https://www.nation.co.ke/oped/editorial/stamp-out-doping/440804-5167050-deb91i/index.html
Kenyans know it is a problem.
Kenyans know it is a problem.
bichudo wrote:
Jesus Christ! What part of " non African born men broken 13:00 for the 5000 since the introduction of the biological passport?" You and other idiots mentioning Africans couldn't figure out in the question?
No, it's quite simple. In the ten years before the ABP just one non-African born male went under 13 minutes, and in the less than ten years since the ABP, three have.
I mentioned the Africans because this thread is a blatantly racist attempt to claim that the Earth is flat and that it's the rest of the world that has the doping problem rather than East Africa, despite all the evidence to the contrary including slowing African times.
And of course, after this weekend it might be four non-africans since the ABP, which would highlight even more the decline in African times. And this thread was presumably intended to throw shade at Jakob! What a face palm thread!
So, perhaps after this weekend -
One Non-African ten years before ABP. Four Non-Africans 9 1/2 years after ABP.
Twenty-Six Kenyans ten years before ABP. Twenty Kenyans 9 1/2 years after ABP.
If Jakob does it this weekend (or this year) it will mean in the last 3 1/2 years
One Non-African under 13 minutes.
Four Kenyans under 13 minutes.
Compare to same period 2001 to 2004 (July 21) at the height of the EPO era.
One Non African under 13 minutes.
THIRTEEN Kenyans under 13 minutes.
Sure, it's the rest of the world with the EPO problem.
Coevett wrote:
And of course, after this weekend it might be four non-africans since the ABP, which would highlight even more the decline in African times. And this thread was presumably intended to throw shade at Jakob! What a face palm thread!
So, perhaps after this weekend -
One Non-African ten years before ABP. Four Non-Africans 9 1/2 years after ABP.
Twenty-Six Kenyans ten years before ABP. Twenty Kenyans 9 1/2 years after ABP.
If Jakob does it this weekend (or this year) it will mean in the last 3 1/2 years
One Non-African under 13 minutes.
Four Kenyans under 13 minutes.
Compare to same period 2001 to 2004 (July 21) at the height of the EPO era.
One Non African under 13 minutes.
THIRTEEN Kenyans under 13 minutes.
Sure, it's the rest of the world with the EPO problem.
Just answer the question. If Jakob goes sub 13 beating the times of those you say are EPO cheats, then what is Jakob on?
Coevett wrote:
And of course, after this weekend it might be four non-africans since the ABP, which would highlight even more the decline in African times. And this thread was presumably intended to throw shade at Jakob! What a face palm thread!
So, perhaps after this weekend -
One Non-African ten years before ABP. Four Non-Africans 9 1/2 years after ABP.
Twenty-Six Kenyans ten years before ABP. Twenty Kenyans 9 1/2 years after ABP.
If Jakob does it this weekend (or this year) it will mean in the last 3 1/2 years
One Non-African under 13 minutes.
Four Kenyans under 13 minutes.
Compare to same period 2001 to 2004 (July 21) at the height of the EPO era.
One Non African under 13 minutes.
THIRTEEN Kenyans under 13 minutes.
Sure, it's the rest of the world with the EPO problem.
The rest of the World has the same EPO problem because oxygen delivery has been mythologized.
But no-one here wants to address this issue. So you people are part of the problem.
Alice N. wrote:
Just answer the question. If Jakob goes sub 13 beating the times of those you say are EPO cheats, then what is Jakob on?
He can't answer the question.
Using the same stats with different reasoning one could also say that the Kenyans were the same , pre and post ABP, though as someone pointed out the marathon had huge improvements, and that the non-africans suddenly improved to run sub 13.
So possibly the Kenyans may also have the same ABP pre and post and the non africans are finding a way to beat it?
Not my view, but just showing that any assumption can be made based on your racial bias
Coevett wrote:
If Jakob does it this weekend (or this year) it will mean in the last 3 1/2 years
One Non-African under 13 minutes.
Four Kenyans under 13 minutes.
Compare to same period 2001 to 2004 (July 21) at the height of the EPO era.
One Non African under 13 minutes.
THIRTEEN Kenyans under 13 minutes..
So are you saying doping has reduced significantly in Kenya since 2004?
That's a very specific condition.
And the fact that there was a race 3 people under 12:50 means that the biological passport has not precluded people from running very fast.
There are two main causes to explain the subject line.
1- There have been very few races at all where the field has even attempted to chase a rabbit and run fast. Most races have runners looking for place, not time.
2- African born men simply dominate that event in general. That's nothing new. Even before the biological passport there has never been a non-African that has run under 12:55. So your condition is moot.
Chris Solinsky is the fastest non-African 5000m runner ever if I am looking at the list right.
Are you implying some shadyness on his part?
The answer to the title is 3
As for ABP it really shows it has not made a significant impact on the times. Non-Africans 1 before and 3 after really doesn't say much. Could just be that track actually got a few more people with talent.
The African times could just mean a few runners with the talent decided not to specialize in the 5k.
Also some africans run itrationally fast penultimate laps just to ruin it all at 4600m.
fgsdfg wrote:
Coevett wrote:
In the ten years before the ABP was introduced, just one non-African born runner went under 13 minutes (Mottram).
In the ten years (almost) since the ABP was introduced three non-African born runners have gone under 13 minutes.
In the ten years before the ABP was introduced, 50 African born runners went under 13 minutes.
In the ten years since the ABP was introduced, 47 African born runners went under 13 minutes.
In the ten years before the ABP was introduced, 26 Kenyan runners went under 13 minutes.
In the ten years since the ABP was introduced, 20 Kenyan runners went under 13 minutes.
An we know that this trend for less sub African13 times has increased sharply over the last 5 years (especially in Kenya). It took a while for the ABP to have a chilling effect.
This despite the population of East Africa increasing substantially over the last decade.
As a yet another blatantly racist attempt to prove that Africans are genetically superior and in fact that despite all evidence the rest of the world has the doping problem, I'd say this thread is a truly spectacular fail that even Casual Observer and Rekrunner would be ashamed of.
So how will you justify Jakob's sub 13 if it happens?
First of all, you're 'quoting' a post that doesn't appear in this thread. You were looking for something to argue against apparently, so you put a very convincing list of facts together to suggest that EPO has always helped East African runners more than any others. True, but unless Coevett (you could have randomly made up any handle) actually posted this, you are attempting to create a strawman argument - specifically, that the darker the skin, the more likely to break rules - just to have something to rebut.
racism is no where to be found wrote:
dunes runner, are these videos racist?
You know they are racist, which is why you posted them.
Jon Orange. wrote:
The rest of the World has the same EPO problem because oxygen delivery has been mythologized.
But no-one here wants to address this issue. So you people are part of the problem.
Exactly, and the drugs have been mythologized - by big pharma / the brojos - in order to sell more of them.
Coevett wrote:
I mentioned the Africans because this thread is a blatantly racist attempt to claim that the Earth is flat and that it's the rest of the world that has the doping problem rather than East Africa, despite all the evidence to the contrary including slowing African times.
That's a blatant racist comment, completely contrary to the FACTS - which are that:
1) even though top 5k talented Kenyans have been moving to the marathon, the number of Kenyans under 13 minutes for 5k the last 10 years is almost the same as the previous 10 years;
2) most of the races in the last 10 years have been tactical, which makes "almost the same" even more impressive;
3) Kenyan marathon times have improved by leaps and bounds the last 10 years, completely busting your continuing racist theories.
You being allowed to continually post your racist comments on this message board is a testament to the racist nature of those who allow it to continue, and a continuing shame to you and your country.
Semiler wrote:
Also some Africans run irrationally fast penultimate laps just to ruin it all at 4600m.
dunes runner wrote:
racism is no where to be found wrote:
dunes runner, are these videos racist?
You know they are racist, which is why you posted them.
Kenyan media reporting on doping is racist?
Hold on now.... wrote:
fgsdfg wrote:
So how will you justify Jakob's sub 13 if it happens?
First of all, you're 'quoting' a post that doesn't appear in this thread. You were looking for something to argue against apparently, so you put a very convincing list of facts together to suggest that EPO has always helped East African runners more than any others. True, but unless Coevett (you could have randomly made up any handle) actually posted this, you are attempting to create a strawman argument - specifically, that the darker the skin, the more likely to break rules - just to have something to rebut.
First of all, see how at the top on my post comes the date and time and then "- in reply to Hold on now...."?
Now go to page 1 and see my post. After "- in reply to" there's a blank. It means Coevett's post was deleted.
I didn't attempt anything. I replied to a post he made.
Dont be a dope wrote:
racism is no where to be found wrote:
Kenyan media reporting on doping is racist?
It's a thread about non-African born men, not about African doping.
Yes, but how is Kenyan media and Kenyans talking about the rampant doping in Kenyan athletics racist?
It's a thread about non-African born men, not about African doping.
Great interview with Steve Cram - says Jakob has no chance of WRs this year
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