Options for a 1:47/14:01/29:06 guy....

When are you thinking about the marathon? Have you run a 1/2 marathon competitively? If so what was your time? Do not quit or give up! You just need a stroke of good luck!

I have some questions for you:

a) what are your goals? What do you want to achieve? Short term, long term? And HOW do you want to achieve these goals?

b) what distance do you feel most comfortable with? 800m or 5k?

c) What is important for you? In life, for your running? Independence, family, money?

d) what are your current monthly expenses

e) what are your interests outside running? What profession (other than running) are you interested in?

f) prone to injuries?

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try to answer these questions yourself, if you don't feel like writing them on a message board.

I was in a similar boat than you (better 5k PR and NCAA finalist back in the days, but slower on the 800m) - I decided to work part-time and train for 2 more years. I did not really improve, partly because I realized that "running" is not 100% what I want to do, so after the two years it gradually faded down to running occassional road races.

Still I don't regret anything.

Just think about what you really want to do. You seem a bit frustrated with your current situation and "hung up" on your old PR's. They are definitely good, but the decision to continue professionally should come from your heart. Your motivation is what counts primarily.

If you like the distance, yes, I would say train for marathons.

The story about that Japanese amateur who worked full time and had PRs similar to yours (I think he was just a hair under 14:00 and 29:00) before popping a 2:08 should inspire you. Nothing wrong with giving running a shot a few years after college to see if you can qualify for the trials and maybe pop a "big one." You could try to get an OT marathon qualifier by running the half (perhaps you even bump up the mileage), then run the trials in January. Assuming you don't make the team, you could then take your monster base and sharpen for the 800, shooting for the trials on the track during the summer. 1:47 ain't too shabby, and with your base and some sharpening, anything could happen. Marathon training made Peter Snell into a 1:44 Olympic gold medalist.

However, running can easily become a singular obsession. Do not become the 29-year old who is still clinging to lost hopes and dreams, especially if you are compromising other areas of your life, like family, building a career, charitable endeavors, hobbies, etc. Unless, of course, you can run 2:08 and/or juggle a career. No reason you can't start getting some actuarial exams under your belt while you train and work part-time. It's possible a firm will take you on part-time.

I apologize... I meant more actuarial exams as you've probably already passed at least a couple. Give running maybe one more year through 2012, then reassess. After the trials as indicated above, you could train for a fall marathon in 2012 and see how you do.

Guppy wrote:

Very unusual mix of training and PRs. VERY few 800m guys run as much as you, but pretty much every 1500m guy with an 800m PR 100mpw for months, you're well prepared to drop the mileage and increase the intensity of your training while focusing on 800m-5000m. I would try and figure out a way to give things one last try for indoors, but it's hard to give specific advice. I would also try talking to smaller training groups (ZAP etc rather than NIKE).

Whoa, I don't know what happened to 1/3 of my post. Should have said something like:

"VERY few 800m guys run as much as you, but pretty much every 1500m guy with an 800m PR of 1:51 or faster is a sub 4:00 miler. Most guys running under 1:50 are also running 3:40 or faster. With a 1:47 or 1:48 you should be running 3:36-3:39 unless you're an 800m specialist. If you've been doing 100mpw for months..."

option?

http://www.teamindianaelite.com

If you are looking at the 800m, the Indiana Invaders are always an option. Coach Harger has affordable housing, helps with jobs searches, and you have a unit of guys that are all capable of 147 (most recently Jimmy O'Brien placed at indoor US Nationals). His really believes in the athletes, and gets you into great races, especially his High Performance races at the end of the season.

I was in your shoes a few years back, I ran around 1:47 in college on minimual training (DIII college), but never committed to it. Once I graduated I thought I could work a full-time job and train, but it just isn't possible. If you are going to try the running thing, you have to complete surround yourself with it and give yourself the best shot.

I know people that go to smaller clubs, while they pursue an advanced degree (work at a running store), etc. You have to allow the running to take priority for awhile. If it is in your heart to compete, you have the rest of your life to work a desk job as an Actuary. Regret is a terrible friend to have in old age. I think your biggest decision is to decide what race you want to run, concentrate your training around that, and get with a group that you can train with and go through the daily toils of being a post-collegiate runner with. That's just my two cents tho.

Seems to me like you're perfect for the 1500, but then again, that competition is really stiff right now. But hey, you and Centro have the same 800 PR- you never know man, you never know.

________________________________________________

Mate, its 2011. You aren't a recent grad. You are on your way to 30.

Run for fun, something you clearly aren't doing now. Be the best fun runner you can do on half the miles you are doing now.

Go and get a real job and compete there. You'll find the things that made you a good runner (not great) may make you a great professional something else.

The world is full of lazy ass people with no motivation. YOu have a history of success. Channel your motivation into something that will set you up for life.

I bet your GF told you something similar.

Hey, thanks for all the responses guys. "When are you thinking about the marathon? Have you run a 1/2 marathon competitively? If so what was your time? Do not quit or give up! You just need a stroke of good luck!"I was considering running the marathon in 2-3 years, although I wanted to give the half a shot sooner, just to see where my longer 10miles and over fitness level is at. But no, I haven't run it yet.

I am the walrus wrote:

I have some questions for you:

a) what are your goals? What do you want to achieve? Short term, long term? And HOW do you want to achieve these goals?

b) what distance do you feel most comfortable with? 800m or 5k?

c) What is important for you? In life, for your running? Independence, family, money?

d) what are your current monthly expenses

e) what are your interests outside running? What profession (other than running) are you interested in?

f) prone to injuries?

my answers:

a) Like any other runner, I would like to medal in a major Championship race. This is my dream. But my short goals would be running competitively, getting fast times

so that I can enter bigger races. Getting my pr's down to 1:46/3:57/13:30. I enjoy the 800m, I feel like I'm really good at it. I can mentally just drift for the first lap and a half, and turn the gears and pass

a lot of guys who just can't turn it over as fast as I can. 5km recently felt great too. I've been doing a lot of mileage so even when I have a really slow day, I feel great afterwards, it's just that I don't

have the faster training to knock out a fast time.

"What is important for you? In life, for your running? Independence, family, money?"

Sure, running, life, and independance are of course at the top of my list. With regards to money, I have a good resume and can usually pick up any low paying job without sacrificing mileage/time/energy.

I'm working at Target right now, and it's easy work, I'm usually just behind the counter handling the register (sitting down of course!) I have enough to get by on food and rent, I also pick up a few shifts at

my grandfather's shipping company. Those coupled allow me to eat and drive to the occasion road race to enter (I don't taper for the road races, for instance, I'll do 10-12 miles the day before).

"what are your interests outside running? What profession (other than running) are you interested in?"

As stated, I am pursuing a career as an actuary. I still study at night and in the morning, so, i'm not giving up much in terms of that career. I have a few connections in that field as well, so I feel like

all i have to do is pass the exams (no easy task of course), and i'll be all set for a long time, esp, with their starting pay.

f) prone to injuries?

No. Thankfully not. I'll get the occasional, like I did in college, but I run my mileage safe (20% of it on grass, 5-10% barefoot), some of trails, and a decent on pavement. I've always ate healthy, so I know

my body is taken care of.

Your combination of PRs, racing focus, and training seems very odd to me.

Have you ever looked at where you stand in the IAAF tables? A mid-1:47 for a 800m specialist is about the equivalent of a mid-3:40 for a 1500m specialist (3:58 for a miler) and a 13:30 for a 5,000m specialist. Why have you been focusing on 5,000m racing and putting in a marathoner's mileage (apparently, about 6,000 miles a year for the past four years)? Aside from a physiological tolerance (and, perhaps, psychological need) for high mileage, is there anything in your history that suggests that you are better suited to the longer distances?

It sounds to me as though your talent is at 800m, but that talent may not be quite enough to get to the level to which you aspire. I'd think that you'd want to find out, though, by aligning your racing focus and training with your natural strengths. Four years of 115-130 mpw, with a PR of 14:01 at 5,000m, does not suggest a promising future at 5,000m or longer.

As I said, my 5km pr was straight from college, I haven't run a 5km in 2 1/2 years. I'll tempo the local 5km race in 15:00-15:30, but I don't want to just throw myself in a small race and lead the whole thing only to be disappointed by a slow time. that was my thinking for the distance side of things. And, I have dropped my mileage at times, I consistently run 110-135, but let's not forget those 90mpw's during a snowstorm or during a lazy month or two :S

I believe mentally tired gets '10/10' for his trolling efforts. Well done. You had me going until some of your answers after the original post.

I agree with AN. When I first read your post I thought you were some sort of bizarre troll. How does a guy who's got credentials like yours end up all over the map the way you are? You've run 1:47 and you're wondering if you can do it again some day, but you've run a 10k this summer. Who runs that sort of range? Are you an 800/1500 guy? I mean do you think of yourself as that? Or are you a 5k/10k guy who's thinking about moving up to the marathon (and half)? You've got lots here about PRs and how many miles and the like, but I don't see anything about what sort of runner you think you are.

You said that you'd emailed the big names looking for support and were told, "we'll see." What did you say to them? Did you say you've run 1:47 and 29:06 and you're thinking maybe about a marathon but you'd like to match or better your 800 PR again one day, or did you list your PRs and outline your best events and your goals in that specific event? I think you could try to hook up with a coach to work on a specific plan to see you be competitive at nationals in the 1500 over the next couple of years, but you need to train like a miler, think like a miler, choose your event and focus yourself on that specific event.

[quote]Avocado's Number wrote:

Your combination of PRs, racing focus, and training seems very odd to me.

Sir: With all due respect, it's time to shi* or get off the pot. I think you need to find a marathon in the next 2 months, taper the last 2 weeks for it, run a Olympic trials qualifying time, run the trials, surprize a few people, recover, sharpen up for some serious spring races and qualify for OT in 800? - 5000? distance(s), run the trials and there you have it, someone may spot you and pick you up or at the very least you gave it your very best shot and you'll have no regrets. Good luck!

Your not good enough...

mentally tired wrote:

As I said, my 5km pr was straight from college, I haven't run a 5km in 2 1/2 years. I'll tempo the local 5km race in 15:00-15:30, but I don't want to just throw myself in a small race and lead the whole thing only to be disappointed by a slow time.

I didn't see anything about a 5km pr "straight from college." This is what you said:

"That was in 2008/'09. I've only managed to race about a 1:48.6 since then, though I was mainly focused on the 3km/5km, which i posted a best time by 36 seconds (in the 5km). Now I've got fairly fast pr's, current ones stated in the title"

You also mentioned feeling great when you ran a 5km "recently," so I don't understand how that squares with your statement that you "haven't run a 5km in 2 1/2 years."

I'm not trying to cross-examine you or poke holes in your account of your running history. It just sounds very odd and unfocused -- which is not at all how you come across otherwise. And if you really haven't run a 5km in 2 1/2 years, then what have you been waiting for? (I'm tempted to ask if you're saving yourself for Zurich.) You've apparently run something like 25,000 miles in training since graduating from college, but it's not clear to me what you've been racing during that time, aside from a few 800m races, an occasional "tempo" 5km, and a 10k road race.

therealworld wrote:

I hate to say it man but maybe you just need to move on with your life and finally become an actuary. Do you have any interests outside of running? If not I guess I can see why you would want to continue but you're not really doing anything except delaying the inevitable, which is moving on and running for enjoyment.

Bad Advice!

You are what 24 or 25 years old, unattached, able to live frugally? No way should you give up on running. I really think the best advice is to get a coach. You have been self coached for 4 years out of college and have done pretty well. A good coach would be able to focus you on working to your strengths and while you may think you know what you are doing, Av's Number is right, the volume you are running is not something an 800 guy would be doing. It is very likely that a good coach would have you running less mileage. For grins, what does a typical training week look like for you? Don't give this up man, I guarantee you, you have not reached your full potential.

Get a coach and choose an event. Jack of all trades, master of none. I personally would train for the 800. Dropping the mileage and upping the intensity means your training has to be more carefully planned. "Go out and run pretty far kinda fast" doesn't cut it any more, hence the need for a coach.