Caster Semenya is rolling down under!! She's already run 51 and 2:00! Will the courts decide the women's 800 in Rio?

50 Shades Of Gray Area wrote:

Ajee could be the fastest genetic woman (XX) in the world this year and yet end up being denied a medal in Rio.

The hormone issue is certainly somethng that needs to be addressed but it should also be pointed ou that a recent coaching change may be benefitting Semenya as well.

A SA paper wrote:

Semenya seems to have a better battle plan this year under new coach Jean Verster after parting ways with former 800m great Maria Mutola, and ran a number of 400m races, improving her PB by over a second, from 52.54 to 51.47 – an Olympic qualifying time – in Potchefstroom on March 12..

Show me women with intersex issues running 1:48 and I'll agree it is an issue.

At the moment, women such as Semenya are running times that other women are capable of running, even if some of those times are at the top end.

It's simply not an issue worth getting worked up about.

As for sympathy / compassion for her - that's about human dignity, not in relation to her condition.

Metric Miler wrote:

On a slightly unrelated note, with the new CAS ruling I just wonder this; if an athlete with a Y chromosome, any level of testosterone (as long as it is naturally produced), and any genitalia is allowed to compete in women's sport, then what is there to stop a biological male from competing as a woman? If the answer is nothing, then I'll see you all in Rio!

It's a scary thought. Imagine a very good male athlete, but obviously not the very best, say a 1:45 800 m runner, deciding to become a woman. According to the new ruling this "woman" would only need to lower their testosterone levels. Surgery not required. Testosterone should be below 10 nmol/L for at least 12 months prior to her first competition. Then they'd be free to compete. That limit also applies to women, which is why Semenya for example had to have some sort of procedure or something. Apparently female elite athletes normally have at most half of that limit, while men normally have ten times higher than women. But the variance is very large.

Article about the CAS ruling:

larkimm wrote:

Show me women with intersex issues running 1:48 and I'll agree it is an issue.

At the moment, women such as Semenya are running times that other women are capable of running, even if some of those times are at the top end.

It's simply not an issue worth getting worked up about.

As for sympathy / compassion for her - that's about human dignity, not in relation to her condition.

Probably just because the rarity of 1;48 type runners even among males.

The number of "women" with testicles is probably not a very high one so the talent pool is likely extremely small.

Most of these athletes come from third-world countries, and the 800 is the shortest distance that doesn't require extensive mileage, expensive tracks, specialized footwear to train and high-level coaching. As we have seen with Rowland's account of Niyonsaba, these athletes are training at a U.S. middle-school level. The 800 is at the convergence of male-trait advantage, limited training and poor athletic resources.

Bad Wigins wrote:

Why is it always the 800 where the women end up masculine-looking? Niyonsaba, Semenya, the Kenyan from iWC, Kratochvilova, Mutola, I doubt I remember them all.

In the shorter sprints there's the occasional Flo-Jo effect but nothing really that visible. Always seems to be the 800.

larkimm wrote:

Show me women with intersex issues running 1:48 and I'll agree it is an issue.

This might be the stupidest comment in the thread.

There's nothing liberal about supporting the rights of anyone to compete against women in women-only competition.

LetsRun.com wrote:

Semenya is considering doubling in Rio accorrding to a report from South Africa

https://twitter.com/wesbotton/status/712340114719023105

@wesbotton 7h7 hours ago

Caster Semenya says she will consider attempting the 400m/800m double at the Rio Olympics. She has qualified for both

The current schedule makes that double very difficult, 4 rounds of the 400 and 3 rounds of 800...that's lot of running. Also, opening up with 51/2:00 is very good, but the top ladies will open up 50/1:59. Medaling in one event will be tough, attempting two event could means ending up with nothing.

1:48 is 5 seconds faster than the women's world record. Semenya showed the capacity to break that record in running 1:55 in Berlin the first year of comp.

Since then, Semenya's either sand-bagged or been in hormone treatment--maybe easing off for championships in some years. The sudden 51/2:00 early season time indicates something else entirely--no hormone treatments any more and 800m gold easily. And the very standards could allow any 1:50 man to jump in, declaring himself a woman, and winning gold--or filling up the final with eight men. This is not a civil rights issue for Semenya but an equality issue for all the women who want to compete against women.

jjjjjj wrote:

There's nothing liberal about supporting the rights of anyone to compete against women in women-only competition.

Ah! That's the good old libtard again!

Let men and women compete in the same races, qualifying, then trials, then Olympics.

On a slightly unrelated note, with the new CAS ruling I just wonder this; if an athlete with a Y chromosome, any level of testosterone (as long as it is naturally produced), and any genitalia is allowed to compete in women's sport, then what is there to stop a biological male from competing as a woman? If the answer is nothing, then I'll see you all in Rio! (quote)

On that note, I see your Mount Holyoke College in the US that used to describe itself simply as a ‘women-only institution’.

Now it grants entry to the following dizzying array of identities: ‘Biologically born female who identifies as a woman; biologically born female who identifies as a man; biologically born female who identifies as other; biologically born female who does not identify as either woman or man; biologically born male who identifies as a woman; biologically born male who identifies as other when the other identity includes woman.’

In short, Mount Holyoke is no longer a women’s college.

Men can enter, too, so long as they ‘identify as’ women.

Identifying as a woman is now equal to being a woman.

Feeling is reality.

Their toilets must be the only ‘women’s only’ toilets where the seats are often left up.

female athletics is a joke wrote:

We just need to restrict the women's events to those without a Y-chromosome. Anyone with a Y-chromosome must compete in an open class. It's so simple. And they did it in Worlds 2002. But for some reason it's politically incorrect. The losers are those without a Y-chromosome, i.e. REAL WOMEN, who have no chance competing against Y-chromosome humans.

Bingo!

tj wrote:

It is unethical according to all the actual women who are having to compete against genetic men! These hormones DO give a huge advantage - we know that. Testosterone is a steroid. Steroids are known performance enhancers. It is just craziness to have these guys running against women. I'm sorry for them, but they can run in open 'male' categories, which is more appropriate for their genetics and testosterone levels.

The doping agencies should be banning them for high levels of testosterone.

larkimm wrote:

I can't see why this issue raises such ire here. Where's the compassion for women like Semenya?

He's a male predator competing in women's events.

Liberalism truly is a mental disorder and an affront to all common sensibilities. The solution to this whole thing is so obvious a 5 year old could figure it out. It sure is funny watching leftists become constricted in their own web of contradicting beliefs.

A while back, this board went ballistic over a masters runner who used prescription testosterone, boosting his T level to "the normal range of 500-700," according to his physician.

Semenya's T levels were reported to be THREE TIMES higher than the highest of elite female athletes, who in turn have higher T levels than the average female.

This would be equivalent to a masters runner boosting T levels to over 2,000, higher than any level in medical history, and then competing against fellow 55-year-olds. This would be outrageous and blatantly unfair.

Semenya refused surgery, which would have removed her testes, so all she needs to do is go off her meds to get back to these stratospheric T levels.

If Semenya wants to compete as a woman, she should be required to have an orchidectomy and wait 12 months before being allowed to compete.

larkimm wrote:

Show me women with intersex issues running 1:48 and I'll agree it is an issue.

At the moment, women such as Semenya are running times that other women are capable of running, even if some of those times are at the top end.

It's simply not an issue worth getting worked up about.

As for sympathy / compassion for her - that's about human dignity, not in relation to her condition.

The issue of men competing in women's events is not important to you, but it's important to women and those of us who have compassion them and for fairness.

larkimm wrote:

Show me women with intersex issues running 1:48 and I'll agree it is an issue.

At the moment, women such as Semenya are running times that other women are capable of running, even if some of those times are at the top end.

It's simply not an issue worth getting worked up about.

As for sympathy / compassion for her - that's about human dignity, not in relation to her condition.

Lol. So if a HS guy running 4:40 in the mile decides to become female and get a full ride scholarship would you be okay with that?