Ben Johnson interview aboot Marion, it's pretty bad...

Charlie Francis wrote a book about it. "Speed Trap" I think it's called. Ben's training regimes, as well as what he took and when and Charlie Francis' theories on why Ben Johnson tested positive. It's both earnest and interesting.

As for the '88 final, I remember hearing something like 7 of 8 of the competitors in that final at one time or another in their career tested positive. Of course, Some were proven guilty (Linford Christie) and others let off for various reasons (Carl Lewis). It's interesting even though you cannot make any concrete conclusions from it. It is moot.

Asterix wrote:

Mandingo wrote:

I am in the minority by trying to explain but not back up what he did.

Just curious, but if you are ever pulled over for speeding, have you tried to tell the cop that "everybody else is speeding" or that "you let that hot chick off with just a warning

With respect to the suggested storyline of some reporter overhearing IOC dudes talking about the positive test, I presume this reporter did his/her job and actually wrote an article about this event? Surely that would be a big scoop in amongst all the other noise about the positive result.

Asterix is of course the person I alluded to earlier.

Asterix; we've had this discussion before. You mistakenly think, or lack the reading comprehesion to grasp what I'm saying. I SAID HE SHOULD BE PUNISHED FOR BREAKING THE RULES. Your cop example is very weak and not comparable at all. I never said it's okay because everyone else was doing it. That would be making an excuse. Never did that. What I did was explain more behind what was going on having been around at that time. In addition rules for track and field meets are inherently different that criminal law in both their intent and purpose. YOu act as if Ben never got caught and never got punished. Maybe you put a big Ben Johnson poster on your wall after he won and had to rip it down after he got caught. Regardless,a running message board is the place for speculation, what ifs etc. I don't know why you read more into posts than exist.

As far as the story of the overheard test results; had the positive test never been revealed THAT would have been the story. As it turns out, the story of overhearing of a positive result was scooped by the official positive result obviously.

Don't worry, ben gave his medal back. YOu can sleep now.

Fair enough. We're in agreement then.

Why is it not comparable at all? Many people (presumably not you) have made the argument that Ben was treated unfairly and that he should have been allowed to keep his medal and record since others were also cheating. The point, as you apparently state, is that it doesn't matter who else is doing bad stuff. It doesn't change the bad stuff Ben did.

He did get caught (not once, not twice, but three times) and has been punished according to the protocols he knew full well existed. I just have a problem with the whole 'Ben was/is a victim' routine.

And speculations really amount to squat if there isn't any substance to back them up.

But everyone loves to read about the evil, sinister bad-guy big organizations. Are you saying that despite this there was no interest in reading about how the IOC was corrupt and was attempting to cover up an embarrassing event at their crown jewel competition?

Yellowbeard wrote:

Oh really? Well, why don't you explain to us poor saps just what IS the point?

For you to even understand the explanation, you'd have to know the meaning of "scapegoat" which you clearly do not.

Asterix wrote:

Why is it not comparable at all? Many people (presumably not you) have made the argument that Ben was treated unfairly and that he should have been allowed to keep his medal and record since others were also cheating. The point, as you apparently state, is that it doesn't matter who else is doing bad stuff. It doesn't change the bad stuff Ben did.

But everyone loves to read about the evil, sinister bad-guy big organizations. Are you saying that despite this there was no interest in reading about how the IOC was corrupt and was attempting to cover up an embarrassing event at their crown jewel competition?

IN the first page of this thread I was very clear about what I thought about Ben:

"I totally agree that Ben Johnson was taking steroids and deserved to get caught and lose his medals. Absolutely."

So you are basically using the cop example to refute what "many people, (presumably not you)" say then it has NOTHING to do with me! I said he should lose he medals.

I still don't know what your problem is with this. THat is why the cop example is not applicable.

As far as the attempted cover up story; at that point who cares? In this case there was no cover up. There was a real positive test for them to feast on. IT's becoming pretty 'clear' with the Marion Jones case and others who tested negative so many times then all of a sudden positive that there must have been some cover ups at some level.

A world in which a Ben Johnson is a "villain" and a Haile Gebrselassie is a universally loved "hero" is a very strange place indeed.

reality is fun wrote:

A world in which a Ben Johnson is a "villain" and a Haile Gebrselassie is a universally loved "hero" is a very strange place indeed.

How dare you speak the truth. Geb smiles! Ben looked like Sonny Liston. Ben was bad for the IAAF. Geb is GOOD for the IAAF!