Do half milers in college generally have to run XC?

This is a good thread.

One observation is that versatility is a valuable trait. This goes for distance guys just as much as 800 guys.

There is nothing wrong with stepping into a random open 800 or 1200 leg on the DMR b squad even if you are a pure distance guy. You might surprise yourself. Most collegiate races are much better paced than hs at all distances so you can just tuck in and hang on.

TrackCoach wrote:

pure h800 wrote:

The thought of racing 8k's and running 80+ mpw makes me cringe. I have enough trouble with the 5k and anything over 40mpw, so college XC sounds like a nightmare. Do most college coaches have their 800m guys running cross?

Usually not, unless you were a pretty good xc runner in hs and put up better 400m marks than mile marks. Btw, if you think 8k is bad, imagine racing a 10k.

I meant to say, unless you were a pretty good xc runner in hs and put up better mile marks than 400m marks.

Also, at a big time distance oriented program, you probably won't run cross because you probably aren't good enough. However, you will probably do some training with the cross team and if by chance they discover you can score points, you may be put into service. Even if you are a 400/800 type, few schools will let you sit on sidelines if you can help their conference or national championship bid. (therein lies the problem!)

Nick apparently hates cross though

bob schul country wrote:

You can take all the examples and the "type of runner" stuff and throw it out the window.

the answer is yes. here are the reasons:

1. its organized training under a coach

2. its competition. Runners need to be competitive all year around to stay focused

3. It makes track easy. CC runners are tough and track isnt hard after all that work

A blue chip HS 800m runner 400/800 types at top tier programs are usually not members of the XC team. With that said, an 800m runners who can't score points in the 400m, and who is perhaps moving up to the mile, might do all of the training, but red shirt and run home 8k meets as unattached. I don't have a problem with long sprinter types running cross, but there is a litany of HS 800m stars who pretty much had their careers ruined by someone trying to make them a distance runner. The problem is, a 400/800 type may have only run 25 mpw in HS and often competed in meets over summer as opposed to running mileage. Based on natural talent and athleticism, he might have been a decent 5k H.S. runner and/or run a few decent miles, but 5 miles might be the longest they have ever run in their life and no 2 months of training can prepare them to race 10K XC. With that said, there have been some successful 800m XC runners, but it was usually in their junior of senior year and after they had moved up to mile. Steve Holman and David Krummenacker were low mileage HS 800m runners who were good college cross country runners as well, but they but they became 800/mile types and it took them until their junior years at G' Town before they were expected to score points.

When I was a high school coach, I use to steer 800m runners away from high mileage programs chasing conference and national xc titles. Overall, the best US professional 800m runners have come from sprint to MD oriented ncaa programs. I was really happy when I heard Donavan ?, the freshman kid that ran 1:45x indoors went to A&M.

We had a 1:48 guy who ran XC. I think he ran around 26 (8K). If he likes it and there's space on the team, why not let him? I don't think it was mandatory.

TrackCoach wrote:

. I was really happy when I heard Donavan ?, the freshman kid that ran 1:45x indoors went to A&M.

He won the NCAA title for fastest season opener.

Gulan Rapp wrote:

Nick apparently hates cross though

What true miler or 1/2 miler doesn't? Way out of our comfort zone. Too long. Too much pain. You still run CC anyway. Payback will come when you hit the oval.

Most 800 guys will run XC in some form or fashion during their college career even if they are terrible at the longer distances. If you have good grades, you will likely be running in an actual meet too. Whatever the minimum requirement is for you to factor into the team's cumulative GPA.

Depending on the school, the 800 and even 400 guys have to run some cross to meet NCAA scholarship minimums.

USC didn't even have an NCAA XC team and Duane Soloman ran cross-country with their club team.

im in college and i run a 1:44 on 40mpw and i don't have to cross. i just don't run at all

Ca$hclay wrote:

Gulan Rapp wrote:

Nick apparently hates cross though

What true miler or 1/2 miler doesn't? Way out of our comfort zone. Too long. Too much pain. You still run CC anyway. Payback will come when you hit the oval.

You can do the mileage and 5k style training with quality aerobic sessions in winter, not run cross country and do great outdoors over 800m.

Really, it isn't necessary to race 8k cross country as a track specialist at all, no matter what distance you race at. People do it because they like it, because they like the challenge (get more medals) or feel it makes them 'stonger'; but this has no bearing on the track.

That's not to say training on the grass and off-road doesn't have great benefits, it does, just racing an 8k (or often much longer here in the UK) cross country in winter does little for you.

It is better for the 800m to go indoors instead.

My college experience was 800 guys had to "run" XC. Essentially they came to practice and built up their base for indoor by getting in some miles, got some longer strength type repeats in, and did a few races at what would be considered a very hard tempo effort.

He was a DNF at Nationals. What happened? Does anyone know?

someone said 40 miles per week is pathetic.

40 miles is a lot to work with.

you can do 3 mile runs 5 days a week in the morning at 6 minute pace with hills with a few stride outs in the middle. that is 15 miles.

then you can do two 6-8 milers hard. that is 30 miles.

then you can do 4-8 x 300 to 800m up hill workout. that is 35 miles

another day run stairs, sprints, stride outs, cross training. that is 40 miles

plus 3 days 30-50 minutes gym cross training and leg work.

this is a fantastic schedule.

I am also reminded that David Hemery did a XC season for his American university in 1967 prior to his Olympic gold at 400m hurdles in Mexico. Check out his book "Another Hurdle" if you want confirmation of this. (This book also contains the best, almost step by step, account of a painful track session that I have read; well worth reading.)

In England where xc tradition is very strong I would expect and see even the 400/800m guys in the club to DO xc for strength. Obviously they are highly unlikely to make the scoring team so they would just do the open/unlimited team numbers events which there are plenty of here. This is what happened in my club anyway. For 800/1500 no doubt about it and those types should be competitive and maybe even in the scoring team.

The real question is SHOULD 800m runners at least try to do XC to which the answer must be yes.