Cain and Tuohy Struggle at the Armory, Cain Gets Emotional When Talking About Her Biggest Regret at NOP

I agree that the race probably did not help either of them very much. I guess Cain thought she could run closer to 9 min, although she must have known that there is a huge gap between 9:25 and 9:00

Agree. The good news is that she can run 9.25 totally overweight (for an elite!), and half-committed. It seems to me that she could definitely be competitive again, but not sure the mindset or the willpower is there. Maybe she could visit one of the 'nicer' pro groups, and see how they do it (the Bosshard group in Colorado..look at Coburn - she always looks like she's in fantastic shape?). Alone, she'll never do it; maybe she doesn't really want to. Med school is calling perhaps, and - let's face it - she can earn a huge amount more as a doctor over a career that will last many decades (compared to a few years as an athlete and inevitably a second-tier European behind the string of hugely talented + EPO'ed up Africans). The smart decision is to go to Med school really and focus on that. She can't run for very long; she can be a doctor (with running as a side hobby) for her whole life.

Tuohy doesn't look so great, but the girl has already made history. Maybe at college we'll see her do the 5/10k, and she'll be rejuvenated by college work-outs.

There is no type of fitness gain that will get her even back where she was. Even if she got there she still needs to find another 30 seconds of speed to be a true elite.

She simply can't be that weight. It's just a necessary evil to be 20 pounds lighter.

It almost seems like she keeps that extra weight on as a big middle finger to Nike and Alberto. Either that or she doesn't GAF anymore.

What puzzles me often on this board is how the basics of why an athlete is in a race is often so misunderstood.

Why was Cain in this race?

1. She has been coming back from injury and is trying to get back in race shape for summer 2020.

2. She trains and coaches at the NY Armory where the race was held.

3. 2 weeks ago she ran a 9:25 3k in an all comers meet at the NY Armory, giving race organizers and Cain herself an indication she might be able to run 9:10-9:15 in a real race.

4. She's a NY Legend - after demonstrating some race fitness, of course the organizers are going to let her in, as her entrance and Cain/Tuohy will cause a lot of interest in the race (proven here on the board). No appearance fee, it's a favor, and she is in basically to fill out the field.

Why was Tuohy in this race?

1. The NY Armory is basically her home indoor track, it's 25 miles from her house.

2. In high school races Tuohy usually has not much competition and runs alone.

3. Racing against pros gives her a chance to get real race experience and possibly break some records.

4. She ran this exact same race last year, finishing 3rd in a time of 9:01, setting a new high school indoor record.

5. Current results (2:11 800, 2:47 1k) indicate she has the same fitness as last year.

The race

1. Both were right on track through 2k.

2. They both died on the last k; bet that's never happened to anyone.

3. Mary ran another 9:25. Not what she wanted, but it's another data point on her comeback effort.

5. Tuohy ran 9:32, obviously not what she wanted, but it still is US#1 for high school and qualifies her for NY state meet, and the NB Indoor if she wants to run, as this was her first 3k/3200/2 mile of the season.

Meanwhile at the front of the race, a bunch of ladies ran sub 9:00 to qualify for USATF indoor meet.

NYCarmoryman wrote:

Those that know her personally say the same exact thing.

That's a bold statement. Do you have any evidence or are you just gossiping with rumors?

I think it's unfair for people to call her overweight when Mary said in the post-race interview that she only had about 2 months of real training and that she's using this indoor race for experience and practice for the outdoor season. She admits herself that she's not at her best, but she's trying to cope with it and trying to improve.

I am always my thinnest when injured because I cross train and focus on diet. She does not.

facts and reason wrote:

NYCarmoryman wrote:

Those that know her personally say the same exact thing.

That's a bold statement. Do you have any evidence or are you just gossiping with rumors?

I think it's unfair for people to call her overweight when Mary said in the post-race interview that she only had about 2 months of real training and that she's using this indoor race for experience and practice for the outdoor season. She admits herself that she's not at her best, but she's trying to cope with it and trying to improve.

Not a bold statement. And yes the people who said that do know her personally. I wouldn’t say that if I didn’t hear it directly from her own people. This is in no way a shock to anyone

wejo wrote:

Making the Olympics and breaking every record didn't happen, but making the Olympics was very, very in the realm of possibility for her heading into 2016. But there is a big line from making Olympics and breaking every record. And I think there is a big gap from Cain to Tuohy in high school. Internationally Cain was way better.

Not really. In 2015 Cain was in serious decline with only a 4:09 season's best (5 seconds slower than her PR) and 8th at nationals. In 2016 she was even worse with a 4:10 season's best and 11th at nationals. 2013 was really the only year she was a world-class competitor.

Honestly she isn’t as overweight as people are saying. Look at her when she won World Juniors in 2014:

https://www.outsideonline.com/sites/default/files/styles/img_600x600/public/2019/11/15/mary-cain-2014-1_s.jpg?itok=dmu0E7WF

She has never been as skinny as people like Jordan Hasay, yet she was still able to be world class. I honestly think if she loses 5 lbs and does a bunch of strength training to increase lean muscle, she will be in sub9 shape.

Knows Uncle Phil when he sees Uncle Phil wrote:

This forum has some truly horrible people posting. Disgusting stuff that stays up for clicks. Shame on you brojos!

What post are you referencing? Every single post reported has been reviewed. Feel free to email me

From another post

Definitely no injury and I guess it is get back on the horse for Tuohy as she wins the 3k (9:40) and 1500 (4:36) at her county championships the day after the Doc Sander 3k that did not go to well. meet is still going on so she might still run a relay

jenapharm wrote:

From another post

Definitely no injury and I guess it is get back on the horse for Tuohy as she wins the 3k (9:40) and 1500 (4:36) at her county championships the day after the Doc Sander 3k that did not go to well. meet is still going on so she might still run a relay

Can confirm this, she went out very hard in the 3k today, was low 4:5x at the mile before fading to 9:40. Came back in the 15 and ran even 37 second laps the entire way, didn't even stop at the finish, she ran directly off the track and disappeared. No competition in either race. No inside knowledge of the strategy here, but I really have to question her coach riding her for points at the county champs a day after what must have been a very tough outing for her mentally.

wejo wrote:

Greg wrote:

You sound like trash. LRC should have mandatory reg. If you don't like her or anyone else and want to name call, why should you be able to do it anonymously?

I'm going to let his point stand because he responded to my post asking for more. As for the registration Greg,you choose to post under Greg and I guess some people know your last name, but we'd never require people to post under their real names.

Anonymity and registration are two different things but I don't want to sidetrack this thread.

So, you say you would let my point stand yet then went back and deleted it? That's a bit of a dick move don't you think? I guess no one is allowed an opinion of a professional athlete on this site, or is it just poor little Mary that no one can say anything negative about? She whines and you guys jump? So much for journalistic integrity.

What a joke!

Kurdt wrote:

I thought Wejo's article was fine. Maybe I read a later, edited version - I didn't notice any errors. Nothing egregious, at least.

Posters criticizing these young ladies are pathetic piles of crap. Running is hard. Training is hard. Improving is difficult. Career trajectories vary wildly. But they are still humans and worthy of being treated with respect, especially given their ages. If neither of them ever ran another step after today, they have still brought a great deal of excitement to the sport, which is almost undoubtedly more than any of the bitter critics can say.

+1. Nobody on this site has any idea what it’s like to be #1 Hs runner with huge expectations on you every race. Sports like football and basketball are far less intense on the individual. In running it’s you and you only that have to bear the pressure. Plus, only the most elite runners in the world make big money, which still is a pittance compared to any starting NBA player, 75% of whom smoke weed every day according to some players comments.

Mary Cain, Me Really No Likey wrote:

I guess no one is allowed an opinion of a professional athlete on this site

You're allowed to put up constructive criticism, but being rude at the same time is completely unnecessary. You wouldn't talk to your family, customers, or business associates like that.

You can talk about diet, physiology, biomechanics, etc. as much as you want.

I think learning to bounce back from a tough outing is a good thing. I get the impression that she puts a huge amount of pressure on herself. So getting back out there is probably best. Just get it out of the system and move on.

Was at the meet wrote:

jenapharm wrote:

From another post

Definitely no injury and I guess it is get back on the horse for Tuohy as she wins the 3k (9:40) and 1500 (4:36) at her county championships the day after the Doc Sander 3k that did not go to well. meet is still going on so she might still run a relay

Can confirm this, she went out very hard in the 3k today, was low 4:5x at the mile before fading to 9:40. Came back in the 15 and ran even 37 second laps the entire way, didn't even stop at the finish, she ran directly off the track and disappeared. No competition in either race. No inside knowledge of the strategy here, but I really have to question her coach riding her for points at the county champs a day after what must have been a very tough outing for her mentally.

2:27 at 800, 4:58 at 1600, 7:38 at 2400 in the 3000

something like 71, 2:24, 3:39 in the 1500

No idea how hard she was pushing in either

so as you said clearly not an injury issue. I suspect she got overly worried about this attempt against the pros (and the 9:00 barrier). I think (not that my thoughts are worth anything) she should forget about pros and olympic trials this year and just have fun and (like Indoor? says) focus a little more on speed this year and see if she and her team can get one more DMR win, although the competition looks tough this year.

I agree. I think lately she is putting a huge amount of pressure on herself and it effects her. Doc Sanders is a race no one expects her to win but for whatever reason she seemed very uncomfortable. I say just slow down, forget about the trials and just run.