Ritz is good, but he won't develop the kick Rupp or the other Africans have before Berlin.

Are you guys just blinded by jealousy?

http://www.runnerspace.com/video.php?do=view&video_id=276

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Thanks for the psychiatric diagnosis. But just because you thinK I am jealous doesn't mean I have to enjoy watching Rupp run.

And actually, someone HAS run hard in every championship meet and still run well: Jennifer Barringer. She broke the CR and ran 9:25 alone at NCAAs, ran 3:59 at Pre before that, ran 15:02, I'm sure she's going to run fast at USAs, and is always going for it.

I wouldn't have expected Rupp to run all out at NCAAs. At that point, he had the 5K to run, the team title to win, and USAs coming up. But when you run USAs and have six weeks or more until the world championships, it seems a little strange to be totally unwilling to run an honest pace. Like, if this 10K really takes a ton out of him because he runs 27:17 or something awesome, couldn't he scrap the next summer meet and at least have given a little back to his fans? If I wanted to watch a guy humiliate people on television for no reason, I'd watch Bill O'Reilly.

Essentially, I'm just saying--you don't see LeBron only scoring 20 points a game and jogging up and down the court only playing hard when a team comes within a few points of the Cavs because he's saving himself for the post season. You don't see Michael Phelps not trying to go for WRs in Beijing, and he had SEVEN other events including prelims within that three week span. Merritt routinely trashes people. El G ran hard from the gun in almost every race. Lagat is willing to take the lead.

I am not trying to convince you to hate Rupp. But if you're wondering why distance running is unpopular, it's definitely because of people like him. The preview for this race could've been: "Rupp has the ability to break the AR, or at least get into the mid 27's. He hasn't run a fast 10K in awhile--will he try it?" and the article the next day is "Rupp let's Dathan Ritzenhein lead around the track at 28-flat pace before running a fast two-lap workout to win the race in a slow time, look back twice to make sure he isn't exerting himself overly (wouldn't want that in a distance race, if you're "smart"), and waves to the home crowd that could've been cheering the entire race, but in actuality only cheered for five hundred meters."

The only people I know that enjoy watching Rupp-type tactics live in Eugene, Oregon. And one guy out here in Boulder but he probably still has his questions about last night.

Well, Jenny's doing good stuff, no doubt. But she's been in a different situation then Galen. When she goes big in these NCAA races, no one's near her level. So, if she messes up, goes out too hard and dies, it doesn't matter because she's gonna have a half-lap cushion when she falls apart. Galen on the other hand, if he exerts himself too much and makes a mistake, he stands to lose a lot more. People in the NCAA - Chelenga, Forrest, McNeil - are near enough to his level that he is beatable if he makes a mistake. On the US level, the list of near-Galen-level athletes is even longer.

Why risk it? Why not give yourself the best change to win? Galen, running the way he's running, has done just that: win everything. So unless you think its a good thing for the sport for athletes not to execute the plan that they, and their coaches, puts them in the best position to win a race...you should lay of Galen.

Pre, who seems to be the icon of the anti-Galen movement, did just that: he ran the way that he thought gave him the best chance to win. "Control the pace, you control the race," was the tactic Pre thought gave him the best chance to win. "I'm the fastest over the last 600m, I'm unbeatable if I'm in contact then," is the tactic Galen thinks gives him the best chance to win.

It seems like a lot of people are concerned with fast times and honest races first and foremost.

Well, Rupp could break the AR and run all the fast times he wants. But, it wont matter how fast he has ran at the world champs. The only thing that will matter will be his abilities to compete in a highly tactical race where time has no bearing.

He runs to win, not for time. This isn't a time trial it is a race!

Worlds are 6 weeks(?) away. It seems to me like all out honest races with awesome times, as great as they are, would be a good way to get burnt out. He did what he did to win, and he has the A standard. Why would he increase his chances of not being fresh for worlds? Rupp is all about having his best race at the most important run, not running a fast time because he can.

Everyone is going to complain about slow times and cheap wins and how Rupp should run an honest race... but when he goes to worlds and is too flat to run hard because he was running super fast times, you guys will complain that he didn't run smart races and ran too hard and didn't save up for worlds. STFU. He is a professional and he is running the way he is for a reason.

yap he his grand dad migrated from south africa like Alister craig grand parents did so he has the african genes or connection it is not about the skin color

Who the F cares how he ran the race? He races to win, not to entertain fans.

Salazar's interview on Flotrack said he told Rupp he had a 99.5% chance of winning if he waited to kick, and maybe a 98% chance of winning (I don't remember, he might have said 95%) if he took the pace out himself. And he told Rupp just to run for the win.

Rupp did what his coach told him which has worked very well lately.

Lets face it, many Rupp haters still hate his looks and style and thats the only reason they are Rupp haters. No man distance runner runs all out at NCAAs and USATFs. Why is Rupp put to a higher standard? Jenny Barringer is free to run whatever she wants, but tell me about another male who runs all out in strategic races? We have no idea yet if Galen can go full bore for a huge chunk of a race. One thing I do know is that he is the ONLY elite American with a gear and wheels that can switch on and off in a 10K, that can even think of matching those 54 second mid-race surges that the East Africans throw in. The only thing that matters is whether he can match the East Africans in Europe over a full race. We have no idea yet, so no use judging him YET. If he can do it, he will go sub 27, and he will deserve the accolades.

Seriously, Rupp... wrote:

Essentially, I'm just saying--you don't see LeBron only scoring 20 points a game and jogging up and down the court only playing hard when a team comes within a few points of the Cavs because he's saving himself for the post season. You don't see Michael Phelps not trying to go for WRs in Beijing, and he had SEVEN other events including prelims within that three week span. Merritt routinely trashes people. El G ran hard from the gun in almost every race. Lagat is willing to take the lead

Bullshit. Lebron, Phelps, Merritt, El G, and Lagat do exactly what they need to do to win. When the Cavs are down 10 with 2 minutes to play, Lebron and Cavs will foul the opposing team every time they get the ball to try to turn it into a free throw shooting contest. That's not playing to the fans. I haaate the end of NBA games because of this, but it doesn't matter what I think. You employ the best strategy to win.

If there was any other strategy in swimming other than going balls out, Phelps would take advantage of it. Same with Merritt. Swimming and sprinting simply don't have as much strategy to them.

Look at cycling - drafting is a big part of the game, so Lance and company have to play the peleton game, and wait for certain places to push (like the mountains). He doesn't try to lead the whole Tour De France.

El G only leads when he has to. He had to lead the last 800 in Athen, so he did. Lagat tends to only take the lead in a kick. If he ever finds himself up front early in the race, he slows the race on down. Each is using whatever strategy they think is best.

The goal is to win. It's not to win by the largest amount or in the most crowd pleasing manner. Just to win. You utilize whatever strategy you think will lead to victory.

Rupp thought sitting and kicking would work, and it did. It doesn't matter whether you find it watchable.

To the Rupp haters: I would rather win by 0.01s and be US champ than one of you chumps.

I guess we come from different perspectives. When I raced in high school and college, I wanted to give honest efforts--to break PRs. The only reason I wouldn't is if I needed to save myself for team points. If my next race was in six weeks and I hadn't run a hard effort over 5K the entire season, I wouldn't see a problem trying to PR. I ran my own race based on what I knew I was capable of from previous workouts and races. If I was going to run a 3:57 1500m, it didn't matter if I ran 3:57 and got 6th or 3:57 and won. You can't control what other runners are capable of. All you can do is control what you yourself are capable of, and push yourself to those limits.

Honestly, if Rupp ran 26:45 to get 11th at the Olympics I would be more impressed than if he ran 27:45 to win them. And when he runs 27:52 for the win when he is capable of 27:10 with enough energy to wave to the crowd, I think it's embarrassing to people like Ritzenhein, Nelson, and Carney who are struggling down the stretch trying their hardest. My opinion. I don't really care if he won, I respect Ritz and Nelson's efforts much more.

My opinion. But NCAAs and USAs have not made me a Rupp fan. I'm sure he isn't concerned about winning over the crowds, but that's my two cents.

i totally agree. anyone who has ever run a 10k knows that the pace is usually shared by two or a few. that's just how it works out. ritz was trying to keep the race honest, and i think when he ran the 19 second 100m, he was simply saying, "let's work together on this." i didn't expect rupp to take the lead and drop the hammer and run 27:30, but at least do your part. running well within yourself and simply sticking to the back of the leader until the end is p---y sh!t, in my opinion. until rupp stops doing this, i won't be a fan. i want to like the guy, but i can't. and the constant looking back when he knows the race is well in hand seems to me like bragging. i don't mind the arm pumps, because that helps get the crowd into it. but do you really need to look back more than once after you've put 10 meters on ritz in less than 50 meters? he did the same at NCAAs.

he's good, and in all his 5ks and 10ks this spring he's looked like he's jogging out there. however, i think he's in for a huge reality check against the africans. i don't think he'll get the AR, nor break 13. but who knows, i may end up rooting for his punk a$$ in berlin. i also wonder about his new-found kicking ability that seems to have developed way too quickly. salazar is doing something well with his athletes, i just hope it's all legal.

Wow, yes, you do come from a different perspective.

Rupp will only get to run in the Olympics between 3 and 5 times in his life. If he has a chance to win them he needs to take it.

He can set up a time trial to go for a 26:45 whenever he wants to.

It would have in no way impeded his chance to perform at the Olympics to lead a few laps of the USATF 10,000. Or run a hard final mile. Or run an honest effort. They aren't next week. They're in mid August.

OP, what do you mean other africans? niether rupp nor ritz are african so that doesnt make any sense

sjq wrote:

the constant looking back when he knows the race is well in hand seems to me like bragging. i don't mind the arm pumps, because that helps get the crowd into it. but do you really need to look back more than once after you've put 10 meters on ritz in less than 50 meters? he did the same at NCAAs.

I have no problem with how Rupp ran the race; it's USAs and since he already had the standard it made a lot of sense for him to just run to win. Especially if he's hoping to get a chance to lower his PR in the 10,000m at some point this year, going all-out (or even near all-out) in this race wouldn't have made too much sense--you only have so many hard, fast 10,000m efforts in you over the course of a season, and you want to make sure they all count.

That being said, I almost agree with the sentiment expressed in sjq's quoted post above. I don't know that his type of celebration is bragging, per se, but it feels somehow off. Rupp's emotional displays, whether they are genuine or calculated, all look and feel calculated. Real displays of emotion aren't done conditionally after looking back to make sure they won't cost you the race, they're things you just can't hold in--see Ryan Hall at the Olympic Trials marathon; or whoever that guy was who lost the World Road Running Championship a few years ago because he was celebrating as he got passed right before crossing the line.

That's the thing that is appealing about emotional displays--they're not rational or calculated. In fact, when they happen before the end of the race they're often downright stupid--they can cost you the win, or the spot on the team, a record or PR, etc. They show that athletes aren't solely performance-driven machines, and do, in fact have emotions like the rest of us, and that's why they are so compelling.

Rupp's celebrations feel like he is trying to have it both ways. And while the real motivation behind the celebrations is probably only known to the 100 or so people who know Rupp really well, to the thousands of us who care about his results and don't know him really well, the reality of those celebrations is how we perceive them. And to those of us who aren't enthralled by his celebrations, it looks like he's trying to assure his performance (the backwards glances, the big slowdown well before he crosses the line to save everything he can for a later day) and then (only after his performance is a certainty) let out these emotions which he wants us to believe he just has to let out (but was able to hold in until he was absolutely certain they wouldn't hurt him). It feels like he's trying to trick us.

Here's the thing, though--I still root for Galen Rupp. He's the most talented American distance runner we've seen in a while. I honestly believe he has a better chance than any American since Bob Kennedy to medal in a World Championship or Olympic non-marathon distance race (and by the time London rolls around he might have a better chance than Kennedy ever had--he's that talented). And I don't care if he looks effeminate while trying to win that medal, or like a typical distance-running dork, or if he looks cool as shit--I just want him to look genuine. That's what sells, makes athletes into real celebrities, makes them into people we can really root for as they accomplish great things--the window into their souls that they grant us through genuine-seeming emotion. And I just don't feel like we've gotten that from Galen; it seems like he's trying to live up to some standard that just isn't him.

It may be that this isn't the case, these emotional displays really are genuine, and Galen is just a typical, awkward distance runner (like most of us here are), and his emotions come out on the track in a slightly off-feeling way. (It's like when most of us letsrun guys try to pick up girls at bars by just being ourselves; even if we're being genuine, we still probably look pretty effin' awkward.) But it would behoove Rupp, his potential sponsors, and the sport in America as a whole if he could figure out how to make those emotions more genuine-seeming, maybe by saving them for after the race, or by looking back a few less times, or something else--hell, I don't know. But something needs to be different.

I know telling him to do this, to change his behavior, might seem hypocritical, because all this time it seems like I've been saying he needs to be genuine, and if this is him being genuine than he shouldn't have to change. But that's not really what I've been saying; I've been saying he needs to appear genuine, because as a public figure, perception is reality. And right now, while I (and many of the people on here who are dubbed Rupp-bashers for criticizing not how he races but how we perceive his actions) think he's a great distance runner, I don't think he's an incredibly compelling guy.

If you want to be popular (and Rupp being popular will earn money for both him and his sponsors, and well help grow the sport as a whole in America) you need to change your behavior so that people will like you more. It's harsh, but, I'm sorry, that's how the world works.

Yea, Ritz might not have as good of a kick as Rupp, but Rupp can't be categorized to have the same kick elite Africans have. Bekele closes on an average of 53 seconds last lap off of a pretty fast race in terms of in a championship race. He runs around 27:00 on average. He did it in the Olympics in 2008 and 2004. Rupp has a good kick but he will be no where near the Africans(at least the elite ones) in terms of kicking by the time of World Champs. I'd say his best kick is 59 second last lap off a slow race.

Yea, Ritz might not have as good of a kick as Rupp, but Rupp can't be categorized to have the same kick elite Africans have. Bekele closes on an average of 53 seconds last lap off of a pretty fast race in terms of in a championship race. He runs around 27:00 on average. He did it in the Olympics in 2008 and 2004. Rupp has a good kick but he will be no where near the Africans(at least the elite ones) in terms of kicking by the time of World Champs. I'd say his best kick is 59 second last lap off a slow race.

Yea, Ritz might not have as good of a kick as Rupp, but Rupp can't be categorized to have the same kick elite Africans have. Bekele closes on an average of 53 seconds last lap off of a pretty fast race in terms of in a championship race. He runs around 27:00 on average. He did it in the Olympics in 2008 and 2004. Rupp has a good kick but he will be no where near the Africans(at least the elite ones) in terms of kicking by the time of World Champs. I'd say his best kick is 59 second last lap off a slow race.