ALBERTO SALAZAR BANNED FROM ATHLETICS FOR FOUR YEARS FOR DOPING VIOLATIONS

The understanding is that they rubbed a sh1tload on Salazar's son and then had Dr. Brown test him. Brown basically told him they didn't see any significant change of values at which point the emails confirm that he specifically told Brown that he didn't care to continue the experiment to see where the "line" was because he was content that given how much gel would need to be applied, sabotage was basically impossible.

It was also undisputed that the incident happened after Rupp thought that Whetstone had rubbed stuff on him, and it was undisputed that he sent out a team-wide email asking people to be careful about people rubbing stuff on them, that he had them all dump out their water bottles if they left them unattended, etc.

It all fits with his fear of paranoia. If he wanted to test the limits of testosterone/androgel...he would have continued the experiment. Again, that's just one single piece. Everything together paints a story, and lines up clearly with Salazar as a paranoid coach trying to protect his athletes (with regards to the testosterone).

Now, the Carnitine and thyroid meds do seem like Salazar trying to push limits right up to the border. At the same time, his behavior and constant questioning is consistent with Salazar trying to get everything he could without breaking WADA code (i.e. cheating/doping).

I feel decently confident that most NOP athletes weren't doped (by Salazar). Rupp has slightly sketchier history around him and some of his testimony, and had a very different relationship towards Salazar. I find it slightly more likely that Salazar doped him, but far from confident.

He doped so that his athletes could compete clean? There must be coaches all around the world wondering what they have been doing all these years, thinking all you have to do is run clean. As for the potential "sabotage" argument. who else has ever argued it might have been necessary to protect athletes in this way? What sounds like an excuse is usually just that - an excuse.

And how do you "orchestrate" only one other person? To take the analogy further, he was the conductor of an orchestra of one. I've yet to see it. The USADA chose a word that implies the involvement of many. I'm sure there were.

I highlighted the key word. You're absolutely correct there. Usually that's true. Now read my post right above this one. In Salazar's case it's consistent and the alternative explanation is actually the most outlandish of the two.

Mo Farah's coach Alberto Salazar was recently busted and banned for PED (performance enhancing drug) use.

That means that everyone he coached was on those drugs, yes including Mo Farah.

Anyone, who thinks that Mo Farah was clean is either:

a) Extremely naive

b) A disingenuous liar

c) Has a karyotype that shows a trisomy

Farah was the dirtiest distance runner in track history. And that is saying a lot considering the sport has been littered with dopers since the 1970's.

Asami from 'Audition' wrote:

Mo Farah's coach Alberto Salazar was recently busted and banned for PED (performance enhancing drug) use.

That means that everyone he coached was on those drugs, yes including Mo Farah.

Anyone, who thinks that Mo Farah was clean is either:

a) Extremely naive

b) A disingenuous liar

c) Has a karyotype that shows a trisomy

Farah was the dirtiest distance runner in track history. And that is saying a lot considering the sport has been littered with dopers since the 1970's.

Mo Farah is like a definitely doper category. Dominant athlete makes you suspicious. Farah though, has his missed tests, suspicious trips to Ethiopa, connection with dopers, and with Jama Aden.

Yea. That screams dirty AF.

LM wrote:

Asami from 'Audition' wrote:

Mo Farah's coach Alberto Salazar was recently busted and banned for PED (performance enhancing drug) use.

That means that everyone he coached was on those drugs, yes including Mo Farah.

Anyone, who thinks that Mo Farah was clean is either:

a) Extremely naive

b) A disingenuous liar

c) Has a karyotype that shows a trisomy

Farah was the dirtiest distance runner in track history. And that is saying a lot considering the sport has been littered with dopers since the 1970's.

Mo Farah is like a definitely doper category. Dominant athlete makes you suspicious. Farah though, has his missed tests, suspicious trips to Ethiopa, connection with dopers, and with Jama Aden.

Yea. That screams dirty AF.

So if you think Salazar was doping Farah and Salazar himself has committed doping violations, why would anyone think he wasn't doping others of his athletes?

Please stop!!! wrote:

Oh fúck, another thread rekrunnered.

Lol priceless ha ha

Birth control pills harm performance

LM wrote:

Mo Farah is like a definitely doper category. Dominant athlete makes you suspicious. Farah though, has his missed tests, suspicious trips to Ethiopa, connection with dopers, and with Jama Aden.

Yea. That screams dirty AF.

Sad world if we see dominant athletes as suspicious. It's just not fair that some people are more supremely talented than you and I, right?

I say it as i see it wrote:

LM wrote:

Mo Farah is like a definitely doper category. Dominant athlete makes you suspicious. Farah though, has his missed tests, suspicious trips to Ethiopa, connection with dopers, and with Jama Aden.

Yea. That screams dirty AF.

Sad world if we see dominant athletes as suspicious. It's just not fair that some people are more supremely talented than you and I, right?

Doped athletes are also supremely talented.

Who said we were talking about "a little testosterone on Galen"? The test was, by Salazar's own admission, to determine how much would result in a positive test. In other words, the test determined how much could be used and be gotten away with.

Freudian slip? Have you set aside your impartiality?

Let's assume this arguendo. How did someone so paranoid allow "testosterone medication" to shop up on Galen's records? Wouldn't an atypically paranoid person be just the type to "execut[e] elaborate plots and schemes years in the making all boiling down to being able to dope his athletes"?

Interesting use of the qualifier "active." Why would that be? As for the no evidence of supplements, isn't that whole explanation for the "testosterone medication" on Galen's records?

You do realize that the use of thyroid and asthma medication when not medically necessary is a doping violation, right?

This is exactly what you say when you are not evaluating the activities and eligibility of the athletes.

You realize he conspired with a now banned doctor to alter medical records, a crime, to cover-up bad behavior, right? That's not a conspiracy theory, that's a conspiracy. Also, look at the efforts that folks like Armstrong went through and tell me that elaborate plots aren't possible.

I also don't think you know how Occam's Razor works. On one side you have a clean Salazar taking actions that would be consistent with doping operations (altering medical records, trying to explain away "testosterone medicine" in an athlete's file, clandestinely sending perfectly OK medication in a hollowed out book), and mutliple accusations from former athletes and coaches, but all this is actually just fine. On the other side, you have an actually dirty Salazar, acting like a doper (altering medical records, including "testosterone medicine" in an athlete's file, clandestinely sending medication in a hollowed out book), accusations from other of illegal behavior, and a previous history of athletes under his supervision using testosterone. Which of these two possibilities requires the smaller number of assumptions?

oilklkjlkjlkjkl wrote:

You do realize that the use of thyroid and asthma medication when not medically necessary is a doping violation, right?

This is absolutely and categorically false.

+1

That willfully ignorant guy certainly is misusing Occam’s Razor.

What test(s) did Dr. Brown use? When he speaks of "no significant change of values" - is he referring to the standard T/E ratio test? The only change of values I can think of would be the T/E ratio and the ABP steroidal module that measures fluctuations in values of testosterone and other androgen markers. But I believe he would have to have access to the WADA ABP software to run that kind of testing - and multiple tests would be needed to establish a longitudinal profile.

The other question here is if Salazar was worried about "sabotage," wouldn't he need to know the amount of T gel that was used? For example, there's a good study where a single dose of 100 mg T gel in 8 healthy male subjects was enough to present an atypical steroid passport. Out of these 8 subjects, 5 were tested for the presence of testosterone and only 2 met all the criteria for a positive test according to the rules set by WADA.

Androgel comes in 20.25 mg & 40.5 mg packets. 100 mg is going to be approximately one 40 and three 20 packets to reach the 100 mg single dose used in the study. Wouldn't Salazar have to know the mg dosage he used in his experiment that apparently did not result in any significant changes in values? (supposedly a "sh1tload?"). And if any "sabotage" was to occur wouldn't the amount used have to be the same amount or less that Salazar used in his experiment? Because a single 100 mg dose of T gel is enough to present an atypical ABP flag and the possibility of a positive test.

Why would he need to continue the experiment if he wanted to test the limits of testosterone administration when supposedly a "sh1tload" didn't cause any significant changes in values? Whatever that "sh1tload" dosage is, it could be the amount that would allow an athlete to fly under the radar of the ABP. And it couldn't be 100 mg or more as the aforementioned study showed just a single 100 mg dose is enough to trip the passport.

Armstronglivs wrote:

LM wrote:

Mo Farah is like a definitely doper category. Dominant athlete makes you suspicious. Farah though, has his missed tests, suspicious trips to Ethiopa, connection with dopers, and with Jama Aden.

Yea. That screams dirty AF.

So if you think Salazar was doping Farah and Salazar himself has committed doping violations, why would anyone think he wasn't doping others of his athletes?

I dont think Salazar was doping Farah. I think Farah looked elsewhere for dope on his own. Hence the connection with shady people and with Aden.

I say it as i see it wrote:

LM wrote:

Mo Farah is like a definitely doper category. Dominant athlete makes you suspicious. Farah though, has his missed tests, suspicious trips to Ethiopa, connection with dopers, and with Jama Aden.

Yea. That screams dirty AF.

Sad world if we see dominant athletes as suspicious. It's just not fair that some people are more supremely talented than you and I, right?

Nope. It isn't fair. But we know from history the vast majority of the most successful people in endurance sport have been doped up or linked to doping.

Possible clean performances are also well beyond what we have seen in even the dirtiest athletes.

However, put simply, if someone runs 12:30 5000 its much more likely they are doping them they are a once in a century talent.

They deserve benefit of the doubt, but if someone has a 70% chance of being doped, you have to be suspicious.

Not this sh!t again wrote:

oilklkjlkjlkjkl wrote:

You do realize that the use of thyroid and asthma medication when not medically necessary is a doping violation, right?

This is absolutely and categorically false.

Are you suggesting that prednisone would not be a banned without a TUE?

"In February 2011, barely a month into his tenure at the Oregon Project, Magness had his first run-in with a medical practice that bothered him. Rupp was headed to Dusseldorf to run an indoor 5K. But before he left, Salazar wanted him to take prednisone, a corticosteroid often used for asthma, Magness says. Because corticosteroids can block pain and potentially enhance oxygen consumption, and because overuse can suppress one's immune system, the medication required an official therapeutic use exemption in order to be used in competition. An athlete with such an exemption has been granted use of an otherwise restricted drug or treatment for medical purposes."

You may question the truth of this story, but are you saying prednisone is not banned?

We can agree that thyroid medications may not have been banned at the time. So, is your issue with statement above the inclusion of thyroid medication?

Aden found with performance enhancing drugs at camp - he's shady and all his athletes are doping.

Salazar found with performance enhancing drugs at camp (that he took as an athlete, is obsessed with, and had an athlete test positive for) - he's clean as a whistle and cares about his athletes more than any coach ever.