Cleveland - Liveable?

Tiger Blood wrote:

Today's Cleveland.com headline story:

http://www.cleveland.com/datacentral/index.ssf/2011/03/2010_census_figures_for_ohio_s.html

Pretty interesting:

Cleveland's history

Census Pop. U.S. Rank

1840 6,071 67

1850 17,034 41

1860 43,417 21

1870 92,829 15

1880 160,146 11

1890 261,353 10

1900 381,768 7

1910 560,663 6

1920 796,841 5

1930 900,429 6

1940 878,336 6

1950 914,808 7

1960 876,050 8

1970 750,903 10

1980 573,822 18

1990 505,615 23

2000 477,472 33

2010 396,815 NA

Yet, when you add in the wider area, and population levels have not fallen off that badly, especially considering the number of manufacturing jobs that have fled the area in the same time frame.

That is pretty depressing. Cleveland is liveable, for now. The future isn't looking so good. Think twice before you by that dream home in Parma (Ohio, not Italy).

Old Gregg wrote:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ysmLA5TqbIYhttp://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oZzgAjjuqZM

All you need to know is contained in those two videos.

Two of the great classics. Always fun to watch those.

The Detroit suburbs destroy the Cleveland suburbs though. There are some very nice cities in the suburban "ring" around Detroit.

I didn't realize how small Cleveland is. Under 400,000? Never reached 1,000,000 people? Detroit had almost 2,000,000 mid century. This is with "no one" even living in Detroit anymore. With the suburbs, Detroit has around 5,000,000.

The women on "Hot In Cleveland" have found it to be livable.

luv2run wrote:

The women on "Hot In Cleveland" have found it to be livable.

60-90 year old divorced washed up actresses would.

I moved to downtown Cleveland from Washington, DC about two years ago. I don't find Cleveland to be as bad as its general reputation.

The Washington Post published a pretty good article about Cleveland this summer:

http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2010/09/24/AR2010092404092.html

Downtown Cleveland is pretty affordable. Public transportation is generally reliable and very safe. I also find downtown Cleveland to be safe. Some of the surrounding neighborhoods can get sketchy (especially during the early morning hours).

If you're into the arts, Cleveland has a great arts scene (a surprisingly large theater district, music-the Cleveland Orchestra is fantastic and the Rock Hall of Fame, and Cleveland has a decent selection of museums, among other things).

The Westside Market is amazing and easily accessible by public transit.

Cleveland is a huge sports town (Cavs-basketball; Cleveland State-college basketball (maybe an NCAA tournament team this year?); Indians-Baseball; Lake Erie Monsters-hockey; and the Browns-football) and tickets are affordable.

Running in downtown Cleveland is not too bad, although you generally have to drive to get to trails. The Metroparks and the Cuyahoga Valley National Park are great for running.

[quote]Drew Carry wrote:

Cleveland is a huge sports town (Cavs-basketball; Cleveland State-college basketball (maybe an NCAA tournament team this year?); Indians-Baseball; Lake Erie Monsters-hockey; and the Browns-football) and tickets are affordable.

quote]

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Of course tickets are affordable. I can't even get 3 bucks out of my cavs tickets.

"you could always just develop your skills, get to the top of your profession, then transfer to Miami"

Lol great lebron refrence, aerodynamic interlude

Chase hently wrote:

"you could always just develop your skills, get to the top of your profession, then transfer to Miami"

Lol great lebron refrence,

The next guy I would like to see move to Miami is Mike Brown.

I don't know Cleveland, but I do know very well that the corporate/world is about "who you know, not what you know," and I'm afraid that if you start your career in a third-tier Midwestern city, you'll have a hard time building your network to move somewhere "better," such as the coasts.

I didn't read the whole thread, but I saw an article today (interesting timing) that Cleveland's population is declining extremely quickly. I don't know if this means the whole metropolitan area or what, but the article said the numbers were back down to the levels from a hundred years ago.

Cleveland is the type of town you move back to in order to settle down with a family after you've spent time on the coasts or bigger cities. You can make some money, come back and buy a big house in the suburbs. Nice schools for the kids, get a lot of house for your money, etc. Career wise, there aren't a lot of corporate headquarters left in the area so if things don't work out with this job you won't have much other opportunities unless you relocate.

And what's with all these Canadians moving to the US? I thought your wannabe Euro country was better than ours?

Part of your thinking is correct, as Canada is much better than the US. However, we are not 'wannabe Euro': our prime minister is a libertarian, while yours is performing massive quantitative easing presently. Be careful with the finger pointing, socialist.

quote]greater clevelander wrote:

And what's with all these Canadians moving to the US? I thought your wannabe Euro country was better than ours?[/quote]

I have worked in Cleveland and lived in east side suburbs for about 25 years after moving from D.C. In my opinion, the quaality of life here cannot be matched -- if you have a good job and are in the child-rearing stage of life. Great cheap housing, good schools, easy commute, plenty of entertainment and restaurants, nice people, excellent park system with almost endless running trails, a strong running community, etc. I could live anywhere. I'm staying here. At least until the kids are gone!

greater clevelander wrote:

Cleveland is the type of town you move back to in order to settle down with a family after you've spent time on the coasts or bigger cities. You can make some money, come back and buy a big house in the suburbs. Nice schools for the kids, get a lot of house for your money, etc. Career wise, there aren't a lot of corporate headquarters left in the area so if things don't work out with this job you won't have much other opportunities unless you relocate.

And what's with all these Canadians moving to the US? I thought your wannabe Euro country was better than ours?

Ummmm...I'm gonna steer clear of the name calling. Don't get me wrong - I'm as proud as they come to be Canadian. I love the Toronto Maple Leafs like they're my Mother, have travelled across the country living in 4 different provinces. It's one badass country.

As for the first part of your comment, and I believe another post made reference to something like this as well...the firm is the leader in its field. So yeah, going there to develop then relocate...not really the plan at the moment.

And an FYI: although money is an important part of any job offer, I take a holistic approach to evaluating opportunities. For example, despite scoring in the 90th percentile on the GMAT, I elected to go to a 2nd tier program in Canada. I did this because I know if you have the skills and get the experience, and become one of the best at something, things are gonna work out pretty well. Ultimately I could not be happier with the decision I made and have had an incredible 2 years here. I am not of the belief that it's about who you know, although making some contacts doesn't hurt.

I grew up in northern Ohio, lived for a time in Boston during training and after graduation, and now reside outside Pittsburgh.

Living toward the midwest within shouting distance of a city offers some unique advantages.

Traveling throughout Europe and some of Asia in my thirties and forties made me appreciate the natural beauty of rural Pa and Ohio. The mountains and foothills within an hour of Pittsburgh are similar to parts of Spain and Italy. A setting like that of Wright's Falling Water is easy to find within 30 to 60 minutes of Pittsburgh

and farmland with woods as found in France is all over northern Ohio.

With your salary, you could be commuting from a beach house to downtown Cleveland for the price of a Manhattan efficiency. It surprises many coasters that the Great Lakes look no different than an ocean from the shore.

You like New England or German woodlands with beautifual autumns surrounded by farmland? That is available within 20 to 30 minutes of downtown Cleveland.

For $250,000 to $350,000 you can own that modernist house on a golf course, on a ski slope, near the water or atop a hill with a killer view.

You are able to fashion your preferred lifestyle, something very few New Yorkers or LA residents can ever have.

Europeans have no qualms about moving to a small town in Umbria with few neighbors rather than taking a Trastavere flat in Rome, but Americans, for some reason scoff at a beautiful house in a beautiful setting near very good arts and entertainment centers unless validated by a coolness factor.

What struck me most about Boston was the provincialism of the residents. Few seemed to know anything other than a few tired cliches about the interior of the country.

Obama's derisive statement about people 'clinging to their religion and guns' was fairly typical.

Owing to mass media, I knew very much about them while they sounded like children when speaking about the rest of the country, which was not a bad position to be in.

Grown men exhibited obvious fear about places like Ohio as if a trip to the midwest was like a foray with Stanley and Livingston into the heart of darkness.

It is a great advantage, professionally and personally, to be able to feel comfortable traveling and stopping in establishments all across the country; being unafraid of people who live in trailers, hunt, farm or worship.

Very few midwestern electorates are as conformist and uniform in their thinking as those of the east and west coasts. It is not unusual to sit at a dinner table with mixes like a union steward, a dentist and a libertarian.

You will hear things that could not possibly be uttered in Back Bay or in a Brooklyn condo, another great advantage for your future.

I have become very thankful for my truly multi-cultural upbringing, based upon more than just cosmetics, that put me elbow to elbow with farmers, steelworkers, executives, professionals, mafiosos and members of every ethnic group you can imagine and I've had a lot of fun to boot.

That's all very poetic, but it remains a fact that Cleveland is vile toilet of a town.

cleveland sucks, but it's ok. Born and raised here.

sounds like you got a pretty cool job lined up.

take it!

better to have a cool job in a ho-hum city, than a bad job in the coolest city in the world.

if you like your job .... that's really half the battle in life.

just chill in cleveland, work, run, pursue some females. if you don't like it, you can always move. it's a free country, we abolished slavery a few years back.

This guy loves Cleveland:

http://www.cleveland.com/browns/index.ssf/2010/10/eric_barrs_devotion_to_browns.html