Good stuff waz keep it coming
Good stuff waz keep it coming
Interestingly in Brendans book he credits andy caines dad John with teaching him what hard training was all about, John Caine was a successful distance runner in the early 70's, he ran 4th or 5th in the Commonwealth games 10k, not sure.
Anwyay he had a reputation for being a tough tough trainer, I'm sure he has passed some of this on to his son, he seems like the same kind of charachter. He gets a few mentions in Ron Hills book 'The Long Hard Road'. I heard a funny story once actually about the Gateshead guys in the 70's. There was a big bunch of them out fora Sunday morning twenty miler, and John was getting pissed because people were picking up the pace and he was tired from a day before race or session, anyway he was having trouble hanging on. The guys used to meet again on a tuesday night for a long pacey run, and this particular Tuesday they were going to do 14, John obviously decided he was going to pay a few of the guys back so deep into the run he started to push it on and get away, nobody took the bait and they all agreed including Brendan to turn off and run 10, so when John gets back to the changing rooms they are already there! he was apparently not too happy. he's a funny guy and obviously passionate about his sons running which is graet to see.
Have you noticed that a few of the guys in the UK who are relatively young and have stuck with the sport are sons of good runners, Andy Caine, Ryan McLeod, Chris Parr (Parrs's dad beat Crammy in a big XC at Gateshead in the 80's and was a good steeplecahser, if his asthma had not been so severe could have been a great runner) The Norman brothers, must be a lifestyle thing. I've noticed Kevin forsters sons name appearing in Scottish results also.
waz wrote:
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Have you noticed that a few of the guys in the UK who are relatively young and have stuck with the sport are sons of good runners, Andy Caine, Ryan McLeod, Chris Parr (Parrs's dad beat Crammy in a big XC at Gateshead in the 80's and was a good steeplecahser, if his asthma had not been so severe could have been a great runner) The Norman brothers, must be a lifestyle thing. I've noticed Kevin forsters sons name appearing in Scottish results also.
certainly have waz, I'm sure they dont piss about with this "less is more" aproach to training, but have learned the true value of good mileage from their dads. theres a time and a place for high, low and medium mileage.
I really wish British runners would wake up and realise that some of them need a lot more mileage.
never mind all this sub 13.30, SUB 28 crap, that was ordinary even in Brendan's day 30 years ago.
SUB 13, SUB 27 LADS YOU CAN DO IT I KNOW YOU CAN.
tinman wrote:
Awhile back a Brit posted some info. on the great runner of past Brendan Foster. He was tough as nails and ran at a high caliber for many races over the years. Please post again some more info. on Foster, especially about his training and racing. Thank you. Cheers!
tinman Brendan Foster would often do 10x400 in 58-59 with 90 seconds recovery and then some very fast 100's, this during a high mileage week 100-130. 6 minute miles steady pace
not the sort of session that would produce high lactate, but more to help maitain speed and aerobic base.
is this the sort of info you were looking for?
I don't think its just about the tarining, I think its because of other things. I think if they have been close to a good group or grown up watching what good people do, not just in races, but the way they live their lives, its not just about your 2 hours of training each day, its about what you eat, when you sleep, what your priorities are. If you can see somebody make those scarifices and see the results that brings then you have a big head start on the rest of the pack. Thats the big thing about distance running, you have to put pennies in the bank for year after yaer with no chance of making a withdrawl but you have to have faith in what you are doing. I remember finsihing almost last in a youths road race but there are few if any of those guys who beat me still running. I guess they got frustarted or lost belief that if they kept on making the scarifices success would come.
I was lucky to grow up in an enviroment when I could see that happen, my dad , like me was not physically strong in his early twenties but in his mid thirties he ran all of his pb's.
A guy I had the pleasure to train with for about 8 years, who was top class, probably the top road runner in England for a while in the early 90's showed me that. He was not a good runner at school, he would just make the school team, by the time he was 18 he was having some success, by the time he was about 23 he ws beginning to run well, at 28 he was running 47 for 10 miles and 63 for half marathons regularly, he won the Morpeth to Newcastle one year beating Steve Jones, Paul davies Hale, Steve Brace, Paul Evans, Peter Tootall. I saw what he had to do to get that, and ok it looked very hard but I could see how it was possible to become a good runner if you did the right things and put the work in. 8 miles at lunchtime and a 14 on a Wednesday night up the biggets hill in the area the night after 6x1mile showed me what it was all about, of course it had taken years to get to a point where his body could accept that amount of work. that was inspirational for me because at the time I was a scrubber but I always believed I could be a decent runner, if Iwas patient and took everything on board, its like an apprentiship, people give up on it too quickly, it might take you until you are 36, who cares. look at dave Taylor, he is running some his best races ever now at 39, its not necessarily a youngsters sports anymore. I think teher are many reasons for this, better shoes, better diet, the social side of the sport, peopel no longer feeling 'old' at 35!
waz - you must be talking about Paul Cuskin. What happened to him?
Dave Taylor is a good role model. I'm always impressed by the frequency of his races, over a range of distances. He had an outstanding run in the Commonwealth Games in 98, though his marathons since have been a bit patchy.
This may be the quote you're looking for:
The limitation of training for international athletics is simply to allow yourself, grudgingly, enough energy to get you through the rest of your daily life. It's training, recovery, training, recovery, all the time, and you spend every day either tired or recovering from being tired, which is why manual work is absolutely out for a distance runner with ambitions. Your body needs to sit at an office desk and recover.
If I have made it sound a daunting prospect, that is not my intention. There are many thousands of club athletes who enjoy weekly competition and regular training without ever experiencing the fatigue to which I have referred, and for athletics' sake, that is a great thing. But I am trying to paint a realistic picture of what it is like to be an international distance runner, and my definition is someone who starts the morning tired and ends the day even more tired.
Paul doesn't run anymore he has had some serious health problems, similar to Ventrotrachacardia, thankfully he is now in reasonable health. He was genetically predisposed to this condition and the years of running may well have helped put it off. He's 40 now and a great guy. He had a real purple patch when i think he could ahve beaten anyone, sad thing is his great performances wree often in small races, apart from his Newcatsle quayside run when he beat everyone who was anyone and got pipped by eamon martin
Brendan's book is fantastic- with great insights into his training.
I read his book this Fall. A good read, lots of race and training analysis. His sample workouts in the back, during his different phases of development, were incredible.
For me, it was perfect timing to read. I was just starting a plan of "Two-a-Days" and it was very fatiguing at first. I kept at it though, realizing that even Mr Foster was "Tired" all of the time! All that had to be done was to look in the back of the book, and I would think of how many dark, cold, rainy 10 milers he probably had done, similar weather in the Great Northwest (US).
A good read, if you can find it!
ty
waz wrote:
I don't think its just about the tarining, I think its because of other things.
Of course, you're right here but I think it is harder to do the right things these days. I really do. As an example, back then the standard diet of meat, potatoes and 2 veg was the only one available. Porridge was the only breakfast. Cars were 'truly' a luxury. People didn't grow up and leave their neighbourhoods as much so club Tuesday&Thursdays were the norm.
So, athletes wern't making all the sacrifices that runners today have to make if they'r going to make. It was simply a way of life back then. I'm not making excuses for todays lot but the little things are harder now, and it's all about the little things.
Sorry, I don't want to start the Old v Young thing again!!
Gateshead was an inspirational place to train. I used to train there on Tuesday nights in the mid 80'S with the Durham University group with Alan Storey leading the sessions. The quality of the training group was quite incredible with Mike McCleod and Jon Solly both running well. There would have been 30-40 there most Tuesdays - a rare sight on a track night these days.
Alan Storey was an inspiration, particular quirks I remember are irregular intervals 700s, 1100s and numbers of reps 5,7. He would also mix track and road work (800 time trial to knacker the legs followed by 20 x 150m hill alternating each ascent between 10k race pace and sprint). With the top guys he would often not let on how far the repetition was but given them a lap-time to run each time they came round. I seem to remember 10x1000 with 30 secs recovery as a particularly nasty session. I also recall Mick McCleod pre-race sharpening up on 4 miles of alternate 200s surging at 30-32s and jogging at 40-45.
Brendan Foster. Great runner. Crap commentator.
Some things never change.
any mofe info i eat this stuff up, love the older guys from thr 70s.
He looks a bit tubby these days. But he has earned the right to eat all the pies.
Legendary runner, anyone know where to get his book?