Should runners care more about aero?

Drafting behind other runners is undoubtedly important, but beyond that I’m just not sure there’s that much to be gained at running speeds. I believe they looked at the effect of switching from shorts to half tights in the breaking 2 project and found the effect on running economy would be something like 7 seconds over the course of the marathon, which could easily be undermined if they were worse of heat dissipation. I’d love to see more research, but I think the effects at running speeds are just pretty small.

I believe Velocity in these equations is a squared term. So the faster you are going, the more important aerodynamics becomes. Since running speeds are relatively low, it’s not all that important.

Because it doesn’t make any difference. You believe that after decades of competitive distance running, you’ve come up with something that will revolutionize the sport in a “massive” way

Alright, massive may be overstating it. But you know I mean relative to current standards.

I think EK's sub 2 project is a great example of how we all recognize there's gains to be made, even if small, since it has an asterisk with the result. But as you said, is 7 seconds worth it? At that level, it certainly is if it's determined that savings actually exists.

Are you messing with me?

“But we also know that there's massive gains to be made here.”

Yes, you didn’t use the word “revolutionize” so I didn’t use quotation marks. Something that is going make a massive gain in the sport is certainly revolutionary.

I corrected it.

It has been utilized greatly, actually! Runners use pacers all the time. Kipchoge scientifically used aerodynamics to break the 2 hour marathon barrier.

However, some believe that utilizing external help to improve aerodynamics is bad for the sport. Really running without external aero help is the heart of running. When someone starts running their personal aerodynamics is horrible, but they do drills to improve their running efficiency. This tweaks their body so aerodynamics is better, posture, stride length, and arm placement. There other improvements too, like oxygen usage, mental power, and nutritional usage, but it is internal to the runner.

All you have to do is watch the Chicago Marathon. At the back of pack, you see runners bobbing their heads, flailing their arms across their bodies, unsteady hips and bad posture. Go to the mid pack, the runners are a little better controlling their bodies. By the time you are watching the elites , the runners are a thing of beauty with their heads steady, arms & legs like pistons thumping up & down, and pelvis harden in support. Good runners are self aerodynamic.

That is why part the running are against pacers, (whether others, cyclists, or cars) and the new shoes, because they take away some of the skill of being a really good runner. It is a thing of beauty to watch the really talented runners. External aerodynamic products for runners takes the magic away. Keep the magic in running! IMHO

Yes, the way to go is aeropygian. It’s all about the glutes.

Kipchoge wasn’t benefited by just normal drafting. He ran in a tight pack of 6+ guys with three running side by side directly in front of him.

I’m not convinced pacers make much difference on the track. Bekele ran even splits during his WRs, while running the 1st with a pacer and all by his lonesome the 2nd. Moorcroft’s 13 flat WR was a solo effort.

I've thought about this before.

On a normal day, no. You're just not going fast enough.

Into a one way headwind, certainly.

Running into a 20mph headwind in my cycling bib shorts and fitted cycle top is easier than a loose top and shorts...

But compared to a race shorts and vest? Minimal.

Drafting is massive in cycling, far more Mminimal in running. Hence, a long solo break is far easier in running without being reeled in by a chase pack working together, as in cycling.

TLDR drafting in a group would help on a very windy day, but that's about it.

I think the largest aero gains to be had is in the shoe and lower leg. Because “I’m not actually smart” is smart I think and drag is a function of a square of velocity. And for about half the time the shoe and lower leg is stationary, then the other half the time it is moving ar about twice the velocity you running. From the back of your stride, through the air, to front of the stride again.

From

pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov

The metabolic cost of emulated aerodynamic drag forces in marathon running - PubMed

The benefits of drafting for elite marathon runners are intuitive, but the quantitative energetic and time savings are still unclear due to the different methods used for converting aerodynamic drag force reductions to gross...

Link:pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/35834628/

"Combining our metabolic results with existing aerodynamic models indicates that at 2-h marathon pace, optimal drafting likely allows a marathoner to run between 3 min 42 s and 5 min 29 s faster. Our rule-of-thumb (∼6% increase in gross metabolic power per 1% body weight of horizontal impeding force) will allow others to estimate the performance enhancement of different drafting formations."