How good is Mo Farah compared to the all-time greats?

runrunner wrote:

But he has the unique quality of being great at every event from the 1500m (3:28) all the way through the half marathon (59:32). This combination of speed/strength and endurance makes him almost unbeatable in championship races. I'd say more so than even Bekele or El Guerrouj.

59:32 is not great for the half marathon. The world record is a minute faster.

Also, Farah doesn't have unique range. He just has decided to race at those distances instead of focusing. El G and Bekele could have both run competitive times at a range of distances but they were:

1) busy actually participating in and winning the diamond league

2) running fast times in their primary events

3) chasing records in their primary events

4) competing against other all time greats in their primary events

Farah does none of these things. Unless he gets better competition, his golds are not worth as much as Bekele's, Geb's, and El G's.

El G was a 1:42-3:26-12:40 type guy

Bekele was a 3:29/30-12:37-26:17-58:xx guy

Geb was similar to Bekele and with a 2:04 marathon I think

Farah is a very good runner but still a tier down from them.

According to letsrunners :

He is too slow so he can't be a goat

He wins gold medals so he must be doping

He competes in weak era

He cheats on his wife whenever he can

He doesn't pay tax in the UK and the US at the same time

He is not British

He shaves his head (this is the reason he is a world beater)

He only runs fast on the Monaco track

He is horrible human being

He left his twin brother 4 dead in Somalia

He is devout Muslim who prays when he wins

Farah is probably going to have the best championship record of any of those guys when all is said and done, which has to count for something. Like you said, there is a pretty good chance (i would say better than 50%) that he ends his track career with 7 WC Golds, 4 Olympic Golds and 1 WC Silver. He mentioned on the BBC telecast of london today that he is probably done with championships on the track after london 2017, and we all know that championship marathons are a crapshoot at best so who knows about Doha 2019 and Tokyo 2020.

With regards to your comment on him being great at everything from 1500-to the half, he does have a truly unique range as far as actual marks put down. He is the only person in history ranked top 100 in 1500/5000/10,000 (T9, 31, 16 on the AT lists respectively), and he is T54 in the half. For reference, in order for his half to match his worst track placing, he would have to drop 17 seconds and get to 59:15. Im personally curious to see what he can do in the full marathon once he solely decides to focus on that. Currently 30 men in history have been under 2:05:00, and i would imagine that would be the bare minimum that Mo would be happy with when all is said and done.

If he wins the next two doubles, he is the best championship racer of the modern era. If he moves up to the marathon and breaks 2:05, he will display some of the greatest range ever. My guess is he runs 2:04 something...with a 3:28, his range would be as good as anyone ever, aside from maybe Geb and Kipchoge. Geb ran 3:31, Geb 3:33. A 3:28 is a long ways from 3:33, but the 3:31 for Geb was enroute to winning a world championship...so I'd have to give him the edge over Farah...but I'd still take Farah's range over Kipchoge, especially given Kipchoge "only" won one world title on the track.

If Bekele runs a 2:02 or 2:03 in Berlin, he'd be in the running for greatest range ever, too, but he'd probably need the world record for me to give him the edge over Farah since he "only" ran 3:32.

He's the Terry Bradshaw of distance running. Terrible stats but lots of hardware during a very weak era of track distance running.

This isn't a weak era. There's more 12:40 runners running right now (people who have run 12:40's in their career) than during Bekele's era. The 10000 talent is deeper, too. There are probably just about as many sub 27 runners running right now than during the Bekele era despite there not being hardly any quality races to run fast at 10000. Better drug testing is keeping runners from approaching world records. People going directly to the marathon would not beat Farah on the track. They'd probably be good, but they wouldn't be winning the 5000 or 10000 at the Olympics. The only marathoner right now who could possibly give Farah a run for his money at 10000 is Kipchoge and he wouldn't have enough speed to out kick him.

How does Mo Farah compete to the all-time greats? That question doesn't make sense - Farah is one of the all-time greats.

My view on Mo Farah:

1) He either is the best of a less doped era or

2) Dominating a weak era, sort of like the Houston Rockets in 1993/1994 when Michael Jordan was out.

I watched the 2003 world championships 5000m live and they would've destroyed him.

Also watch the 2006 Commonwealth games 5000m final and watch how the Kenyans and Craig Mottram dropped him after a couple of laps.

Mo has a great range. Especially in the 1500. But considering his weak times over 5 and 10000 meters, he is far from Bekele and Geb.

Geb and Bekele could probably go 3:28 in a race like in Monaco, on that track. On the other side, Farah could probably go faster han 12:53 and 26:44.

Over the half marathon, Bekele could probably run a time over 30 secs better than Farah.

Yeah, I would have really liked to see Farah against that 2003 World Championship field. He does have a better kick and roughly equal last 800 to those guys, but it seems like the 12:52 pace would have been too fast for him to still have a kick. Though with anything slower than a ~12:55-13:00 pace I think Farah may be able to beat anyone.

I also find it hard to believe that runners have gotten slower. Just as many or more people are running worldwide and the training is just as good or better. It would be improbable that the base of runners has gotten weaker. I do think doping helped push the ultra-fast times of the 90s and early 00s.

And I don't think the Rockets winning is an example of a weak era. Just 1-2 weak-ish years. caused by MJ leaving. Other than MJ the league was the same. Both championships were also huge upsets. And MJ was actually back in the league when they won their 2nd championship.

I don't know if there's been an example of a "weak" era in sports while the sport is growing in popularity, participation and has better training techniques.

Just wanted to clarify something. Championship races in the 5k and 10k are necessarily slower and more tactical than world record attempts, due to the lack of a pase-setter to break the wind and keep a consistent pace.

I think in these conditions Farah is one of the best of all-time. This favors runners who have good times, a good last 600-800m, and a good kick for the last 100m. If the pace is fast, he's good enough to keep up and can win with his excellent kick in the last 100m. If someone tries to make a long surge over the last 800m he's strong enough to keep up. And of course if it's slow the entire time and comes down to a sprint he will always win. I think the only situation in which he would likely lose is if the pace is world-record speed for the whole race, which ordinarily can't happen unless a few runners work together.

If he gets two golds in Rio and 1-2 more World Championship golds I think he'd be the best championship racer of all-time.

dasfasf wrote:

This isn't a weak era. There's more 12:40 runners running right now (people who have run 12:40's in their career) than during Bekele's era. The 10000 talent is deeper, too. There are probably just about as many sub 27 runners running right now than during the Bekele era despite there not being hardly any quality races to run fast at 10000. Better drug testing is keeping runners from approaching world records. People going directly to the marathon would not beat Farah on the track. They'd probably be good, but they wouldn't be winning the 5000 or 10000 at the Olympics. The only marathoner right now who could possibly give Farah a run for his money at 10000 is Kipchoge and he wouldn't have enough speed to out kick him.

This is absolute BS. Take a look at the 1997 WC 10000 race. The 3 guys behind Geb (Tergat, Hissou, Koech) all had better PB than Mo. The fast 5000 times from today´s era almost all come from one race: Paris 2012.

tony the tiger wrote:

According to letsrunners :

He is too slow so he can't be a goat

He wins gold medals so he must be doping

He competes in weak era

He cheats on his wife whenever he can

He doesn't pay tax in the UK and the US at the same time

He is not British

He shaves his head (this is the reason he is a world beater)

He only runs fast on the Monaco track

He is horrible human being

He left his twin brother 4 dead in Somalia

He is devout Muslim who prays when he wins

Agreed..

Peak ability and championship wins put Bekele and Gebrselassie ahead of him.

Behind El Guerrouj in terms of all round achievement. (For me El G's training practises/secrecy are a pretty clear giveaway that he was doping so wouldn't have him in the pantheon, but then Farah's grey area stuff with Salazar/Nike backing means he's hardly the people's champion either.)

Probably about equal in achievement and ability with Tergat, but Tergat much more of an icon and ranks a little above.

Farah on the next tier alongside Kiptanui, Komen, Kiprop and Wanjiru.

Can't really compare athletes from properly different eras - current era of men's distance running started about 1995 I'd say, with Gebrselassie, Kiptanui, Tergat doing amazing things.

Farah is already one of the all time greats of distance running. Without a world record in an outdoor event, I wouldn't consider him THE Greatest. Having said that, his range is more impressive than anyone's and he is less likely to have doped than Bekele, Geb and EL G. They were certainly on PEDS. That's not saying Farah isn't, but if he is, it's certainly not to the extent of those mentioned above.

Btw, I don't believe EL G was capable of 1:42 or Bekele and Geb capable of 3:28, when they were competing at their best.

Mm geb did 3:31 indoors good for #2 ever

It's crazy how these threads are being created about Mo Farah and GOAT talk. This all happened working less than a year with Salazar and would of never been mentioned before that to be a current world beater. It's a huge red flag. But I guess every sport needs a hero.

Realitycheck4 wrote:

It's crazy how these threads are being created about Mo Farah and GOAT talk. This all happened working less than a year with Salazar and would of never been mentioned before that to be a current world beater. It's a huge red flag. But I guess every sport needs a hero.

Surely whether he doped or not shouldn't even be a factor in a GOAT discussion, particularly if Geb, El G and Bekele are also included in the discussion.