I am SICK of people saying keep things shutdown when they aren't starving or broke

95% of hospitals are struggling right now with reduced patient counts and reduced hours. Patients are cancelling appointments because they are being told to do so by the nedia.

Ciro wrote:

You’ve gone from championing Sweden’s approach to blaming its failure on immigrants. A painfully weak progression.

So now you've shifted to a straw man approach since you can't win with facts. I was expecting a better fight out of you Ciro.

The argument wasn't about whether or not Sweden had a good approach or bad approach (there is another thread for that, on which I am not a participant). It was about whether or not we should start gradually opening up the economy. Specifically:

the real facts wrote:

The goal of lifting restrictions gradually is to find out how much of the economy can be open without causing another major outbreak. The government can't continue to print $6 trillion a month for a year or two or however long it takes to come up with a vaccine.

The results of Sweden's efforts (along with the preliminary antibody research) supports the above argument because it shows that our healthcare system is not going to be completely overwhelmed as was feared when the stay-at-home orders were issued.

Nonsense, that may have been one of your opinions but it was not your only one.

Another of your opinions was misleading regarding Sweden’s death rate relative to their neighbors. That is what I called out.

Tennessee elite ?

No. Life doesnt work this way. Many people in Italy，my father was an example is not the truth That He cnnot bring bread for Dinner But many people in Italy are in Deep misery because of our fucked up state. Its Shame on themwe should climb up the parliament and burn It Not the supermarkets because These people working Ij the supermart are honest. They are buying the goods. The politicians are all robbers！

I can understand protecting contagion. But in the face of hunger I also understand That you Cant just stop peoples lives That way. Its just not How It works you might not share my political views because you have not Your ass on the ground like many of These people！

When you will be with months without Job and you Cant pay Your rent and food... are you then gonna care about a virus which can show up on healthy individuals without even having symptoms！Are you gonna care about That if you Cant provide Your Family with dinner？

You ask yourself that.

My god, the woke retards on here.

The "point" is nonsense. It costs more innocent lives to shut things down than it does to keep them open. It is not even close.

This seems suspiciously insane from the politicians.

I bet roughly 100% of people would prefer opening things, and a few stable women living off of men still employed are posting this b.s. against any smart person's judgement (like the media people parroting lines like actors) to screw over other people and living by the opposite.

I am disappointed in everyone. This needs opened up immediately. We will have a bigger disaster than anyone can understand if not. Our country already resembles the impoverished nations where almost 100% of women sell sex because of this. It is not a joke.

I don’t think the stay home! diehards understand what exactly is happening with the economy right now and what it means for the future of the WORLD. They have this myopic view that only sees the virus and deaths from the virus. It is like people on the Titanic worrying about dying from cholera when the entire ship is sinking. Food shortages are just around the corner. You can’t close a bunch of food processing plants and cut off supply chains to farmers and then expect food to magically fly to your grocery store shelves.

One of the news outlets today finally posted something about the impending world hunger pandemic resulting from covid and the economic collapse around it. And they’re estimating will have 300,000 people A DAY dying from starvation.

It’s nice to have a little staycation where you’re collecting a check to work in pajamas and you’re totally “safe” from a virus that really isn’t that deadly to 95% of the population. But how good is that paycheck when you can’t FIND any food or goods and services to buy with it because everything got shut down?

where is my check wrote:

save some money wrote:

How about just living within your means so that you aren't "starving or broke"?

Sir you are an idiot!! I talking about whole livelihoods being destroyed, and you're giving me a Dave Ramsey speech. People are scared and you're spouting off that crap.?

He's right though.

The only real exception is those in the US on minimum wage. They can live extremely frugally and still not be able to support themselves. This is because Conservatives are hoarding wealth and no other reason. And yet most Americans vote against their own self-interests and want to blame the Democrats for all their problems.

Stupidity can destroy an empire and the dumpster fire you call the USA is learning this first hand at the moment.

uneven wrote:

Newsom's a one term governor. He increasingly unlikable each with each press conference. I miss Jerry Brown.

Meanwhile, Trump destroys the GOP every time he opens he lying, blowhard pie hole.

Newsom is setting himself to win the presidential election in 2024 after Biden wins in 2020 and is too old for a second term.

Newsom2024 wrote:

uneven wrote:

Newsom's a one term governor. He increasingly unlikable each with each press conference. I miss Jerry Brown.

Meanwhile, Trump destroys the GOP every time he opens he lying, blowhard pie hole.

Newsom is setting himself to win the presidential election in 2024 after Biden wins in 2020 and is too old for a second term.

If that happens I am definitely , moving to North Korea, bigly.

This isn’t entirely true, food production has not been closed as everyone recognises how essential this is.

A recession doesn’t have to mean severe material deprivation. The landmass doesn’t shrink with the economy - there are the same properties for people to shelter in and the same land for food production.

You’ve correctly identified there are two problems - the virus crisis AND the economic fallout. However the two are only tangentially connected. For example, the allied forces rationed food for it’s citizens during the second world war to prevent societal breakdown. They thought without this the working class would become destitute, revolt against restrictions put in place to protect everyone, and potentially become suseptible to enemy propaganda.

With rationing the average height of a child continued to grow taller during this period showing most of the population was receiving adequate nutrition. However this does not mean the people were prospering - they were at daily risk of being killed. It’s just we decided not to put the same people in additional danger from a collapsing economy.

Anyone falling into poverty due to this has been failed by political choices not to protect their standard of living.

There is a difference between food production in the United States versus, say, sub-saharan Africa. Sub-saharan Africa stands to lose millions of lives due to starvation if they institute shelter in place orders like we are in the developing word.

In the United States, we stand to irreversibly alter the lives of the vast majority of people because the only manner of death the Left now cares about is COVID-19 fatalities. Right now, all of you people delight in the prospect of an indefinite shutdown as you post from your couch in your jammies, your government checks still being cashed. You fail to conceptualize the real fall out that will occur if this continues to stretch with a huge portion of the population getting poorer, more aimless, more agitated, and increasingly skeptical to the degree that government officials want to force everyone to sacrifice to prevent less than 1% of the population from succumbing to this now unstoppable pandemic.

Yes there is a difference and I think a shut-down in those regions would be difficult to manage however I’m not an expert in supply chains in developing economies and would not comment if we were specifically discussing sub-saharan Africa.

I have a job I can do to reasonable standard from home but this is not a secure job nor a well paid one and the longer this goes on eventually I will be laid off. Nobody wants this to last longer than neceessary. If I were to lose my job I would need to leave the house more frequently to find new work.

In these circumstances I would be angry with those that have allowed a system where I have to risk my health to secure the standard of living I experience currently.

Although this seems unprecedented barely a decade passes in human history without disease, famine, war, natural disaster or economic crashes occuring somewhere in the world. These are not new problems. By way of a thought experiment - what would your solution be if the death rate was 10% or 20% instead of one per cent?