Not a leader wrote:
Why is it that leading a race at say, 5:10/mi pace and having several guys on your tail is monumentally more difficult than being in the middle of the pack at 4:50 pace? Is this a normal discrepancy to have?
The thing is those guys trailing you at 5:10 are also used to being in the pack at 4:50 and are resting more than you are as the leader doing more work.
they key here is that you only have a certain amount of will power. Using it up on deciding to stay out front has a material cost to you.
Following is easier because you don't have to make any decisions. You preserve your store of will power.
Then the best racers decide when to start using up their will power so it goes to empty as they finish the race. That's why you don't kick too early or too late.
FrenchDawg wrote:
wow!!!! wrote:
wow 4:50s you must be an incredible athlete! amazing
A 15 minute 5k is fast.
A 30 minute 10k is really fast
A 2:10 marathon is national class in all but 3 countries.
Please grow up.
Fixed it.
It's all about being mentally strong.
Don't forget about Japan wrote:
FrenchDawg wrote:
A 15 minute 5k is fast.
A 30 minute 10k is really fast
A 2:10 marathon is national class in all but 3 countries.
Please grow up.
Fixed it.
Kenya, Ethiopia, and Japan?
geoquestioner wrote:
Don't forget about Japan wrote:
Fixed it.
Kenya, Ethiopia, and Japan?
Yes.
mwh wrote:
That's about the smallest possible sample size, but this is a common experience that has fascinated me for decades.
Magness had a great article about the negative effects on endurance of attention/cognitive demands, summed up with the advice "turn off your mind and go for a ride" (by drafting to a PR).
Personally, I've always felt that leading also makes me expend energy inefficiently with constant minor adjustments to stride/pace, accelerating and decelerating, while drafters smooth out a more steady pace. At least it feels that way, along with lots of mental stress and having to pay attention to where I'm going (off track), my splits, what's going on behind me, etc.
And of course there are some other physical factors like wind resistance and other points made in this thread.
I think the requirement to worry about pace is huge.
Also I know pfitz in advance marathoning recommends running with a pack going faster (can’t remember by how much) than your goal pace than running alone at your goal pace in a marathon
Leading is hard for the same reason that being in the lead on the bell lap is a disadvantage: it's all in your head.
If there's a bunch of people behind you, odds are one of them is going to beat you, and you see that as a negative outcome. But if you are one of those midpack people, you've got about a 50/50 chance of gaining a few spots before the finish, which seems like a positive outcome.
On the track, first place is ALWAYS the best place to be at the bell. As a group, the others will probably still beat you, but none of its individuals have as good a chance, including that shoulder lurker and those backstretch bolts.
Not a leader wrote:
I appreciate all the replies. Context of the situation was I ran sub 24:30 in an 8K for the first time in a big race. Then, I go to a smaller race trying to front run and I ended up doing horribly. I am trying to figure out how to approach the championship meets given that I have a weakness both for 8K's and front running.
Just getting back to this but if you were dying in another race at a similar pace you were likely just tired going in or simply didn’t have it that day. Trust your training and run easy in the days leading up to big races and you’ll be fine. Have confidence and focus on competing during the race and place/time will take care of itself.
https://youtu.be/QDnu5vIATnUNot a leader wrote:
Why is it that leading a race at say, 5:10/mi pace and having several guys on your tail is monumentally more difficult than being in the middle of the pack at 4:50 pace? Is this a normal discrepancy to have?
If you’ve run 24:30 for 8K then leading at 5:10 pace should be easier.
Are you saying you can’t maintain 5:10 pace when you are leading?
Or are you saying you can’t maintain the lead and people pass you?
If it’s the latter, it’s because the people behind you are as good or better and the pace is easy for them while following.
If two races on the same course with all else truly equal feel that much different from the front v. drafting, the only explanation I would believe would be a lot of wind resistance -- which would have to come from a fairly strong wind. I think there are more likely other unrelated factors that you overlooked that made the race that you let more difficult.
After all, a 4:50 miler can run 3x5:10 in a workout all alone.
Thank you all for the replies. I think my issue is a lack of willpower, a slower course, and that my training has been changed (not for the better). I ran the 24:30 last year. It is harder to lead so I probably won't be doing that for a while.
Between running in a pack to a 24:10 8k vs soloing a 25:50, I think pretty much everyone would agree the 25:50 would be easier.
As a front runner, the difficult part of the race is dealing with people trying to pass after you've been leading. If they get around you, you'll probably give up. You've got to visualize and committ yourself to holding off any attackers or grabbing onto the person's pace when they pass you
Leading a race can be two things :
1. Immature running
2. The desire for an honest pace because the runner leading has no kick
Its mentally tiring knowing you're putting in more effort than those around you but also mentally relieving you aren't stuck in the pack unable to exert your energy in a fluid manner
Not a leader wrote:
Thank you all for the replies. I think my issue is a lack of willpower, a slower course, and that my training has been changed (not for the better). I ran the 24:30 last year. It is harder to lead so I probably won't be doing that for a while.
Wait, you're trying to compare a race this year to a race last year (and not even the same course?), and you think leading versus following is the main difference?
Seriously?