Why is everything diagnozed as a disorder? We're told that we shouldn't have personalities anymore.
Not everyone who doesn't display the predictable bland attributes that fit into the system has a disorder. Disorders were created and have flourished for 2 reasons: 1) for the status quo to discriminate 2) for lawsuits on the status quo.
You could probably analyze employees similarly using astrology. There is a wide variety of personalities out there.
Oh and based on the vague definitions of autism, narcissistic, and borderline disorders, being a social justice warrior should be a disorder!
Safe Space Odyssey wrote:
Why is everything diagnozed as a disorder? We're told that we shouldn't have personalities anymore.
Not everyone who doesn't display the predictable bland attributes that fit into the system has a disorder. Disorders were created and have flourished for 2 reasons: 1) for the status quo to discriminate 2) for lawsuits on the status quo.
You could probably analyze employees similarly using astrology. There is a wide variety of personalities out there.
This is a scientific diagnosis. Once diagnosed as autistic you will be autistic for life - unless caught early enough and treated there is a small chance. Wikipedia clarifies further this diagnosis. Make no mistake - it's for real and an estimated 1/66 boys are autistic. Me and my life and my mom spent over 100k on autism treatment and have not sued anyone 9 years after the diagnosis was confirmed for our son. We have plenty of money for a lawsuit but don't see any reason to sue anyone. My mom is a scientifically leaning atheist, and my wife Ph-D in genetics, and I'm BS in Computer Science and Engineering and we don't beleive in, and don't have any use for astrology. I don't see how that's even relevant in any way.
typo: It should read "Me and my wife and my mom"
Every day people are being born with certain disorders that were put into affect before they were born. This includes autism and many others and we should be sympathetic, helpful and supportive.
Sounds to me like he COULD be on the spectrum but DEFINITELY has emotional issues that are most likely not much related to his possible autism and more along the lines of narcissism or BPD. I've worked with people who are similar to what your describe, and yes, it is a nightmare. So far every one of them has either been fired in the time I've worked around them, not been hired back, or they basically got run off.
Take this coming from someone on the spectrum: if the person cannot do their job, then they simply should not have their job. That's it. You should, however, explain all of the above directly too him, as uncomfortable as that may be. If he does nor or cannot correct/adjust his behavior, then let him go.
FWIW, I currently work with a woman who has a heart of gold but who is socially retar(d)ed and seems to have no brain at all half the time. She's been doing this job for 8 years and has no other options. As much as it bothers me, I will soon start documenting and reporting her behavior to our supervisor because she makes so many mistakes and says such harassing things so frequently that everyone around her (myself included) is losing their mind. It's not personal. She simply cannot do the work at an acceptable level and cannot work with others. These sorts of situations are just part of life sometimes.
Safe Space Odyssey wrote:
Why is everything diagnozed as a disorder? We're told that we shouldn't have personalities anymore.
Yes, just "walk it off." Got a cold? Walk it off. It's all in your head. Just stop doing that.
Enjoy your trolling from your parent's basement.
one more thing wrote:
typo: It should read "Me and my wife and my mom"
Every day people are being born with certain disorders that were put into affect before they were born. This includes autism and many others and we should be sympathetic, helpful and supportive.
Another typo: I meant "put into effect". Schools have IEPs (Individual Education Plans) for these students. My step brother had an IEP in the 1970s (long before autism was known), he was dyslexic, had trouble writing his name in 8th grade and died when he was 26. We don't know if he was born that way or if it was all the drugs in high school, and in his 20's. He definitely had a disorder. He dropped me on my head when I was a baby, drove around town at 100 MPH, among other things that got him arrested. Not your typical kid, my dad threw him out of the house. I was dropped on my head however still have more than enough brain cells; I graduated from CSE, have a career in the pharma industry developing drugs for people that need them regardless of their diagnosis. I mention all this only so you can see from my perspective.
You are a kind and insightful person. I wish there would be more people like you in this world. The Father of Child with Autism is spot on.
Your employee is not well suited in a managerial role. He is incapable of empathy and that is not because he is a bad person. His mind shifts to topics that appeal to him and he cannot control that. He is best suited in an individual contributor role that requires combinatorial thought. Construction is sort of the wrong field for him unless he dabbles in architecture. Silicon Valley is full of people just like him. I had many colleagues in college just like him. Recently, I met a science teacher at top boarding school just like him. One of the Sharks (investors) is also like him with the added narcissism that comes with success.
I suspect I am autistic, or at least fit in somewhere on the broad scale of those who exhibit autistic or neurodevelopment disorders.
People close to me tell me I am autistic. I have never been formally diagnosed.
If anything my autism is rather mild, as I have been successful and lived a rather normal life, as your employee seems to have done.
My advice would be to not confront this employee about your thoughts or suspicions about his condition. Initially I reacted poorly to people telling me I was autistic (did not like the criticism).
I came to realize that my autism is both a major strength and also a weakness, and it was just a label.
I have naturally gravitated towards a lifestyle and work that allows me to maximize my strengths, while minimizing the weaknesses.
If you promoted him you should have the power to assign him to/create another parallel position that will capitalize on his strengths while minimizing his weaknesses. He must not be a total loser if he advanced that far in your firm and was promoted.
You have to make this sound like a parallel position, so it does not come off as criticism. Hopefully the employee will recognize the benefits of the new position, as it will minimize his weaknesses and shortcomings. Everyone wants to be placed in situations where they have some confidence that they will succeed.
If you feel this employee is valuable (hard working, friendly, tries hard, can focus on details) create a position for him that maximizes these traits, if you can. Do not try to force a square peg in a round hole. Be creative. Sounds like this will not be a traditional management/leadership position.
Hopefully you, as a good manager, will be able to do this if you value this employee and what he can do for your firm. You have to be flexible and aware that the Peter Principle is real. The key is creating a position, with specific pre defined tasks, objectives and deliverables, that allows this person to operate at a high level just below that of their own incompetence.
I knew of a lady who was a very respected scientist in her field, lots of grant funding, lots of important medical breakthroughs or at least critical advancements. She was a full professor at a major university in their medical center and was a non-MD (PhD scientist) who didn't have clinical duties—just research. Because of her renown she was promoted to be an asst dean of research then asst vice president of the health center. The actual vice president of the health center had to resign suddenly due to a scandal and this lady was made acting VP. It was a total disaster. She didn't know nor care how to manage people. She supposedly wouldn't even move into the VP's office suite and tried to run this whole multi-college major university health science center from her lab.
Give your bright engineer a senior position that doesn't require overseeing others, where he can focus on specific duties if that works for your company. Give him the praise and funding to do his thing if you have a need for it, but don't try to mould him into a manager if there are good signs he won't learn how to undertake the job. And good luck.
Good advice.Make sure that you ask or directly tell the employee what is requested or required explicitly do not hint at or leave it to the employee to deduce from the situation/environment what is required. It will not happen. Don't be afraid to tell the employee directly/bluntly. My wife likely is an Aspie - the OP's base description fits her almost perfectly. She should never manage people because she doesn't understand people. She is very good at what she does - software testing, and has made a career out of being what I call a mercenary. For the past decade or so she has done contract work. It suits her personality perfectly - she goes in with a set of directives, does her work, and moves on to the next contract, with none of the standard office politics, office personality issues, etc. because most of the work is from 1 - 6 months. She is one of the few people that I know that can successfully work from home, actually getting work done because she is so focused on the work. I don't know if "manipulative" is the correct word, but my wife can say anything to anyone because the words don't have any more emotional baggage tied to them than the number 7328. She doesn't pick up on any sort of social cues. If you were to drop a bag of groceries in front of her ... she wouldn't think to offer help, but if you were to ask her for help, she would gladly help. Another thing, I have to tell her that I am angry at her because she doesn't see the facial/social cues that most normal people see.Sometimes she comes across as callous in certain situations, but from her perspective everything is black and white. "Just the facts ma'am".I read a few books by Temple Grandin where she describes her life with autism and changed the way that I communicated with my wife. This changed everything for me and made my life much better.
Father of an Autistic Adult wrote:
Your employee definitely has autism. I'll try to shed some more light, as I live with this everyday:
1) They often have low self-esteem. He may act superior after receiving praise, but he is well aware of how he struggles with his people skills. This is why criticism is often difficult for him.
2) He will exhibit impulsiveness as neurons travel across his brain and cause him to act before thinking "I should not do this". It is similar to having little inhibitions while you are drunk. Then, shortly afterwards, will have great remorse. He may throw temper-tantrums, but will regret them later, which will shrink his self-esteem even lower.
3) His OCD will control him. He HAS to finish certain tasks, or else his brain will torment him. This is why he focuses on smaller tasks, and ignoring more important ones. He can't help this.
4) Social skills and awareness are going to be almost impossible for him to learn.
5) He will manipulate. He will have this skill just as strong as other humans.
6) He won't hold grudges. Unlike many other people, he will forgive people quickly, and can correct his mistakes.
Putting him in a position where he doesn't have to manage people may be wise, if possible. If not, possibly just give him tasks that his OCD will help with. Demoting or firing him will cause serious depression for him. Whatever you do, please support him, no matter how difficult this may be.
Above all else, please remember that he knows what people think of him. A famous saying from a person with special needs: "When you think life is hard, please remember that mine is."
it's diagnosed not diagnozed wrote:
Safe Space Odyssey wrote:Why is everything diagnozed as a disorder? We're told that we shouldn't have personalities anymore.
Not everyone who doesn't display the predictable bland attributes that fit into the system has a disorder. Disorders were created and have flourished for 2 reasons: 1) for the status quo to discriminate 2) for lawsuits on the status quo.
You could probably analyze employees similarly using astrology. There is a wide variety of personalities out there.
This is a scientific diagnosis. Once diagnosed as autistic you will be autistic for life - unless caught early enough and treated there is a small chance. Wikipedia clarifies further this diagnosis. Make no mistake - it's for real and an estimated 1/66 boys are autistic. Me and my life and my mom spent over 100k on autism treatment and have not sued anyone 9 years after the diagnosis was confirmed for our son. We have plenty of money for a lawsuit but don't see any reason to sue anyone. My mom is a scientifically leaning atheist, and my wife Ph-D in genetics, and I'm BS in Computer Science and Engineering and we don't beleive in, and don't have any use for astrology. I don't see how that's even relevant in any way.
Why would you and your 'life" sue anyone for any reason?
gloria wrote:
I don't think you are in a position to say he/she is autistic?
And you seem to be discriminating (by writing corrective
consultations) because he's mentally deficient.
Therefore, he should get an American Civil Liberties
Union lawyer, and assert his rights, violations of
due process, HIPPA violations, privacy rights by posting
on a public forum.
First off, the OP is posting anonymously. We have no idea who this is and never will. So there is no HIPPA violation.
Second, based on the OP's description of the person's behavior, that person is most certainly autistic. The person cannot fulfill his duties and has caused two talented engineers to leave the firm. Solution: that person needs to be terminated from employment as soon as possible.
autism? wrote:
Sounds more like someone with narcissistic personality disorder to me.
I have dealt with quite a few narcissists and people with autism. Their behavior is very similar. One difference is the narcissist doesn't suffer from OCD and doesn't particular care about any details, or anything, other than having his way. The narcissist also usually has no remorse whatsoever, whereas autistic people will feel shame and get upset at themselves, often even hitting themselves. Narcissists have no shame and will certainly not punish themselves. Narcissism is the first stage of sociopathy.
Both narcissists and autistic people tend to be time wasters who can also be dangerous in different ways. Autistic people should not drive motor vehicles, yet many of them do.
Well, I don't agree.
So, I guess I'll reserve my comment in calling you a "sleazy slut and a bitch":)
gloria wrote:
Well, I don't agree.
So, I guess I'll reserve my comment in calling you a "sleazy slut and a bitch":)
A fact is not invalidated because you don't agree with it. And you can keep gnashing your teeth but try to do it silently and out of sight.
WTF is wrong with you millennials? And before you chastise me for asking that question, remember that I'm a person with various disorders as well.
Angry Willy wrote:
My wife likely is an Aspie ...
She doesn't pick up on any sort of social cues. If you were to drop a bag of groceries in front of her ... she wouldn't think to offer help, but if you were to ask her for help, she would gladly help. Another thing, I have to tell her that I am angry at her because she doesn't see the facial/social cues that most normal people see. ...
I read a few books by Temple Grandin where she describes her life with autism and changed the way that I communicated with my wife. This changed everything for me and made my life much better.
My stepson has been diagnosed with Asperger's. He is 33 years old, and moved in with his mother and me a few years ago after his stepmother kicked him out of her house.
It's extremely frustrating for me to see a healthy adult man waste away his life. Although he successfully held jobs in his teens and early 20s, he refuses to seek employment now, refuses to pursue counseling, and refuses to go back to school (graduated from HS, but no college).
He is on SSI disability for "anxiety," but won't seek treatment. We are struggling financially, but he can't/won't contribute, as his monthly disability check barely covers his new car payment, insurance and phone.
Your example of the spilled groceries exactly describes his behavior, except that even if asked, he won't do anything he considers unpleasant or "beneath" him: cleaning bathrooms, or any kind of housework, feeding our chickens, shoveling snow, garden work, etc.
It's difficult not to feel that empathy is a basic human quality -- even a defining characteristic of BEING human. It's really difficult to understand how a person can ignore the spilled groceries, and still be human!
I am curious how your wife and you were able to date, build a relationship, etc, given her social and emotional limitations. My stepson has attempted several relationships since his teen years, but has always failed.
I'll have look for the Temple Grandin books. I know I must sound like an ogre, but it's so difficult, and is really stressing my marriage. It just seems like a hopeless situation.
It goes back to does he do his job well.
If yes, then let him be. If someone else promoted him then it's their problem to deal with the consequences of promoting a poor manager to a management position. It might be good to bring this information to the attention of the promoting party and confirm they are aware of these events.
If no, then recommend demotion or a horizontal move to a position that requires less of him. It goes back to whoever promoted him needs to be made aware of these events.
I don't suspect you promoted him, but if he is reporting to you then I have to question why you agreed to this set up...
Sounds like he can't really do the job.
You are projecting excuses (autism).
Tell him shape up or you're out.
give him 2 weeks to improve.