Putting 2:03:23 in Perspective

You had a very good post until that last paragraph.

"On the flip side: Has this sport (among others) gone too far? With all the problems in the world, is this commitment justified? I think the answer can only be yes if it is making us stronger, more wholesome contributors to humanity. But with all of the drug allegations, cheating scandals, and bureaucratic power plays going on, I'm just not so sure."

So, nobody should train for a sport because there are problems in the world? What kind of bleeding heart BS is that? You go fix the problems and let Kipsang set WRs.

Dedicating everything to running? Geb ran 2:03:59 in his early 40s while working full time as a business executive and raising four children. You don't have to be a d@mn monk to run well.

It should be the other way round: the problems of the world need to go away, not sport.

At 4:42 mile pace for Kipsang's Berlin run, the track equivilant would be 104 non stop 400s in approximately 72 seconds.

Stating his performance this way is revealing.

vincent44 wrote:

At 4:42 mile pace for Kipsang's Berlin run, the track equivilant would be 104 non stop 400s in approximately 72 seconds.

Stating his performance this way is revealing.

Yup ... Marathon on a track!!!

Actually more like 105+ laps each in 70 seconds.

vincent44 wrote:

At 4:42 mile pace for Kipsang's Berlin run, the track equivilant would be 104 non stop 400s in approximately 72 seconds.

Stating his performance this way is revealing.

Oh the humanity!!

http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_detailpage&v=pUVDmXvXcbk#t=39

If only they hadn't run the 1936 Summer Olympics Men's marathon, they could have prevented this!

Here's some perspective. How many Americans have been able to run what Kipsang split for 13.1 today? This list isn't that long. If anyone thinks that Rupp or Ritz or Hall have any chance of ever being a factor they are nuts.

If this list is correct, Ryan Hall @ #35 is the only runner not from Ethiopia or Kenya in the all-time Top 50 Fastest Finishes.

The great Sammy Wanjiru at #51

wncmtnrnr wrote:

http://www.alltime-athletics.com/mmaraok.htm

If this list is correct, Ryan Hall @ #35 is the only runner not from Ethiopia or Kenya in the all-time Top 50 Fastest Finishes.

wncmtnrnr wrote:

http://www.alltime-athletics.com/mmaraok.htm

If this list is correct, Ryan Hall @ #35 is the only runner not from Ethiopia or Kenya in the all-time Top 50 Fastest Finishes.

Not only that but his legitimate 2:06:17 puts him in the top 120 all time. Awesome!

Check out the 5000, 10000, and Steeplechase lists on that site as well. It really gives you a greater appreciation for the dominance by the Kenyan and Ethiopian runners.

It really is a crazy time if you think about it. The average person couldn't keep it up for 200m. Even most experienced runners couldn't keep that pace up for more than two miles.

wncmtnrnr wrote:

http://www.alltime-athletics.com/mmaraok.htm

If this list is correct, Ryan Hall @ #35 is the only runner not from Ethiopia or Kenya in the all-time Top 50 Fastest Finishes.

Try

Ronaldo da Costa is still the fastest on a record legal course not born in Africa.

Many questions here but I'll limit myself to two points. First, regarding "perspective," in 1969, an Aussie named Derek Clayton lowered the WR to 2:08:34. That record lasted until Rob deCastella broke it in 1981. Clayton's record lasted so long people began to say the course must have been short, and it was impossible to remeasure it as the years went by. Like the sub-4:00 mile, many thought a 2:08:34 marathon was impossible.Clayton's effort would have left him more than a mile in arrears of Kipsang yesterday.

Second, Kipsang does not have to justify his pursuits in light of all the problems in the world. We live in a world not only fraught with countless seemingly overwelming difficulties: bombs kill innocent people in Nairobi, Congress can't pass a budget, and the polar ice caps are melting at an alarmin rate. We take comfort in, and are inspired by, great art, literature, poetry and athletic performance. We owe Kipsang, and others like him, a debt of gratitude for the awe they inspire in all of us, at least those of us who are paying attention.

wncmtnrnr wrote:

Should this discourage or encourage runners everywhere, especially those not of East African-ancestry? Is it all in the genes? Pain threshold? Culture? Something more?

My question is could we in America emulate something even approaching this? Throngs of people dedicating their everything to the sport? Should we even try?

Another question that arises is just what is the human limits in distance running? I don't know about anyone else, but performances like these are just mind-boggling to me in terms of execution, poise, and the capacity for pain and perseverance through it.

Thoughts?

It will both discourage most runners and encourage a very small few.

Genetics? Running ability is very common, but the desire to be the best runner, very rare. Pain tolerance? Every runner has that.

Lots of Americans do dedicate their lives to running don't they, but perhaps Eeast Africans are more professional. To them it's all or nothing, with very good prospects to earn a living for so many of them, whereas runners in rich countries have to get a proper job to support their running.

Human limits? We will see more and more records being broken, regardless off whether or not the athletes are drugged. A point which very few people can accept.

Still outside 4:20 pace for 1500m the record can go lower

If Geb or Bekele run and trained the marathon at their peak the WR may already be 2:02xx

ukathleticscoach wrote:

Still outside 4:20 pace for 1500m the record can go lower

If Geb or Bekele run and trained the marathon at their peak the WR may already be 2:02xx

What does 4:20 pace have to do with anything?

He's a Brit, thinking metrically.