Moroccan kids doping in plane sight?

America doesn't believe it owns what does not belong to us but we do believe that we contribute much more to the world than the other countries combined. Now why is that? Maybe it’s because we've got a greater cross section of the world residing in our borders than the rest of the world and an infinite level of opportunity for people to achieve here than anywhere else. That is unless you’re lucky enough to be born into the small percentage of families that own Europe, Africa and Latin America.The very same internet (very clearly not a socialist idea, it was originally for US military purposes - but please you can still hohohoho yourself 'til you're blue in the face) you're so gleefully banging away at, amongst other numerous, no countless, contributions that this Country has provided to the rest of the world.If other countries do not want to be beholden to the USA then they should stop taking our money. So Brit 1500 what would you like to do? Would you be willing to stop using American based or inspired products altogether, stop relying on the American economy to subsidize your own feeble one? Give up the opportunity to achieve because of what America brings to the rest of the world? Sure all this stuff comes at a price. If we must fight your wars, settle your differences and protect your sovereignty then the least you can do is take it like a man instead of some sniveling little piece of Euro trash.But that’s just my opinion.BTW - I do believe that America is the most drug reliant culture on Earth. It is unfortunate that some of it leaks into our Athletics program and our everyday lives but when some of those drugs save your grandma or keep your dad alive long enough to see his grandchildren than maybe you’ll stop laughing long enough to be appreciative.

Brit1500m,

I'm going to tread carefully here, because I'm not sure that you're willing to approach this discussion with an open mind. But, if you are, here is what I have in response.

I don't feel any sense of ownership over the Letsrun message board. I welcome all posters, from all nations, including the United Kingdom. I imagine that I share your enthusiasm for the democratic potential of the internet and message boards like Letsrun.

If you'll indulge me, I'd like to try to explain why I don't believe the discussion of American sprinters is relevant.

1. The context of the conversation has been Moroccan distance and mid distance runners, not sprinters.

2. I am a distance runner, and I am not particularly interested in sprinting. I care for sprinting a bit more than I care for other sports, because I get to see it first hand, but I essentially view distance running as a separate endeavor in the sporting world. I am against performance enhancing drug use in all sports, but because I am a fan of distance running, I devote my energy to drug use in distance running. This is, of course, only my preference.

3. I couldn't agree more that American sprinters have a notorious history of performance enhancing drug use. I find this fact abhorrent, especially since, as has been mentioned, there have been instances where positive drug test were suppressed by USATF. Suppression of positive tests, however, does not entail a state-run drug program. Furthermore, I believe that USATF's involvement in this behavior has concluded. The positive test of Justin Gatlin suggests that USATF no longer hides positive drug results, but I cannot know for sure. I also imagine that some US sprinters continue to use PEDs, but I do not know this for certain either.

4. Most importantly, I do not believe that the existence of American sprinting cheaters precludes any condemnation of Moroccan sprinting cheaters. I am an equal opportunity critic of cheaters, and as such, I feel free to criticize cheaters in Morocco and in the United States. And because I believe that American distance runners, and, for that matter British distance runners, are clean, I have a more vested interest in opposing suspected Moroccan cheaters: they are stealing from athletes I believe in and support.

Regarding your last two comments, "1) hardly anyone outside of america likes america or american athletes" and "2) the world laughs at your dirty track programme," I am saddened if the rest of the world does not like America or American athletes, but there is little I can do to change that attitude aside from conducting myself with professionalism and respect for other nations, cultures, and athletes. I am also concerned that the world laughs at "my" dirty track program, but I suspect that they don't laugh at our distance runners, who by all reports are a delightful bunch, and instead at our sprinters- and really, who can blame them? You reap what you sow, after all.

I hope that helps clarify things,

Peter

Doping sprinters are indeed a valid topic of discussion here. Good grief, Wejo devotes half of the front page (or more) to doping, especially to that of sprinters. Look how much ink Gatlin got the last few days. Indeed!

Living it up on the homepage wrote:

Doping sprinters are indeed a valid topic of discussion here. Good grief, Wejo devotes half of the front page (or more) to doping, especially to that of sprinters. Look how much ink Gatlin got the last few days. Indeed!

Yes! Agreed! On letsrun, talk of doping sprinters is relevant.

The question is whether doping sprinters are relevant to this conversation about Moroccan distance runners, and I believe the answer to be no. But, reasonable people can disagree.

Peter

We were talking about Moroccan distance runners here but now we're headed in the wrong direction again.

"the world laughs at your dirty track programme" ?????

Brit1500: First,let's assume you you're only talking about sprinting here.

Second, I have watched US distance running grow enoumously over the last few years. I am a foreigner myself, but I can assure you distance running in the United States is perhaps the cleanest in the world. There are no world beaters to hang with the mighty Kenyans and Ethiopians, but every year there are about 70 runners who run under 14 minutes for 5000 meters and about that many who run under 3.45 for 1500 meters. That is depth and a sign of interest in the beautiful sport that track & field is.

And if do want to talk about sprinting,the 400 meters this year at national had over 40 competitors. The USATF qualifying marks are pretty tough, as is the sheer volume of competitors across America with all its NCAA, NAIA, JUCO divisions, clubs and association.

Only two people ran over 46 seconds in the heats last being 46.08. Let's assume half of those are juiced. That still leaves enough to put together about five 4x4 teams that could win the worlds and set national records im most of the 200 countries you're so convince hate America and "its dirty track programme". Do you understand what I'm hinting at here?

Unfortunately, out of so many peopple, there are occasionally those with dissapoint with their choices. But there are a lot of honest athletes out there that are being lumped unjustly in the same category and its not fair to them.

Don't let world politics influence your rhetoric here. Judging by your screen name, you are British and therefore guilty by your country's association with America after all, aren't you? Or at least that's how it would appear to a muslim Moroccan, who whether on EPO or not, may think you're an ass regardless.

The track record shows.. that if doping happens ... something or someone will leak it at some point. for years we thought US sprinters were legit.. minus flo jo.. but eventually the truth got out and athlete after athlete got exposed...

Same here...i am not sure why K. Skah blurted this out.. but

Asmae Lezgui (SP?)

Boulami (the steeple chase Wr) were busted.. and this is a second wave.

KENYA and Ethiopia are yet to have this level of scandal.. there are some athletes that have tested positive from these countries.

Alene Emere Reta is the only ethiopian that tested positive and he was based in japan.

And i cannot remember any elite kenyan that has tested positive.

For all the talk .. where is the proof,, we can't just accuse people willy nilly.