the fastest guys go and it's great that the athletes can choose. The footlocker qualifiers don't want to have to deal with huge packs and awful conditions.

Malcolm Sadwell wrote:

The people complaining about having two races: NXN is primarily a team competition (it started as NTN) and it's about finding the best team in real cross country conditions, while footlocker is the real individual championship where people go to run fast. I think having both is good for the sport -- certainly not bad. Although it can dilute the talent Footlocker is still generally where the fastest guys go and it's great that the athletes can choose. The footlocker qualifiers don't want to have to deal with huge packs and awful conditions.

I do feel there's a place for both meets.

If Nike would STFU and stop trying to rule the world then I'd be much more accepting of their team competition.

Malcolm Sadwell wrote:

The people complaining about having two races: NXN is primarily a team competition (it started as NTN) and it's about finding the best team in real cross country conditions, while footlocker is the real individual championship where people go to run fast. I think having both is good for the sport -- certainly not bad. Although it can dilute the talent Footlocker is still generally where the fastest guys go and it's great that the athletes can choose. The footlocker qualifiers don't want to have to deal with huge packs and awful conditions.

There are individuals in NXN- they know their team isn't going or they run unattached- they want to race the best.

Malcolm Sadwell wrote:

The people complaining about having two races: NXN is primarily a team competition (it started as NTN) and it's about finding the best team in real cross country conditions, while footlocker is the real individual championship where people go to run fast. I think having both is good for the sport -- certainly not bad. Although it can dilute the talent Footlocker is still generally where the fastest guys go and it's great that the athletes can choose. The footlocker qualifiers don't want to have to deal with huge packs and awful conditions.

You mean the FL qualifiers don't want to run a real XC race similar to what the NCAA Championship meet will be? Really?

back pack............. wrote:

Malcolm Sadwell wrote:

The people complaining about having two races: NXN is primarily a team competition (it started as NTN) and it's about finding the best team in real cross country conditions, while footlocker is the real individual championship where people go to run fast. I think having both is good for the sport -- certainly not bad. Although it can dilute the talent Footlocker is still generally where the fastest guys go and it's great that the athletes can choose. The footlocker qualifiers don't want to have to deal with huge packs and awful conditions.

You mean the FL qualifiers don't want to run a real XC race similar to what the NCAA Championship meet will be? Really?

Actually dude, they don't give a shite about how it compares to NCAA.

They choose it because they qualified and FL& Balboa have a deep history they feel honored to be a part of it.

---NXN is legit competition wise, sometimes greater, sometimes less than FL, but not entertaining on tv at all. (Same with NCAA xc frankly. Boring to anyone not a rabid fan already)

FL and the 40 athlete format is 1000x better to watch in person and especially on tv. Having 40 fast dudes or gals fly around Balboa is WAY more exciting than NXN can ever be.

In fact if you asked the top 50 NCAA xc runners if they'd like to race a 50 person only, individual race, they'd all jump on that format too, if but for one race.

prefer that format.

back pack............. wrote:

You mean the FL qualifiers don't want to run a real XC race similar to what the NCAA Championship meet will be? Really?

Really, your standards are too low.

I tend to agree -

http://parksiderangers.com/documents/2007/12/14//5K.pdf?id=88

According to Speed Rating, Foot Locker in San Diego is a much harder course than Nike's flat NXN Championship golf course.

Also, I won't name names, but I will say a close friend's son has run both JR and SR year (I'm sure easy to track) and he commented that Foot Locker is much tougher.

I have personally run Foot Locker (NXN wasn't around when I ran 15:17!!) and I find it hard to fathom NXN being more difficult. I'd put Reina at 14-lows at NXN (non-muddy).

Uh, Lane is the defending FLCCC Champ. She's not gonna go anywhere. Tuohy is not the defending NXN Champ, so if anyone were to "make a move" Tuohy would have gone to Foot Locker. But, ever since she was in middle school, she and her team have stuck with NXN.

Yeah, too bad Kilrea got 2nd at NXR Midwest and will probably get top five this weekend.