HOW SHORT IS AUBURN?

yea it is, I spent time there, it's between Iten and Eldoret.

You people are still delusional if you think it is 4800m. Why don't you try 4500.

As for Auburn, I think they were about 2 points short saturday against Vandy.

How many meters in 3.06 miles? I assume you wheeled the course. Did you account for the massive tangent running? 15:46 would be a good track time, especially in Oct. Who needs to come back next spring at that rate?

BTW, what is a 'teamate?' ha ha.

Just checking wrote:

How many meters in 3.06 miles? I assume you wheeled the course. Did you account for the massive tangent running? 15:46 would be a good track time, especially in Oct. Who needs to come back next spring at that rate?

BTW, what is a 'teamate?' ha ha.

Roughly 4932, so 68 meters short. Still about 15 seconds fast.

15 seconds only for the women's race. No way. Teams from our conference ran on 2 different "fast" courses last week. One week later at Auburn kids who had awful days ran 20+ seconds faster at Auburn for 5k. most ran 40 seconds faster, and a fair amount were 50+ seconds faster.

So forget the actual distance, which appears to be short when measured down the middle, and even shorter when running the tangents.

I say let's say conditions were ideal, and there was a week of improvement. I think you conservatively add 30 seconds to the Auburn women's time and you get the fast end of what a kid could run.

irie wrote:

Is Auburn in Kenya?

its a kenyan overseas possession, sort of like guam for the us

abeShorter wrote:

you hit that one right on the head. A bunch of these tools ran 24:20's and don't have the balls to put two and two together and the fact that theyve never broken 26 and realize the course was 350 short. People's last miles were ran in 3:39???? so basically Auburnstaff you're saying add about 20-25 secs on to that??? So the actual last mile was 4:05-4:10...yeah that sounds a bit more realistic. Why don't you just stop being lazy and measure the damn thing to actual scale?

Have to say I agree... Got an email from a mother about her son setting the "school record" for 8k published on their athletic website. I didn't have the heart to tell her the course was blatantly short. YES there are people out there who are claiming insane 8k PR's due to your shoddy worksmanship. If you are going to have a course that is 400 meters short, atleast call it a 7.6k.

Bo knows short wrote:

You people are still delusional if you think it is 4800m. Why don't you try 4500.

As for Auburn, I think they were about 2 points short saturday against Vandy.

You think the 5k course is 500 meters short? Seriously?

for these 5, it was improvements over Griak of:1:401:381:242:112:181:392:21for an average improvement in 1 minute 52 sec.500m might be stretching it, but probably not that far off.

POTUS)* wrote:

Ridiculously short this year... Big-time.. just compare Auburn at Griak (just last week) and then at Auburn this year... come on, now.

ROY GRIAK INVIATIONAL

5. 135 Auburn ( 24:49 2:04:04)

========================================

1 1 Elkanah Kibet JR 23:56 ~ 22:16.35 at Auburn

2 7 Felix Kibioywo JR 24:18 ~ 22:40.24 at Auburn

3 24 Scott Novack JR 25:00 7 ~ 23:36.49 at Auburn

4 29 Girma Mecheso FR 25:06 ~ 22:55.52 at Auburn

5 74 Julian Matthews FR 25:44 ~ 23:26.80 at Auburn

( 92) Joby Peake SO 25:58 ~ 24:19.99 at Auburn

(137) Jeff Sanders FR 27:10 ~ 24:49.19 at Auburn

.............................. wrote:

15 seconds only for the women's race. No way. Teams from our conference ran on 2 different "fast" courses last week. One week later at Auburn kids who had awful days ran 20+ seconds faster at Auburn for 5k. most ran 40 seconds faster, and a fair amount were 50+ seconds faster.

So forget the actual distance, which appears to be short when measured down the middle, and even shorter when running the tangents.

I say let's say conditions were ideal, and there was a week of improvement. I think you conservatively add 30 seconds to the Auburn women's time and you get the fast end of what a kid could run.

I'm just posting what 3.06M is in meters; and for 68 meters, 15 seconds is a reasonable conversion.

Watson, if that really is you then great, thank you for coming on here to try to defend youself.

However, you are trying to develop Auburn by relying on nearly all foreign athletes. This proves not only that you cant coach, but that you are only interested in being a manager of good athletes at Auburn.

To claim that those kids come there to be a part of the Auburn team is rediculous. The foregin athletes come there because of the scholarship they are offered. Unless the other schools were offering the exact same amount, and they chose your school over the other there is no way to say they come there to be a part of Auburn. We know better, not all of us on letsrun are retarted.

Next you will claim you are the reason Elkanah is running well, and we all know that isnt true.

man up and admit, you recruit these kids because you cant coach, and if you dont get results Spry and the crew will have you out of there in no time.

confused.... wrote:

The women's 5k is right on. The men's 8k is 180 meters short according to the coach there.

Contrary to the claims of the Auburn staff and coach above, both the men’s and women’s courses were way off (not a “bit” off) -- at least 300 meters short and probably more. It is embarrassing that Auburn staff/supporters are claiming the women’s course is almost the correct length. Don’t they know what good 5K times are for top women runners? Below I’ll prove the women’s course is hugely short.

Below I’ve listed the top 9 women finishers at the 2008 Auburn Inv. along with their finish place at 2007 XC NCAAs and their 5K XC PRs)

• On average these top 9 runners broke their XC 5K “PR” by a whopping 58 seconds in the Auburn race.

• The top 7 finishers ran their race at a faster pace than did Sally Kipyego when she won the 2007 XC NCAA Championship (6K=19:31) or when Shalane Flanagan set the Terra Haute XC course record in 2002.

• But only two of these runners finished on the top-100 at the 2007 NCAA XC championship.

• Kendra Schaaf’s 15:47 5K time, if ran on the track would place her at #3 on the American Junior All-Time Performance list, behind only Molly Huddle’s 15:37 and Lindsey Scherf’s 15:43.

Obviously the Auburn women’s 5K course was short by over a minute, just as the men’s was. Perhaps everyone who ran this race initially thought they set a PR. In truth, this women’s course was at least 300 meters short.

1. Kendra Schaaf, Fr (Wash) 15:47___(DNC, 5K XC PR=16:30)

2. Christine Babcock, Fr (Wash) 16:02___(DNC, 5K XC PR=17:03)

3. Marie Lawrence, So (Wash) 16:05___(#117, 6K XC PR=20:23 – about a 16:50 5K)

4. Hollie Knight, So (Auburn) 16:08___(DNC, PR=21:45 6K at ’07 Chili Pepper Inv? – about a 18:00 5K)

5. Racheal Marchand, Sr (Iowa) 16:16___(DNC, 5K XC PR=17:02)

6. Katie Follett, Jr (Wash) 16:18___(#19, 6K XC PR=20:43 – about a 17:00 5K)

7. Lauren Saylor, So (Wash) 16:18___(#253, 6K XC PR=21:27 – about a 17:45 5K)

8. Amanda Miller, Sr (Wash) 16:31___(#108, 6K XC PR about 21:35? – about a 17:45 5K)

9. Anita Campbell, Sr (Wash) 16:32___(#20, 6K XC PR=20:20 – about a 16:45 5K)

The 1st place finisher sent new XC 5K PR by 43 seconds, 2nd by 61 seconds, 3rd by about 45 seconds, 4th by almost 2 minutes, 5th by 46 seconds, 6th by about 40 seconds, 7th by 80 seconds, 8th by about 75 seconds, and 9th by about 15 seconds.

FYI, no handheld GPS devices are accurate enough to measure a XC course. A multi-thousand dollar backpack GPS device is needed to do this. Measuring wheels also slip on grass and shouldn’t be used. You need not be lazy and use a 200-300 foot plastic tape. It’s also helpful to be very careful adding up the measurements and to know that a 5K course is 16,404 feet long.

For Auburn staff to defend the length of the women’s course, shows they don’t know what they are talking about. Others have already convincingly proven the men’s course is hugely short as well. About 600 runners from 33 different schools made a big effort to attend this meet. Yet Auburn couldn’t spend about 10 man hours to get the course lengths even approximately correct. That’s not fair. Auburn should be embarrassed.

Coaches, next year you might want to consider the Notre Dame Inv., Bill Dellinger Inv., or the Paul Short Inv. – all on the same weekend at this Auburn Inv. (a.k.a. the Auburn Very Short Inv.)

If we're going to point fingers, Lehigh needs to be included. Their women's course is nearly as bad.

The only mistake I can see is that Auburn listed the measurements as 5k and 8k. They should have listed the accurate distance. Other than that....big deal. It is cross country and we should never measure times in cross country, just competition. Everyone knows the course is not 5k or 8k. Next time coaches, list the right distance.

As for the make-up of Auburn's team, let me ask you this. You accept a job at a university that is strongly focused on track. The Head Track Coach wants to win on the track, which means having balance to your team. You cannot throw big money at a 9:15 kid to win on the track. For some teams that put all of their money into CC and distance, they can do that. Syracuse, NAU, Portland, NC State, W&M and others are doing that...good for them. You have a completely different situation at a place like Auburn. You want to have a good cross country team and help win on the track. What do you do? You recruit the best athletes that you can get. You try to recruit the top American kids, but they are not interested in your program because you don't have 15-20 years of tradition. So, do you give money to sub-par kids, give up on having a good program or go and get the best kids you can? That is what Coach Watson is doing.

I remember earlier this year when German Fernandez decided to go to Ok State and people criticized that decision. They said he should go to Stanford, Wisco, Colorado or Oregon. Ok State has been a great CC team for years now. They don't have the 20 year tradition that the other schools have, however, those coaches were not there 20 years ago. Those coaches are banking on tradition that preceded them. How do you start your own tradition? Johnny Mac used foreigners to build Arkansas, then brought Americans in and had success with both. However, he had to start with foreigners. I think German made a great decision and I think Coach Watson can coach and is building a great team at Auburn.

ALL the coaches from this meet are publicly claiming 5k and 8k PR's, school records and so on for their runners and schools. What does that say about them when they KNOW the course is dramatically short? Compare Washington and Oregon State times on this course to 6k times on the very fast Sundodger course this year. It's pretty pathetic and flat out false.

Everyone complaining about this is a huge running loser and needs to stop being so bitter. It has been established that the course was short, get over it you tools. It is running! Holy crap you would have thought Pete killed someone. And anyone who is questioning Petes ability as a coach is just plain ignorant. Get a f'ing life you huge nerds. Grand River Runner especially, go f*** yourself.

cmurph wrote:

You think the 5k course is 500 meters short? Seriously?

500 meters at 5:30 pace would take 1:42.

500 meters at 5:00 pace would take 1:33.

What do you think?

ok who measured the course from auburn? im guessing that they are from the south and everyone knows southern people are dumb and lazy. so it really comes down to did they not know the how far a 5k or 8k was or were they to lazy to find an extra 200 to 400 meters.

Run77 wrote:

You need not be lazy and use a 200-300 foot plastic tape. It’s also helpful to be very careful adding up the measurements and to know that a 5K course is 16,404 feet long.

Did you really just suggest that they use a measuring tape to measure their course? Really? That's just retarded. Do you think that's what they do in Terre Haute? No. Absolutely not.

I dont think Auburn can call itself the Auburn Very Short Inv., I believe that name was taken by alerady Dillenger Invite in 2006, remember? 77XXm. No big deal. Get over it. A race is a race.