Cheptegei and Gidey-Doping or not doping?

weedman wrote:

my 2c wrote:

You're wrong about this. There's nothing to be gained from unrestrained baseless speculation.

Agreed. This does nothing but harm the sport. Even if he was doping, without proof, you are encouraging trial by media.

How does this harm the sport? The sport has already been proven to be a dirty sport.

astro wrote:

It's doping. Gidey did not even pretend to be winded. That's EPO. Nothing compares. Saw it a million times with Armstrong, That is how powerful it is.

IDK what they showed on the international feeds, but the feed on Norwegian national television showed Gidey clearly sick and trowing up for several minutes right after the race.

Who are their Renato/Rosa type handlers?

Always odd that these super African champions always have a sketchy Italian or Dutchman standing in the shadows, counting their cash.

rekrunner wrote:

Just the same, you could probably make a credible case for suspecting the Chinese women of benefiting from steroids and other male hormones.

EPO & androgens - the popular stack with dopers then as well as now.

Or maybe they are just the best runners at the moment

In a year of Covid, where testing is probably down due to less meets, travel restrictions, etc there have been a good amount of WR being set. So personally I question these WR's being clean. Plus there was a big article about a new designer drug starting to show up in drug tests among cyclists that was stronger than EPO, i'm sure it's in the track world by now.

Nope. The rule of thumb is that even the most talented natural athletes cannot beat the dopers.

Greg Lemond and Fignon were the two greatest riders of their era. But once supercharged EPO doping emerged in the early 1990s they could no longer compete. Fignon is the one who described EPO as turning mules into race horses.

There are records still on the books set by known dopers that have not been beaten in decades, such as the records set by Flo Jo.

Lance Armstrong we forget was a great natural athlete, becoming a competitive triathlete in his teens. But he immediately learned that it was dope or go home.

Really the only instance of a natural athlete beating dopers was probably Janet Evans when she defeated the East German chemical freak show.

The China example is so difficult for deluded fans because it shows just how powerful doping and EPO can be, a nation with no running tradition suddenly becoming world beaters and then just as quickly disappearing once they were caught and the govt cracked down. No claims of some national running mystique or tradition overcomes it.

Great. EPO on steroids. Yet the mantra will be "Clean living and hard work"!

astro wrote:

It's doping. Gidey did not even pretend to be winded. That's EPO. Nothing compares. Saw it a million times with Armstrong, That is how powerful it is.

The rule is simply that if it seems like doping, it definitely is. Especially in distance sports.

If you stopped fapping so much to your white runners while vilifying African athletes, you might avoid the current process of going blind.

If this is not an expression of total effort then I have a bridge to sell you.

birdbeard wrote:

Go back and look at Bekele finishing his WRs. Looks even less tired. Kipchoge too. Elite runners aren't totally gassed at the end of a race, even a WR race.

This ^^^^

They're trained to run at max aerobic capacity and at that level the only limitation is raw speed endurance. Just as a 100-meter sprinter isn't gassed at the end while running at top short distance speed, neither is a world class distance runner when running at max aerobic speed.

Agree, add in that this was set after period of virtually no testing from countries without blood testing labs anyway.

rekrunner wrote:Which of my claims above do you think need to be proved?

How about this one:

rekrunner wrote:It takes a weak mind from an athlete who doesn't believe in himself/herself to believe that doping would help achieve distance world records, and a weak body to justify the need for doping in the first place.

You claim - based on what, your believe? - that Kiptum has a weak mind and a weak body. Too funny.

And this one:

rekrunner wrote:It is unlikely that an athlete of weak mind and weak body could set the world record from a strong world record like Bekele's and Dibaba's.

Strange faith of yours. Also, was Tadese's world record, despite lasting for nine years, not strong?

astro wrote:

Or so Armstrong and dozens of other cyclists that were publicly called out over the years were clean? And the East Germans? And the Soviets? Yep, that's it. LOLL.

Lance Armstrong's power outputs weren't superhuman.

Which brojo are you though, just so I know?

LOL. OK.

What happen when your go too move of last resort results in yawns? Seen every variation.

astro wrote:

What happen when your go too move of last resort results in yawns? Seen every variation.

Try English, please.

I could try gibberish, because that is the only response I have seen.

Look I get it. In cycling there was this almost touching phenomenon where fans of certain riders would be convinced that everyone was doping except their hero. Contador could have results annulled, get suspended, have positive test results, be on Armstrong's team, and yet magically he was "clean". Pantani had hematocrit levels that threatened to turn his blood into sludge, still has records that a generation of dopers could not beat, but he was "clean." Etc.

Sorry but your heroes are frauds.

I think this video sums up current testing and PED use in T&F.

https://youtu.be/b-UdyXxPSJ0

He points out how lenient testing is and it’s almost as if they don’t want to catch users.

When Chelimo finally broke Barrios’ record in ‘93 I was awestruck - even though it was only a second. Never in my wildest fantasy dreamworld did I ever think the record would drop by almost a minute since then.

astro wrote:

Sorry but your heroes are frauds.

Probably, but with that in mind, what makes you think that Janet Evans was (probably) clean? An American during the 80s beating the other dopers?