SlowFatMaster wrote:
How were you doing your Yasso 800s?
5k pace (5:50-6:00) & 3m recovery.
They were part of my marathon training plan so built up to 14x reps starting from 4
SlowFatMaster wrote:
How were you doing your Yasso 800s?
5k pace (5:50-6:00) & 3m recovery.
They were part of my marathon training plan so built up to 14x reps starting from 4
I know you said you thought 800s were too long. Nothing wrong with shorter intervals, but I believe you need some long interval workouts to run good middle distance or distance races. I happen to like Tinman CV 1000s. For you (18:30 5k shape) they would be about 2:52 per 1000 with a 200 jog.
Tinman's formula is 420 divided by 5k time = how many minutes of CV to do in a workout. So you could do 5 or 6 of them.
dadsfadsfdasfdsafdas wrote:
The Wizard JS wrote:
Exactly! Daniels found out that there is just negligible difference in what is achieved in the different speeds, and therefore it`s much smarter to stay at 5 k race pace and also reduce the risk of injury. A well-known physiologist who gave support to the fact that this is how it should be seen is the Norwegian L-I Tjelta. Ingebrigtsens personal Ph.
Great so now you are saying tinman is 100% right and that to do a vo2max workout you should be running at 90s pace. Seems like you are confused about the difference between what a. workout should be and when to pick which type of workout to use.
If you want to argue that vo2max workouts should be uses sparingly, my impression is that tinman will agree. Heck isn't his claim to fame those slow CV intervals?
What do you talk about? Where did I say something which would indicate that Tinman is right? In my world of world class coaching maxVO2 paced intervals should stay at around 95% of MHR , the same as what Daniels explained is the best because you don`t get better effect of running them at 3 k pace , and running them at 5 k pace reduce the risk of injury compared to the faster 3 k pace. And one more time ; The so called maxVO2 intervals just contributes together with the other two main factors to raise the individual maxO2 to the possible level given by birth ( the genes). The main purpose with the maxVO2 intervals is to make the energy process at 5 k race pace to be more efficient, and this happens when the runner repeat the workout regularly .
There is obviously some confusion about training for VO2max improvement. It really comes down to training the heart's ability to pump blood. Or to put it even simpler training the heart muscle.
You cannot train the heart muscle directly obviously so you need some effort of other great muscles to prompt the need for oxygen hence ordering the heart to pump blood. Running at a brisk pace is a good activity.
The heart gives the good respons to training at over 80% of max heart rate and really good over 85%. You do not need to reach a heart rate of 95% to train efficiently. If you do then you will not sustain the training for enough time. The heart muscle should ideally pump blood for over 12-15 minutes at a rate over 85% of max heart rate.
How? Do intervals in order to make the training less hard, and profit from the breaks to remove lactate acid from the legs by jogging. Unfortunately the heart rate drops when taking a break and you will need a brisk effort of one minute to build it up to reach 85% of max heart rate.
What can you do?
1. Short intervals of less than two minutes. You need to have a detailed plan for distance and duration both for the reps and the breaks so that heart rate does not drop to the initial level after each break. If not then til much effort will be waisted binding heart rate at the beginning of each rep.
2. Long intervals of more than two minutes preferably over 4 minutes. You can enjoy active breaks for 2-3 minutes without a detailed plan as you accept that there will be a heart rate build up time in the beginning of each rep. However, longer reps means fewer reps and less time waisted on heart rate build up.
For VO2max improvemwnt I recommend long intervals of 5 times 5 minutes at 85% to 90% of max heart rate with 3 minutes active breaks.
The Wizard JS wrote:
dadsfadsfdasfdsafdas wrote:
Great so now you are saying tinman is 100% right and that to do a vo2max workout you should be running at 90s pace. Seems like you are confused about the difference between what a. workout should be and when to pick which type of workout to use.
If you want to argue that vo2max workouts should be uses sparingly, my impression is that tinman will agree. Heck isn't his claim to fame those slow CV intervals?
What do you talk about? Where did I say something which would indicate that Tinman is right? In my world of world class coaching maxVO2 paced intervals should stay at around 95% of MHR , the same as what Daniels explained is the best because you don`t get better effect of running them at 3 k pace , and running them at 5 k pace reduce the risk of injury compared to the faster 3 k pace. And one more time ; The so called maxVO2 intervals just contributes together with the other two main factors to raise the individual maxO2 to the possible level given by birth ( the genes). The main purpose with the maxVO2 intervals is to make the energy process at 5 k race pace to be more efficient, and this happens when the runner repeat the workout regularly .
You just agreed that you don't do intervals at vo2max pace but you do them slower. You seemed confused about the difference between what you should do for a vo2max interval workout and if you should be doing a vo2max interval workout.
Thanks all, there's a ton of information in here and I really appreciate the time everyone's taken to input.
Did a session of 2 x 5 x 60m max speed efforts last night, really enjoyed it. Now heading out for more slow miles!
Will aim for a 5kTT in a few weeks :)
The Wizard JS wrote:
20 x 400m is outstanding! At 5 k race pace and recovery easy walking back to 120 bpm ( or 60 % of MHR ) gOOD Luck! :)
sounds like an incredible hard workout... 10x400 would be better, if 5k pace! (break 1min)