Even with a degree you still have to study the technical guides to become an Oracle DBA and get your certification. Meaning a degree merely certifies you as smart enough to pass the HR filter, but not guaranteed to master the material needed for whatever job you're applying for.
Anyone can buy the Oracle DBA guide or study guides for other certifications and learn the stuff online...you know, following the same process the individual with the degree would have to follow...
I taught myself calculus at a level that went beyond what we were doing in AP calculus. I actually understood the proofs and could do them. Other students is could not.
yesIknowIT wrote:
"Even though i not is went to university"
Haha what? Doesn't sound like you even went to high school!
Oh my! You did well in HIGH SCHOOL calculus! Wow you must be a genius then!! You're definitely a scientist because you did well in high school math bro!
Just because every dev with a bit of experience and gas in the tank calls themselves a computer "engineer" or "scientist" doesn't mean they're an actual engineer or scientist.
bartholomew_maxwell wrote:
If you knew what you were talking about you'd know that computer science is a hard science. Even though i not is went to university I still did well in math in high school taking AP Calculus. I know how to design software from the ground up. I've written scrabble playing software.
But they're the ones with a load of debt...meanwhile I get to put aside an extra $600/month that doesn't go towards student loan debt...Who is the smart one??
yesIknowIT wrote:
You have to say you're more impressed with a self-starter because you never made it through university!
And well I agree that going to NorthWestern for a business degree doesn't in and of itself make you unique it's sure a HECK of a lot more unique than all the people becoming devs then calling themselves "computer scientists" or "computer engineers" or "designers".
You know what the different between you calling yourself a designer or scientist or whatever and an actual electrical engineer or real scientist is? They actually have the proof and have gone through the steps and education to get there! They've taken the high level PHD and Masters math and theory! They don't just sit in design meetings at their trendy office and then call themselves something they aren't after a few years of code monkeying around.
bartholomew_maxwell wrote:
A degree is just nothing more than a license saying "I'm smart enough to meet the basic requirements for doing X"....It doesn't mean you're unique or going to be good at doing X in the real world. A university lecture hall is a simulated environment, not a real environment. All of the answers start and end at the university. It's meaningless.
I'm more impressed by the self-starter.
bartholomew_maxwell wrote:
Fortunately I am in an IT career where you can learn all you need online and with an IDE. Didn't have to pay a bunch of money to a university to learn Java. Self-taught.
That's the way to do it. Good for you.
Universities are designed to keep middle class and poor people poor.
footballlover76 wrote:
while the uni grads are out interacting with real people and making important decisions . Enjoy!
No, because due to the virus that's not really a virus, interacting with real people is not allowed anymore.
yesIknowIT wrote:
Oh awesome dude you saved a little bit of money when you were younger.
I bet all the MDs with large country mansions doing super meaningful work and careers are thinking, "drat, why wasn't I as smart as that bartholomew guy who did so well in high school calculus!"
bartholomew_maxwell wrote:
But they're the ones with a load of debt...meanwhile I get to put aside an extra $600/month that doesn't go towards student loan debt...Who is the smart one??
None of this matters in the end. As long as I put God first in my life I'm always going to be good.
Important decisions like skipping class to protest and get a free $5000 handbag while demanding people call you by the correct pronoun?
bartholomew_maxwell wrote:
yesIknowIT wrote:
Oh awesome dude you saved a little bit of money when you were younger.
I bet all the MDs with large country mansions doing super meaningful work and careers are thinking, "drat, why wasn't I as smart as that bartholomew guy who did so well in high school calculus!"
None of this matters in the end. As long as I put God first in my life I'm always going to be good.
If you are as smart as you think you are, you'd stop replying to every poster.
A lot of money for a below average school like Northeastern. Half the students should not be in college and the other half should be at a two year community school.
DanM wrote:
A lot of money for a below average school like Northeastern. Half the students should not be in college and the other half should be at a two year community school.
Really? Northeastern is not below average. Far from it. Things have changed since you went to school, Gramps.
It's a legal thing. Student hires a lawyer and sues.
If lawyer takes case, you pay him if/when you win case.
If college were decent human beings, which they are not, they would
refund 90% of what you paid them. They get the 10% Chinese fee.
WOW. So these students traveled abroad, only to be dismissed and to lose their tuition money, and then will probably have to spend even more money traveling back to their home countries amidst an already bad situation to be traveling in? Not condoning them being idiots with the gathering but that’s a low blow by Northeastern. Highway robbery like someone else said!
jbhe wrote:
DanM wrote:
A lot of money for a below average school like Northeastern. Half the students should not be in college and the other half should be at a two year community school.
Really? Northeastern is not below average. Far from it. Things have changed since you went to school, Gramps.
It is an average school. Its acceptance rate is 19%, and it's a private school. Taking its tuition into consideration, it's an utterly horrible deal. Really, only the top-ranking private schools are worth their tuition in any way. For all the middling private schools like Northeastern, the entire student body would be better off at a public school.
yesIknowIT wrote:
righhht - so now you're sitting in meetings talking about code...exciting....
Oh also, everyone and their dog where I'm from is "team lead" or "head UX designer". These guys are a dime a dozen.
Finally - you're trashing kids that went to a good school, had the time of their lives for 4 years collaborating with peers, making friends, building networks and getting a credential from a reputable source on their resume while you sat alone learning how to code for 2 years then worked as a junior dev for another couple years so you could finally get a job title that everyone and his dog has?
I went to a mid-priced top 50 university to get a 4 year degree in computer science. Started off as a code monkey. It was actually quite fun.
Twenty years later, I'm a systems analyst and have led several different teams on major IT initiatives. I do a ton of designing and business analysis. Trust me, if you're good, you'll be meeting with people all the time about their business and helping them to streamline both their business workflow as well as recommend technology. If your customer trusts you, you'll be making important decisions with them.
So...yeah. I wouldn't generalize about how "fun" a career is. To each his own.
BTW, the Indians are fine at programming, but they usually can't think outside the box. They need creative help, and leadership.
bartholomew_maxwell wrote:
What is a college degree really worth anymore? wrote:
$36,500 for Northeastern? You gotta be kidding me. Even Northwestern isn’t worth that much. When are people going to stop paying these ridiculously inflated tuition prices for 2nd and 3rd tier universities, especially when so much “learning” can be done remotely now?
As long as the Feds sign off on the loans they'll keep paying it! They're not thinking long term about job market and student loan debt.
You're a fool if you get in a bunch of debt for a non-hard sciences major.
Federal guaranteed loans are capped.
https://www.nerdwallet.com/article/loans/student-loans/much-borrow-college#:~:text=The%20maximum%20amount%20you%20can,%2420%2C500%20annually%20and%20%24138%2C500%20total.
The students were "warned' many times about the restrictions.
Alas, I suspect a settlement will be reached where the money will be given as credit for when they return to Northeastern.
bartholomew_maxwell wrote:
yesIknowIT wrote:
Oh also, coding isn't a "hard science". A good % of high school kids in Seattle where I live could do your job. Heck, half the country of India could do what you do. Every introvert with a computer and some free time has the potential to take your job. The real value is the people who can actually identify, market, sell, supply chain etc. the product. Which you have no idea how to do. You just build software like all the other millions of products out there.
Ugh yeah you are DEFINITELY clueless!!!!
Coding is not a hard science but I work in a hard science domain where you must understand hard sciences to develop proper algorithms and designs!!!
Do you think any kid in India could write a game engine in C++??? I guess that physics and maths are so easy that anyone can do it right???
It all depends on the INDUSTRY you're working in!!! All of those Indian coders are doing very basic business rules software. where the design is already provided to them, down to what screens they'll need and what rules the software should follow.
The real BRAINS do the DESIGNS. Designing is where deep understanding comes in that goes beyond simply throwing code in an editor.
This conversation is like watching two drunk raccoons trying to hump the same deflated soccer ball.
Great job staying on topic everyone.
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