Sub 3 Marathon Goal - 12 Weeks Out

Training Advice/Discussion Marathon

10 years ago 01/29/2014 4:30pm EST

Hi,

I start my 12 weeks of marathon training next week for an April 27 marathon. My background - 36 yo, running for 3 years, no physical activity 15 years prior to that. I didn't start at 5k/10ks, instead I went from couch to HM in 6 months just working on extending the long run in 2011. Ran a few more HMs in 2012 to 1:31 PR. 2013 - 3 marathons last year- 3:08:29 PR in May 2013 on Pfitzinger 18/55. Peaked at 55 mpw for the final two races - bonked/cramped at Lehigh Valley in the late summer (1:33/2:04). Ran a 1:27 HM last October and targeted 3:08 at Philly marathon. Bonk/cramping again (1:34/1:48) splits. I've spent the past 8 weeks addressing endurance and building up my base from 60 to 80 mpw (rotating 1 tempo/1 set of hill repeats every 2 weeks, everything else easy). The bump in mileage has been niggle-free. I just time-trialed a 59 flat 15K this week. Hopefully this suggests some gains in fitness. Since I've never focused on a 5k/10k cycle, my 19 flat 5K predictably doesn't line up to this 15K, so I still have no speed. I do plan to focus on 5k/10k after this marathon cycle.

So, for the final 12 weeks, I'd like to stay at 70-85 mpw with one mid-week workout and rotating the long run every week between a 3 hr 22mi aerobic run, taking no carbs, to work on fat burning and then an 18 or 20 mi long run with MP miles building up from 8 MP miles to 16 MP miles 4 weeks out. For the mid-week workout, next 6 weeks, I'm thinking of addressing my vo2max deficiencies by doing 6x800, 5x1000, stuff like that. Should I also throw in 10K workouts like 6x1mi and 10x1000 or just focus on vo2max for 6 weeks? The next 4 weeks I'm thinking lactate threshold runs at 1 hr race pace. I'm racing an HM 3 weeks out on a 2-day taper. I'll target sub-3 FM if I go sub-1:24 HM. Sub-1:25 HM, who knows, maybe sub3 is still possible. Anything over 1:25 and sub3 is off. And then taper 2 weeks. 10 days out from race was going to try the Yasso 800s +5 min for a final FM predictor but that could be a colossal failure given my lack of shorter distance racing experience.

Thoughts? Thank you in advance.

10 years ago 01/29/2014 4:47pm EST

re: thomas25

After several attempts over the course of years to break 3 hours, I did so on Fitzinger's plan, getting up to 70 miles per week. Earlier that same season, I ran a 1:23 half and a 37:30 minute 10K, with no taper for either. (I ran 16 miles the day before the 10K).

So, I think you are correct to enter a half marathon a few weeks out to see if your fitness is there. Given your past few marathons, you need to build up your endurance. I have no idea what your 15K time means because I don't know that distance.

Bottom line: if you actually run 70-85 miles per week for a few months and if you run 1:24 or faster for a half a few weeks out, you have a shot. If you don't do both, I would not attempt it.

10 years ago 01/29/2014 5:06pm EST

re: thomas25

Well done with the increased mileage. Given your story and a base of 80 mpw, I think if you can get under 1:25 for the half on a minimal taper, you'll have a solid shot at sub 3:00. I wouldn't go crazy worrying about vo2. Just start to get comfortable running at 6:50 pace. In terms of structuring workouts, I would try to do two a week, you have the base for it. I'd start by keeping the tempo and would build the distance each week. Keeping it controlled is the most important thing so that you're not burnt out for another workout... The second workout would be shorter repeats, whatever you like, to keep in touch with some speed. The tempo is more important. As you get closer to the marathon, get real specific. Turn the tempo into more of a marathon-paced effort (8 - 12 miles) and make the interval repeats longer.

As far as a predictor workout, don't waste your time wiht yassos. I think the best predictor is in the fast finish long runs. If you can hit goal marathon pace for the last 10/12 miles of a 20/22 mile long without redlining, you're good.

10 years ago 01/29/2014 5:44pm EST

re: thomas25

My best advice for any sub-3 candidate is not to worry about "speed," if one can call it that, but just concentrate on managing extended periods of volume. I know people love to mimic elite training plans, but all you have to manage is 6:50 miles for 2 hours and 59 minutes. Everything you do should be based on that goal pace, because the biggest problem people get into is going out to fast, oftentimes because they feel fit, lose site of the goal, and undermine themselves by training with 5k/10k speed workouts at faster paces.

10 years ago 01/30/2014 4:19pm EST

re: easy peasy

Not OP, but I have a similar goal, and this is all very useful information. Thanks!

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