SMJO wrote:Coe actually beat Rono in his "Toga" race. Likely in early 1982. Pretty sure it was over 2 miles as well
nonsense
they raced once, over a mile in '78 with coe winning 4'02 v 4'03
So beating Coghlan and Cova counts for nothing? Huh
coming 21st & 40th in others did him no favours
Coe is "allowed" to be even faster because he missed his prime years with illness.
Sound fair?
no
his peak was '81
just like Ryun's peak was '67
neither were better in any other year
Awesome. I can post a couple of lines and you can spend most of your day breaking it down.
Coe couldn't run in mud, that's why he sucked in those CC races and he was always worried about the ankle that he had damaged in the post hole.
The same one you were dropped in as a child.
Coe was even a better politician than Ryun come to think of it.
Coe- multiple WR holder, double gold medalist and still prominent on the all time list.
Ryun, underachieving burn-out case. Jesus freak too.
SMJO wrote:Awesome. I can post a couple of lines and you can spend most of your day breaking it down
replying to drivel always gives me a laugh
Coe couldn't run in mud, that's why he sucked in those CC races and he was always worried about the ankle that he had damaged in the post hole
nonsense
he won an x-c over 2.4km beating wessinghage & clement in '78
& what is the rubbish about an ankle ?!
his afflictions are well documented, but what ankle injury ???
he came 40th in one x-c race in '79 in same year he set 3 wrs & he came 20th in one x-c in '80, his gold winning year
he had absolutely no injury worries those years & came nowhere in x-c
as for claim he coudn't run x-c, he won 1 race & why on earth woud he be running them in the first place if he didn't think he coud be competitive ???
The same one you were dropped in as a child
pathetic from fool
Coe hurt his ankle, fell into a pot hole and went to hospital with his dad and George Gandy. Gandy argued with the doctor/nurse about the need to put it in plaster and won them over.
Going back to the previous poster about the 2 mile race with Rono that was Ovett who broke the world record while doing it but that was in 78 I think!
ventolin^3 wrote:
SMJO wrote:Awesome. I can post a couple of lines and you can spend most of your day breaking it downreplying to drivel always gives me a laugh
Coe couldn't run in mud, that's why he sucked in those CC races and he was always worried about the ankle that he had damaged in the post hole
nonsense
he won an x-c over 2.4km beating wessinghage & clement in '78
& what is the rubbish about an ankle ?!
his afflictions are well documented, but what ankle injury ???
he came 40th in one x-c race in '79 in same year he set 3 wrs & he came 20th in one x-c in '80, his gold winning year
he had absolutely no injury worries those years & came nowhere in x-c
as for claim he coudn't run x-c, he won 1 race & why on earth woud he be running them in the first place if he didn't think he coud be competitive ???
The same one you were dropped in as a child
pathetic from fool
Someone doesn't know their Coe history.... You really should do some homework and then get back to me. Start with reading his first Biography and then read Kenny Moore's book.
You will then be able to be able to approach my level of knowledge.
You are now failing this assignment as well as your Lagat Logic class. Tsk tsk.
Mr. Greenburg wrote:
The point is that this seems to work for Lagat but would not be best for most others...regardless of pace. Say the guy who can't break 17 for a 5k reads this, starts taking days off but runs "really hard" the next day. I gurantee he will not improve.
5.12 pace is not "really hard" for Lagat.
so nine pages later & with whatever the heck is currently going on, i'm going to turn the talk to training (sorry!)
what does this type of training run accomplish?
for a 1500/3K/5K type, will a steady 10-12 miler serve to maintain the aerobic benefits you gained from more specific work during the base period (such hard 15+ mile long runs for endurance, fast 3-6 mile tempos to bring down threshold, etc.)? and will it do so without leaving you so trashed that you can't do the fast work on the track 2-3 time a week needed to prepare for racing?
i ask because as a runner focusing on the 1500/5K this season, i'm finding it too taxing to fit a traditional long run (14-16) + longer tempo into my week and get recovered enough to do the fast stuff on the track. i'm playing around with the idea of scrapping the Sunday long/Thursday track tempo schedule i'm on & just doing one shorter, high-end aerobic effort on the trail on Sunday (say 10-12 miles of progressive running averaging out to around 6min per mile overall. the 2nd half of the run could start at 6min pace and cut down to the low 5min range by the last 1-2 miles).
i think Joe Rubio suggested something similar once, remarking that in-season he would scrap tempos and have his milers do 1-2 runs a week of around 10 miles in length where they would finish fast over the 2nd half (can't find the thread where he discusses this though...). these runs were by feel & would not tax them as much as a more structured tempos during base where they'd be trying to hit splits.
bad as naomi russell wrote:
so nine pages later & with whatever the heck is currently going on, i'm going to turn the talk to training (sorry!)
what does this type of training run accomplish?
for a 1500/3K/5K type, will a steady 10-12 miler serve to maintain the aerobic benefits you gained from more specific work during the base period (such hard 15+ mile long runs for endurance, fast 3-6 mile tempos to bring down threshold, etc.)? and will it do so without leaving you so trashed that you can't do the fast work on the track 2-3 time a week needed to prepare for racing?
i ask because as a runner focusing on the 1500/5K this season, i'm finding it too taxing to fit a traditional long run (14-16) + longer tempo into my week and get recovered enough to do the fast stuff on the track. i'm playing around with the idea of scrapping the Sunday long/Thursday track tempo schedule i'm on & just doing one shorter, high-end aerobic effort on the trail on Sunday (say 10-12 miles of progressive running averaging out to around 6min per mile overall. the 2nd half of the run could start at 6min pace and cut down to the low 5min range by the last 1-2 miles).
i think Joe Rubio suggested something similar once, remarking that in-season he would scrap tempos and have his milers do 1-2 runs a week of around 10 miles in length where they would finish fast over the 2nd half (can't find the thread where he discusses this though...). these runs were by feel & would not tax them as much as a more structured tempos during base where they'd be trying to hit splits.
Few suggestions:
1) If you run 7 days a week the common format is Tuesday speed, Friday tempo or threshold, Sunday long run.
2) You could run long run Saturday and rest Sunday. For some individuals (for instance Lagat) they get more benefits from a rest day than going for a short shakeout run.
3) Instead of a progression run, do a long run tempo combo. Lagat rests once a week so sometimes if he races Sunday, then he rests Monday and he rests again on Sunday. So he'll do a long run tempo combo because his week is cut short. If you recover slow its the same concept. How Lagat does these is say he's doing for a 12 mile long run he'll do 6 miles at his normal easy pace then 5 miles very hard and 1 mile easy to work as a cool down. If you're doing 14-16 miles long run, just run normal easy pace til 6 miles to go then run 5 miles hard 1 mile easy. Like say your tempo is 530 pace and easy is 630. You do say 8-10 miles 630 pace 5 miles 530 pace 1 mile in 630.
ankle wrote:Coe hurt his ankle, fell into a pot hole and went to hospital with his dad and George Gandy. Gandy argued with the doctor/nurse about the need to put it in plaster and won them over
you will have to offer more details
i've read his new book & find no mention
if he had an ankle injury bad enough to warrant a plaster, he wouda been out of action for 6/52
there is nothing in his record indicating a 6/52 break in his gandy years of '77 - '80
SMJO wrote:Someone doesn't know their Coe history...
fool
you are the ignoramus who knew nothing about his x-c losses of 21st & 40th
you posted rubbish about him racing rono in a 2 mile
You really should do some homework and then get back to me. Start with reading his first Biography and then read Kenny Moore's book
you clearly haven't done any homework as your knowledge is rubbish
try reading his new book
You will then be able to be able to approach my level of knowledge
which woud be completely 0
You are now failing this assignment as well as your Lagat Logic class. Tsk tsk.
you woudn't have even been in allowed into class to get the assignment, so poor is your knowledge
as for bernie, only a complete fool woud ever believe he had 12'40 ability in him anytime in his career
i am always in trouble with in-season long runs as well. off season long runs like 14+ work fine but when the real speed comes long runs + hard workouts are by far too taxing for me.
i think malmo says all sessions are important, so the long run should not affect your weekly schedule. true.
i have realized that many fast 5k-guys run tons of medium long sessions like 8-10 miles of volume per day, easy or progressive/fartlek-style, and max out the long run at 12-13.
as notaustin18 mentioned: the long run-tempo-combo is a hard aerobic workout.
Mate, I lived and breathed Coe and Ovett and ran in their time in UK. I will find the notation in his first book I think but for now here from Wiki - Coe's 1978 season continued to show his progression in the middle distances, though he raced only sparingly as he had, in early June, suffered a serious ankle injury whilst out on a training run. On 18 August 1978, he ran at the Ivo Van Damme Memorial meeting in Brussels, in the 800m, where he far outclassed the field and stormed home in a time of 1:44.26, another UK national record.
ankle wrote:Mate, I lived and breathed Coe and Ovett and ran in their time in UK
who didn't follow them back then ?
I will find the notation in his first book I think but for now here from Wiki - Coe's 1978 season continued to show his progression in the middle distances, though he raced only sparingly as he had, in early June, suffered a serious ankle injury whilst out on a training run. On 18 August 1978, he ran at the Ivo Van Damme Memorial meeting in Brussels, in the 800m, where he far outclassed the field and stormed home in a time of 1:44.26, another UK national record.
you will have to find it as no reference in wiki
as for not running much in june, in '77 he didn't run between march & july !!!
& in '79 he ran just 1 race in june
in the 3y upto '80, he ran precisely 2 races in june
he never ran much at all in june until games year
ankle injury every june from '77 - '80 ???
page 50 of Running Free "Early in 1978 he suffered a serious injury , putting his foot down an old gate post holewhile out training at Loughborough, was lucky not to break the ankle, and severely ruptured all the tendons. He sat in agony while his sock expanded like a balloon as he watched it. He crawled accross the field to a security car....and rushed to hospital" Later on page 51 in a direct quote from Coe " ..the sister said it was broken. George insisted it wasn't. Sister: I'm telling you it is' George: 'I'm not a betting man' (which was a bare faced lie because he would bet on two earwigs climbing a wall) but I'll put my shirt on it that it's not' Sister: what are your qualifications? George: MSc in biomechanics' whereupon she immediately started calling him dad
etc
also that is not quite correct about the races (did you really mean to say - & in '79 he ran just 1 race in june ?
Read more:
http://www.letsrun.com/forum/flat_read.php?thread=5699971&page=8#ixzz2xugICHF1
;
1977 he raced 14 March and then 3 July. 1979 he ran heaps : 27 Jan indoor at cosford 3000;25 April Loughborough match 400;20 May Yorkshire champs 800;21 May Y Champs 400; 23 May L'borough match 800/400 31 May L'borough v AAA 800; 16 June Northern Counties800;30 June Europa Cup 800;3 July Bislett Games 800 and WR!;14 July AAA champs 400; 17 July golden mile; 5 Aug 800; 8 Au Europa cup; 15 Aug Weltklasse 1599 WR
Between 1977 and 1980 (counting 77 but not 80) he had 42 races
ankle wrote:
page 50 of Running Free "Early in 1978 he suffered a serious injury , putting his foot down an old gate post holewhile out training at Loughborough, was lucky not to break the ankle, and severely ruptured all the tendons. He sat in agony while his sock expanded like a balloon as he watched it. He crawled accross the field to a security car....and rushed to hospital" Later on page 51 in a direct quote from Coe " ..the sister said it was broken. George insisted it wasn't. Sister: I'm telling you it is' George: 'I'm not a betting man' (which was a bare faced lie because he would bet on two earwigs climbing a wall) but I'll put my shirt on it that it's not' Sister: what are your qualifications? George: MSc in biomechanics' whereupon she immediately started calling him dad
etc
BOOM, goes the dynamite.
How could you not know this fact?
I am well aware of his cross country attempts which was clearly mentioned in Moore's book. Coe was a princess when it came to having good footing. That's why he was a track runner.
You fail again.
sorry, SMJO, do you mean to reply to me or someonew else, if me, what is your point I was correcting Ventolin
SMJO, do you mean the David Miller book (Coe's early books were authored by Miller, Running Free, coming back. A Fitness Log and Diary was by Coe himself (or more likely both son and dad) and the Coe Ovett file by mel Watman. I disagree with you that this incident in any way provides a view about Coe's ability in cross . he won the Yorkshire schools XC and as a 15 year old was 10th just behind a year older ovett. The things written about him (particularly biography material) one has to remember are fashioned from the track exploits.
I mentioned the ankle to Ventolin and he wasn't buying it.
I'm sure Coe would have done just fine at CC if that was his choice of event.
Once he proved himself as a better track runner he was just going through the motions in his few CC races.
SMJO wrote:
ventolin^3 wrote:replying to drivel always gives me a laugh
nonsense
he won an x-c over 2.4km beating wessinghage & clement in '78
& what is the rubbish about an ankle ?!
his afflictions are well documented, but what ankle injury ???
he came 40th in one x-c race in '79 in same year he set 3 wrs & he came 20th in one x-c in '80, his gold winning year
he had absolutely no injury worries those years & came nowhere in x-c
as for claim he coudn't run x-c, he won 1 race & why on earth woud he be running them in the first place if he didn't think he coud be competitive ???
pathetic from fool
Someone doesn't know their Coe history.... You really should do some homework and then get back to me. Start with reading his first Biography and then read Kenny Moore's book.
You will then be able to be able to approach my level of knowledge.
You are now failing this assignment as well as your Lagat Logic class. Tsk tsk.
Great. We have two of the biggest idiots on this message board arguing.