If a 16 minute 5k runner fully devoted themselves to training with a good mileage oriented coach like JK, how much could they improve in a year or two? Id like to get under 14 for 5k in two years, is it possible? Ultimately Id like to make the olympics in 2008, so really the bigger question is, how good could I get with 5 years of serious training?
I don't know. When you get there be sure to tell us. 14 minutes or 13:30 or faster isn't out of the question, just don't bet the farm on it.
A little story. Terrance Mahon was a decent high school runner with a 2 mile PR of 9:30. Nothing to write home about. He went to the University of Oregon as a walk-on, followed the program during his freshman year and did not improve at all. U of O is a pretty good program don't you think? Yet Terrance didn't improve. Why so? It was clear to me, he hadn't been doing his homework. He hadn't yet mastered the basics.
At the end of the school year he made the commitment to stay in town for the Summer to train and work. He asked me what I thought he should do. I said "Run more". "How much" he asked. "I dunno, but start running doubles and find out", I said. He followed it up with the usual litany of "how, what, when, where and whys". I gave him the usual "quit yer thinking and get runnin" He then asked, "but malmo, won't I get tired" My response, "you will, but it will soon pass".
The rest is history. Within 6 months Terrance was All-American in cross country AND ran a 28:57 10k on the track in December. The only things he did different from HS and his freshman years were 1) he ran doubles nearly every day 2) he ran 100 mpw most of the Summer 3) he ran a tempo run once a week 4) he ran long repeats (800-1 mile) once a week. Does that sound like any magic program? The point is, Terrance made the commitment and stuck with it. He also DIDN'T RACE THE WORKOUTS. Surprise of all surprises, he made the big breakthrough. In short, he WAS the Summer of Terrance. Where do you think I got the Summer of malmo from? I don't post anything original here do I?
A lot of you guys are capable of making the big breakthrough too. The problem is, you talk yourself out of it before you get started. You're willing to waste years convincing yourself that what is needed is countless ways of rearranging your mileage, yet won't, for a second, consider that what you really need is right there in front of your nose: the roads. Get out on the roads and run more. Master the basics, everything else will take care of itself.
Good luck.
What if you have trouble with the high mileage? I mean I can train consistently, but I really have to watch my mileage or else I become injured. Basically I have been doing about 40 miles per week for about 2 months and don\'t plan on trying to do about 45-50 for another month. Would you say that consistency is better?
Another thing, not going to hard and running the proper paces in your workouts is vital. I noticed that when I slowed down my tempo thousands to the proper paces, which were much slower than I used to run them, that after about 4-5 weeks I was much much stronger.
Please respond again Malmo or anyone who could help.
I've never met anyone who hasn't had trouble with higher mileage. No one said it was easy.
The fatigue will pass and your perspective will change.
One thing for sure, running 7 miles a day isn't proper preparation for distance running.
didn't TM run that freshman year at U of O?
nope
That's it, high mileage, a vo2max session, a treshold run, a lot of base work.
When you are not one of these sub 4:10/9:00 guys, train like Mahon.
Terrence Mahon went to Oregon? then transfered to Villanova?
Also, Malmo.. you are right... all you need to do is stick with it... it might just take longer for your body to adjust.
UO Nova You're catching on fast.
Duh:
Sorry, I am not so much of the Geek to track past runners whereabouts. Its was my previous knowledge that Mahon went directly to Nova.
It was not your previous knowledge, it was your ignorance that said Mahon went directly to Nova.
Troy, Terrance roomed with Brad Hudson and Colin Dalton at Oregon. Now you know the rest of the story.
didn't understand your link. anyway, when did TM run that sub 29? soph year?
regardless, i completely agree that his hard work and dedication are key.
TM's sophomore year would be correct.
while we are on this subject, I just wanted to see what you guys think of this runners situation... He came from a rural area ran 25-35 miles a week tops in high school, prs of 4:18, 9:32, 15:10 Got in an accident during the summer going into his freshman year of college. missed XC and most of indoor, ran one 3k in 8:30, then a few 3:55ish 1500s in outdoor, went down with 2 stress fractures halfway through outdoor season. Has a terrible time coming back misses XC sophmore year, starts up in january, has a decent race, then pops out a 2:56 1200/ 4:09 mile double one weekend. Finally starts to get rolling a bit, still no more than 60 miles a week, and no more than 10 days straight, playing it safe, but manages to run under 3:50, four times. doesn't get a fast race pr: 3:48. Goes to the west coast to train gets over ambitious injures himself (another stress fracture). Tries to come back for cross, runs a few races, but has been too ipatient, falls victum to another fracture.
The kids in his junior year he has had tests, no low bone density, just has to be more patient. Is taking it slow right now, working back. Just a real Frusturating situation.
Malmo and others, what could this kid run if he ever got healthy, he plans to dedicate his life to running for at least a few years after college
think JK could develop an olympian from a mediocre runner?
check out the "need help got a thyroid problem" thread. that kid's story sounds like a couple of the responses on there.
Well said Malmo!!!
To the 16min. 5km guy who started this thread:
Follow Malmo's advice:
(1) Volume of 100-120 mpw
(2) Tempo run of 8-12 miles once a week.
(3) 800's, 1000's, 1600's once a week.
(4) 20 mile easy run every two weeks (my additional advice to your program), comfortable pace.
GO FOR IT!!!!!!!!!!!!
mayeroff wrote:
Well said Malmo!!!
To the 16min. 5km guy who started this thread:
Follow Malmo's advice:
(1) Volume of 100-120 mpw
(2) Tempo run of 8-12 miles once a week.
(3) 800's, 1000's, 1600's once a week.
Very good advice, Jason, BUT I didn't make any of those recommendations. I only gave an example. "Summer of malmo" is a recommendation for low intensity off-season running.
My advice would be more like this:
(1) Get your mileage up. I don't know how much. You'll find out what's right once you look for it.
(2) Frequent tempo runs of 3-10 miles "up to" 5 times a week.
(3) once a week intervals consisting of any of the following: a) Hills, one to two minutes b)800-2000m repeats or c) 16-200 x 200-300m (full recovery). All of these can be done on the roads if you wish.
16-200 x 200-300? That's quite a range. I think I'll start with a set of 100. :)