John Hancock's blanket was more important than the American flag

rothermj wrote:

Actually was glad they stopped the "flag as blanket deal." You are not supposed to use the American Flag as a blanket. NYC started that, and it was really obnoxious. I am all for waving the flag and being patriotic. In fact, I love it. There is proper treatment of the American flag, however, and having it as your towel when you finish is not it. I do not know the rules of flag treatment in other countries, but the default treatment should be to treat their nations flag with the same dignity and respect as is required of our flag.

The corporate sponsorship deal is something else. All of you complaining that Nike owns everything need to realize that if you want other companies sponsoring some running events, they need some return on investment.

+1 The US flag is not a towel or article of clothing. It's not respectful to use it to dry yourself off or to wear it like a cape.

Also, it's one thing to get flags out in competitions between national teams like the Olympics or WCs but the NYCM, Boston Marathon, etc. are not international competitions and the winners don't have any business waiving their flags around or imitating the Olympics.

The John Hancock blancket stuff was pushy and commercial. Everything you could see already said John Hancock and BAA so it was also unnecessary. If it's cold, give the athletes a blanket if they need it but don't waive it around behind them as another billboard.

You guys have undeveloped systems of moral reasoning. By citing antiquated laws you are revealing a "conventional" system where upholding prescribed rules is your highest value. A "post-conventional" moral reasoning shows that I do not give one crap about "flag-protocol." I do give a crap that our athlete was forced to use a flag of commercialization instead of symbolic nationality. That finish line dude took our overly commercialized sport over the edge. He tried to take a powerful moment full of symbolic meaning for our country and for us runners and turn it into an advertisement. Our hero, Meb, became nothing more than a mannequin for a business.

Also, don't kid yourselves, major marathons are international in every sense of the word.

The whole John Hancock blanket thing made me sick. That guy at the finish was obnoxious and pushy. The were more or less dragging Meb around and man-handling him. Leave the guy alone! He just completed a grueling marathon, stop treating him like a piece of meat. A guy like Meb that has been treated badly by sponsors for his entire career is probably used to it. But it still bugged the hell out of me. Their actions cheapened a historic moment in American distance running.

Chooomsky wrote:

You guys have undeveloped systems of moral reasoning. By citing antiquated laws you are revealing a "conventional" system where upholding prescribed rules is your highest value. A "post-conventional" moral reasoning shows that I do not give one crap about "flag-protocol." I do give a crap that our athlete was forced to use a flag of commercialization instead of symbolic nationality. That finish line dude took our overly commercialized sport over the edge. He tried to take a powerful moment full of symbolic meaning for our country and for us runners and turn it into an advertisement. Our hero, Meb, became nothing more than a mannequin for a business.

Also, don't kid yourselves, major marathons are international in every sense of the word.

No, we were simply informing you that a set of rules do exist for how one is to treat the flag. You displayed your ignorance in your previous post by not realizing the flag code even existed.

I honestly didn't think they honestly were prepared for an American to win and failed.

They knew ;)

rothermj wrote:

Actually was glad they stopped the "flag as blanket deal." You are not supposed to use the American Flag as a blanket. NYC started that, and it was really obnoxious. I am all for waving the flag and being patriotic. In fact, I love it. There is proper treatment of the American flag, however, and having it as your towel when you finish is not it. I do not know the rules of flag treatment in other countries, but the default treatment should be to treat their nations flag with the same dignity and respect as is required of our flag.

+1. I'm tired of seeing runners draped in the flag, covered with sweat, wiping themselves off with it, and dragging it on the ground. So disrespectful...

You may know the finish line coordinator Tom Meagher as a great guy, but I see him as a complete overbearing, corporate ass. I noticed his heavy-handed tactics at prior Boston finishes and felt disgust towards him, but yesterday was the worst. I'm glad others on this thread were similarly offended by his overly aggressive and intrusive behavior. He didn't give the female or male winner any time to recover, relax or bask in their glory without him glued to them; he was immediately all over them, physically controlling and dictating their movements in every direction, forcing a Hancock towel on them whether they wanted it or not, treating them like a trained seal by insisting that they spread the towel for all to see the corporate logo, and bullying them in every direction. It was sickening. Not letting Meb hug his elated wife for more than a split second before rudely forcing her away was a particularly disgusting display by Meagher. He should be banned from future Boston finish lines and required to attend an etiquette class.

Ole Timer wrote:

rothermj wrote:

Actually was glad they stopped the "flag as blanket deal." You are not supposed to use the American Flag as a blanket. NYC started that, and it was really obnoxious. I am all for waving the flag and being patriotic. In fact, I love it. There is proper treatment of the American flag, however, and having it as your towel when you finish is not it. I do not know the rules of flag treatment in other countries, but the default treatment should be to treat their nations flag with the same dignity and respect as is required of our flag.

+1. I'm tired of seeing runners draped in the flag, covered with sweat, wiping themselves off with it, and dragging it on the ground. So disrespectful...

agree-

Tom Hyland

posted my thoughts as it was happening

http://www.tracktalk.net/2014-boston-marathon-p464681.html?&highlight=Flag#post464681

Way to make uyp your terms bro. The Flag code is a code, not a law BTW. You chose not to honor the code that's your prerogative .. just don't be surprised if a truly patriotic persons sees you violate it. It won't be pretty. Good luck with your post-conventional morality, or whatever.

I couldn't agree more. I think everyone can agree that the way he treated the athletes was obnoxious, regardless of what you think about flag etiquette.

joho wrote: No, we were simply informing you that a set of rules do exist for how one is to treat the flag. You displayed your ignorance in your previous post by not realizing the flag code even existed.

The flag code is legally unenforceable. It's also a relic of a time when elites in American society and government openly sympathized with fascism, prioritizing the state and the collective over the individual, and silencing dissent. The courts did nothing to protect individual rights, and the First Amendment was a dead letter.

There's nothing so noxious as people who insist that others treat patriotism as a religious dogma, complete with all the silly rituals. If you get off on the ins and outs of flag etiquette, more power to you, but don't act as though someone else is harming you when they behave differently.

Deadman Running wrote:

Way to make uyp your terms bro. The Flag code is a code, not a law BTW. You chose not to honor the code that's your prerogative .. just don't be surprised if a truly patriotic persons sees you violate it. It won't be pretty. Good luck with your post-conventional morality, or whatever.

It won't be pretty? Why? Because "a truly patriotic person" is a thug who will punish me himself? If that's what patriotism means, then I'm proud to not be a patriot.

(By the way, there's no difference between code and law. Laws are codified in the United States Code. The only reason that the flag code isn't "law" is because it's unconstitutional, not because it wasn't enacted by Congress and the President with the intention that it have binding effect.)

2:08 in

"Give me a flag, give me a flag"

http://olympictalk.nbcsports.com/2014/04/21/2014-boston-marathon-highlights-american-meb-keflezighi-kenyas-rita-jeptoo-win-video/

I was wondering who that was telling Meb's wife to separate from him. What exactly did he say to her? If he had told my wife to get away from me, I'd have some choice words for him, exhausted or not.

I get that JH wants to be front and center during the highest point of photography at the event, but that just looked really bad. Was the guy who handled Meb an employee of JH, or of the BAA?

RRRR wrote:

I was wondering who that was telling Meb's wife to separate from him. What exactly did he say to her?

"Alright, OK, alright, OK, alright, alright, OK"

1:56 in to the above link.

800 dude wrote:

joho wrote: No, we were simply informing you that a set of rules do exist for how one is to treat the flag. You displayed your ignorance in your previous post by not realizing the flag code even existed.

The flag code is legally unenforceable. It's also a relic of a time when elites in American society and government openly sympathized with fascism, prioritizing the state and the collective over the individual, and silencing dissent. The courts did nothing to protect individual rights, and the First Amendment was a dead letter.

There's nothing so noxious as people who insist that others treat patriotism as a religious dogma, complete with all the silly rituals. If you get off on the ins and outs of flag etiquette, more power to you, but don't act as though someone else is harming you when they behave differently.

No one insisted on anything. I simply answered the question the other poster asked about 'what set of rules exist for how to treat the flag'. He didn't know that there is, indeed, a set of rules for the proper treatment of the flag.

You can choose to follow or not. I don't care. It obviously has less impact on today's society since flag clothing can be seen on just about a daily basis.

The flag is symbol and people will feel disrespected if their symbol is disrespected.

Deadman Running wrote:

Way to make uyp your terms bro. The Flag code is a code, not a law BTW. You chose not to honor the code that's your prerogative .. just don't be surprised if a truly patriotic persons sees you violate it. It won't be pretty. Good luck with your post-conventional morality, or whatever.

Those terms aren't made up. Google Kohlberg or go to college. Bro. So Patriots are thugs who uphold codes of power or people who set aside tradition in search of what is right? I think you need to check your history, Bro.