Ritz AR 5K will not factor for a good marathon

it doesnt translate into a fast marathon right now, being in shape to run a fast 5000, 10000, or even half marathon does not necessarily mean one is in shape to run a fast marathon, however getting faster over the shorter distances means he is developing tools that will help in in the marathon when he trains specifically for it in future years

It matters. It is all about where the focus of the training is.

If all of the training is focused on the 5K and Ritz can run 12:56, that means that if he focuses on the marathon, he can probably run pretty well. It doesn't mean he can run a good marathon on 5K training. People thought Hall's 28:04 wasn't bad because they knew he was doing marathon training. If he trained for the 10K, I am sure Hall could be in the 27:20's. As he doesn't, a 40 second drop in the 10K is not that big of a deal.

I'd sooner run NY with 12:56 speed than 13:15 speed. His confidence must be super high. Look for Ritz to run a 2:06 in the fall.

Ask Salazar, Ritz's new coach how important that 5k and 10k speed helped him back in the day for his marathon success and when he got away from those races and focused solely on Marathon training how things turned out.... look for Ritz to pop a serious time in the Marathon this fall... good luck to Ritz and the Salazar group I wish them much success.

It only matters if he right for the marathon. Some people are incredibly fast at the 5k but it doesn't translate to the marathon. I think people are expecting too much from Ritz. I am sure he will PR in the marathon but to say the a 2:06 is a sure thing because of his 5k is naive at best. He may run a 2:06 but it is far from certain.

I hope that if Ritz is looking to drop a fast time he avoids New York and races Chicago or a flat fast course... And to put it into perspective the world recod holder for the marathon and half marathon etc... was also the former world record holder for 5k and 10k on the track. Most if not all of the last few record holders were world class 5 and 10k guys when they broke the record. Reference Carlos Lopes, Steve Jones, Arturro Barrios, Haile etc....

Has anyone else been reflecting on Canova's maxim about the specificity of marathon training in light of Ritz's performance?

old ndn runna wrote:

I hope that if Ritz is looking to drop a fast time he avoids New York and races Chicago or a flat fast course... And to put it into perspective the world recod holder for the marathon and half marathon etc... was also the former world record holder for 5k and 10k on the track. Most if not all of the last few record holders were world class 5 and 10k guys when they broke the record. Reference Carlos Lopes, Steve Jones, Arturro Barrios, Haile etc....

Olympic races are usually over tough courses and conditions (middle of summer). I don't know how the London Olympics course will be (apparently different than normal London course). But I'd like to see Ritz run marathons that'll help him for 2012, especially given we're almost at 2010. He may run only 3 of them before the trials... and I'd assume not waste any under conditions that won't match the olympics. Ritz was running tough marathons leading to the olympics, while Hall was getting PR's. Look how their 2008 olympics turned out. I bet Hall would've done better, if he'd run NYC once.

I hear ya bro... but I think that getting under 13 and getting the American record will help him and I hope that he does not stray far from the track between now and 2012, if he becomes strictly a Marathon runner between now and London, I might even go out on a limb and say he don't make the team for London in the Marathon...not wishing anything bad on any athlete, I want Ritz and all the lions out there to be around and compete at their best....

That I agree on.

Also... right now, his 12:56 AR, and his strength, tell me Ritz' best event is the 10K. His best accomplishments, by a good margin, are on the track. We'll see in his next 26.2 if that event has caught up with the track.

Plus with 12:56, I'm not about to say he doesn't have the speed for 10K. For now he lacks the blazing kick... but Salazar dramatically improved Rupp's kick. Plus, if Ritz makes 25% of the same speed improvement over next year, then he'll have the speed. 12:56 is by far Ritz' best time accomplishment... and I'm not sure he should be moving up another 23 miles. That'd be, to a very large degree, ignoring his most proven talent to date. Moving up, just to move up isn't an argument.

Yezzirrr, now we are on the same page bro! I am no coach and would never claim to be an expert, probably in reality far from it... so my opinion should be taken lightly at best... but I agree that his best distance right now as far as potential is 10k and I think they should play it out like that til at least after the next World Champs, sure dabble or get a fast Marathon in, but not let it be your focus, I believe he and others can and will be a factor at 5 and 10k at the next World Championships... nice talkin' wit ya..

Either way, it think popping an AR will defiantly get his head in the game. A lot of athletes do better after a coaching change just becuase it's something new and gets there head going again. So you get a new coach and an AR, that will defiantly give him some momentum in training. How long it will last i do not know, 2012 is quite a ways away, so no matter how motivated he is, his training is going to be crucial.

Back in the day Salazar linked his marathoning success with 10k success, and if Ritz bites on this it could be a good thing, becuase a fast 5k defiantly translates into a fast 10k, which Ritz already believes is his specialty. But that brings up the question, does Salazar train his athletes the way he trained?

I wouldn't know that answer, but I would bet he puts alot of the things he felt helped him maximize his potential in to their training....and I would also bet that he would be very cautious if not overly cautious about over training them, as in my opinion this was Salazars and maybe even to a certain extent, pre-Salazar, Ritz's undoing and subsequent coaching change.... Smart of Ritz to recognize or maybe even Salazar to recognize from his own experience before taking Ritz as an athlete, that this might be the problem and he might have the answer, obviously with hindsight Salazar so far has the answer and I hope they also have the plan, so far so good!!!

Timmins, mmmm, now is that a name associated with KU or maybe Mt. West??? just curious??? prolly neither....

ttc wrote:

That I agree on.

Also... right now, his 12:56 AR, and his strength, tell me Ritz' best event is the 10K. His best accomplishments, by a good margin, are on the track. We'll see in his next 26.2 if that event has caught up with the track.

Plus with 12:56, I'm not about to say he doesn't have the speed for 10K. For now he lacks the blazing kick... but Salazar dramatically improved Rupp's kick. Plus, if Ritz makes 25% of the same speed improvement over next year, then he'll have the speed. 12:56 is by far Ritz' best time accomplishment... and I'm not sure he should be moving up another 23 miles. That'd be, to a very large degree, ignoring his most proven talent to date. Moving up, just to move up isn't an argument.

Great to see it only took a few short days for the second-guessing brigade to show up. How about we just let Ritz and his coach make the decisions, eh?

it would be interesting to see Salazars training build up the spring before he popped off his marathon and the time line between his fast track times in the summer and what he did between the end of track and the fall NY marathon... then see if there is any similarities timeline wise and training wise to what Ritz is doing if he is going to run a fall Marathon. One could also believe that in a way what ever Ritz is doing between now and 2012 is also an experimental blueprint for Rupp and any future plans that they may have for his buildup to a Marathon pre or post 2012....

old ndn runna wrote:

Timmins, mmmm, now is that a name associated with KU or maybe Mt. West??? just curious??? prolly neither....

neither, its a pretty common name. sorry.

I think his best event is not the track 10K, but rather the 12K cross country race.

He is ready to go 2.03-2.04 this fall.