Hey all, I'm a junior starting to think about colleges and will (barring huge improvements I would love to see), will be running at a D3 liberal arts school. Is anyone here a coach/alumni/current athlete of any of the following colleges and would like to give a little information on the program and team chemistry?
Williams, Wash U, Dickinson, Carleton, PP, Occidental, Colby or CMU
Any other reccomendations? Thanks!
(Male)
KEEENE STATEEEEE BOIIIIIIIII YOLO
But for real, it depends on your academics for some of those. If you can get into Williams then you'll probably get into the others.
Colby is on an HUGE upswing (5th at nationals after 4th place tiebreaker) but they will have lost their big guns by the time you get there. Williams is always in the mix for the most part.
Haverford might be worth taking a look at.
Carleton alum here. Send me an email if you want to chat more about the program.
Mountaineer wrote:
Hey all, I'm a junior starting to think about colleges and will (barring huge improvements I would love to see), will be running at a D3 liberal arts school. Is anyone here a coach/alumni/current athlete of any of the following colleges and would like to give a little information on the program and team chemistry?
Williams, Wash U, Dickinson, Carleton, PP, Occidental, Colby or CMU
Any other reccomendations? Thanks!
Dude, you have some great schools there. I'll tell you what I know (based on my own research for my daughter):
Wash U - Coach Jeff Stiles is one of the best coaches in the country. The school is amazingly beautiful and the students are generally very happy to be there. Students are mostly laid back except in the sciences and engineering where they are a little bit competitive with each other. Dorms are beautiful and the food is great. Hard to pass up a chance to go there. GREAT school. Doesn't feel like a DIII school though as it has a lot of graduate students and the campus population is over 14,000 (about half undergrads and half graduate students).
Williams - Great CC program there. Seems they let just about anyone run though as they do have some really slow runners on their teams. Excellent school of course.
Dickinson - One of the best LACs that the average person doesn't know about. HUGE team with a lot of slow runners and only a handful of faster runners.
Colby - Someone else said this was a program on the upswing. I agree with this. Colby also gives GREAT need-based aid, and that includes NO loans for the student. Can be a little isolated.
That's what I know about those schools. Don't really know much about the others other than to say Carleton would be a great place to go if you can handle the cold Minnesota winter.
Good luck.
If those are your choices, you are in good shape. I am a male runner for Williams. I'm not on the Nationals squad (yet), so I can't speak as much to the state of things at the very top, but I will say that Pete Farwell is a very smart, friendly coach who really knows his stuff. The consistency of successfulness of his teams is telling. But he is also very thoughtful about the whole team, even the slower guys (walk-ons are welcomed), and more than willing to talk with anyone about their individual training if they want to.
Socially, I think Williams XC is probably similar to teams from similar schools: very laid-back, cheerful, and often goofy/silly. Everyone on the team is very smart, but it never feels competitive in that regard. It's a very tight group. For Nationals, about 30 of us non-racers (guys and girls) drove from Williams to Ohio to watch the race. Like I said, I think the social scene is probably comparable to similar schools (Midd, etc.), btu I would say it is probably on the positive end of that spectrum.
I'd look at National results, take a sharpie and cross out anything below 5. Put those teams left in a hat, NCC just won title #16, so maybe give them a few more ballots and pick. Now you have a college you won't regret the next 4 years of your life.
Definitely look at Haverford. The only other schools on that list that are in the same league both athletically and academically are Williams and WashU. Also Tom Donnelly is a phenomenal coach, who just got inducted in to the coaches' association hall of fame.
I always recommend Haverford but does anyone know when Coach Donnelly is going to retire?
CMU just lost Coach Donatelli. I don't know who will replace him next year but things will be different.
I agree that Haverford is a great place. The one thing to know about it though is that it is VERY small - 1187 students. That's a deal breaker for a lot of people.
Most of these schools have chilly winters. Consider the indoor facilities available. I ran D3 in New England and can't say enough about what I saw from the outside of the whole Williams program.
Some guy will run kind of fast in the 1500, like 3:47 or so then ponder if he should have gone D1.
Not Nomar wrote:
Most of these schools have chilly winters.
True. Minnesota though is an extra special level of cold.
If you're looking at PP and Oxy, why not CMS? Obviously CMC and Mudd are somewhat different schools than the rest of that list depending on what you want to study, but both are right up there with the schools you list academically.
I cannot say enough good things about that program. I recommend visiting if you are in the area. Being a part of that team was the highlight of college for me, and you are part of the team for life. Dozens of us will be returning for the alumni meet this year. Coach Goldhammer and Coach Beck have great training plans while understanding that academics come first. I improved a ton in college while pursuing a double major at CMC.
I wasn't that fast in high school (like low 10s 3200), and didn't have a great experience with some of the coaches at the schools you mention. One of the coaches forgot he'd already met me, and another totally blew me off and never returned my emails after inviting me on campus. I guess some programs can get away with ignoring lower-level recruits.
Goldhammer from CMS, on the other hand, was willing to talk to me frequently about the program and called me the day recruiting started. One of the big strengths of the program is that Goldhammer is willing to take anyone who will put in the work, regardless of how fast. And you'd be surprised, some of the lower level recruits end up in the top 5 and contribute at nationals.
Thanks all so far, I think my chances of getting into a Williams-esque college aren't great, but I'm definitely not out of the running.
I'm really interested in Dickinson and plan on visiting later this year, and CMS/PP I probably won't be able to visit or afford. CMU losing their coach is something I hadn't seen. Interested in NCC, but I'd like to be a little more secluded /at a better school. Any other d3 suggestions with ~30%ish admit rates?
Also, I don't see myself as slow (should be sub9:30 as a senior), so am interested in D1 patriot league/other good academics and decent programs. Anyone know if 9:20-9:35 gets any scholarship money?
inside scoop wrote:
Some guy will run kind of fast in the 1500, like 3:47 or so then ponder if he should have gone D1.
And then he'll run his 5th year at D1 and be glad he didn't.
Wash U is a nice place an all, but it's important to point out that it's insanely expensive. Yes, I know that most of these schools are pretty expensive in general, but you're looking at $60k by the time all is said and done. Is it really worth it to go here than somewhere else? Also, there are few interesting places to run around campus besides Forest Park. Just my two cents
A hero in the night wrote:
Wash U is a nice place an all, but it's important to point out that it's insanely expensive. Yes, I know that most of these schools are pretty expensive in general, but you're looking at $60k by the time all is said and done. Is it really worth it to go here than somewhere else? Also, there are few interesting places to run around campus besides Forest Park. Just my two cents
These private schools often offer rich financial aid packages that substantially lower their cost. It was actually cheaper for me to attend Occidental (where, by the way, I had an amazing experience and received an incredible education) than it would have been to go to my own state's flagship public institution.
OP, in addition to my own very positive experience at Occidental, I have heard great things about Wash U and PP from runners there. Frankly, I think it would be hard to go wrong with any of the schools on your list, depending on your personality.
yeahhh.oh yeah wrote:
I'd look at National results, take a sharpie and cross out anything below 5. Put those teams left in a hat, NCC just won title #16, so maybe give them a few more ballots and pick. Now you have a college you won't regret the next 4 years of your life.
True, except a bachelor's degree from NCC might make you regret those four years later in life.