Just ran Berlin, 10 minutes slower than PR. Please help with a post-mortem

dunes runner wrote:

Don't bother with gu. That stuff is nonsense. You don't need to eat sugar in a marathon, and it can cause you to bonk.

Dunesrunner/anyone,

Can you expand on this? Are you suggesting he only takes on water during the race? Surely for 3hrs of running he would something?

Please help with wrote:

Thanks.

Would you be able to point out exactly what was wrong with my taper?

Was it the fact that I didn't much at all?

Or was it that I did a 9 mile run two days prior to the race?

Any resource you recommend for reading up on taper strategy?

Buy Advanced Marathoning or Jack Daniels Running Formula or anything from the Hansons. This stuff is out there, and clearly running 9 miles two days prior to the race and nothing else the week prior (or minimal) is not the right approach. We can't give you an exact strategy the week before because it depends on too many variables, but anything less than 20 miles for the week is probably wrong and certainly 9 miles 2 days in advance is wrong.

I did only one marathon a year, and that was London in the April. 3/4 months build up over the winter & spring, with a job, was the max mental & physical effort I was willing to put myself through. Now that I am older, I am kicking myself that I did not do Berlin in the September but, you know what, I could not be arsed going through that build up again from June. That's a failing of mine which irks me sometimes.... so I did 10 km's and the like over the summer.

So what I am saying is, if you only get 1 chance to get it right then you need to approach the marathon like you really mean it. It's too hard to go in half hearted. Get planning; I found Pfitzinger's ' Advanced Marathoning ' an excellent resource. It answers just about any question that will come into your head about marathoning. You will see the answers to most of your failings right in this book.

I will guess your thighs gave out as you had not exposed them to race relevant stresses whilst training. More threshold efforts & long runs would callous you to the demands of the race.

You probably used the less than symbol...that cuts off the post due to the crappy software used on this website.

Lack of long runs at well below MP. You need these to build the endurance necessary to hold MP for 26.

You don't need to run MP that often (1-2 per week), and you definitely don't need to run MP for more than 8-10 miles during the training period. One extra distance finale at MP is fun and can be good for confidence -- like taking a 20-miler and making ~15 of them MP, the rest more warm-up and cool-down. But that should be right before the taper, not a regular event, or you risk injury/overtraining.

So too much MP, not enough LSD.

Banner. wrote:

dunes runner wrote:

Don't bother with gu. That stuff is nonsense. You don't need to eat sugar in a marathon, and it can cause you to bonk.

Dunesrunner/anyone,

Can you expand on this? Are you suggesting he only takes on water during the race? Surely for 3hrs of running he would something?

Yes, just water is fine. You don't even need much if any in 3 hours.

Most important is to be well hydrated and replenished before starting.

Taper, previous week: 98 miles, including two 2mile time trials, and a10 mile at 90% the day after a steady 20 mile.

Taper, the last week: 91 miles, 15 + 3 in pm, 15 with 3 fast + 3 pm, 8 + 3 pm, 4, 2, 28 with marathon, 12.

I tapered off the effort for 10 days or so, and the mileage the last few days. My friend did less mileage and tapered for 2 weeks. I did run a substantial marathon PR, and then bettered it 3 weeks later, and felt better / faster in the second one.