Why no African cyclists? Because the white cyclists dope too?

A product of the great American school system, everybody. You all must be so proud.

I didn't read your entire post but I imagine there's no African cyclists because most can't afford to spend $8,000 for a good bike.

Look at the build of distance cyclists. The average elite cyclist have much stronger legs than distance runners. Really to be world class you need much stronger legs and ectomorph type builds won't dominate cycling. By the way there is at one East African cyclist who is a world class climber because he is so much lighter than European cyclists his name is Daniel Teklehaimanot.

I isn't read this wrote:

I didn't read your entire post but I imagine there's no African cyclists because most can't afford to spend $8,000 for a good bike.

Ahhh. Oh yea, I forgot they are all starving. Don't forget to buy the latest Band Aid charity single next Christmas so we can remind ourselves that the Africans are still living in the stone age.

So at least you'll admit it works the other way too? There are few world beating European distance runners because most can't afford to travel thousands of miles for altitude training? Except Mo Farah. But his Dad was the richest in Africa before he moved to Hounslow. Well maybe not as rich as El Kenio's parents.

Stupid argument. You don't need an $8000 bike to compete with other Kenyans in Kenya if nobody else has the money to buy bikes. Any guys with real talent would be paid thousands of dollars by professional teams in Europe to come train with them.

It costs money to play tennis at a high level. Most black Americans can't afford to join tennis clubs or buy $1000 racquets. Yet you still get occasional stars and even dominant greatest evers like the Williams sisters.

Most north africains in France are either playing football, boxing or running, most good cycling club are outside of the big city where north africans leave. I just can name one french cyclist arab Nasser Bouani.

And the genetic argument is bullshit for the french case, those north africans who are dominating the long distance running in France are slower than the White guys of the 80's.

@ElKeino

Why is it that white Europeans and Americans dominate the sciences, elite education, boardrooms etc. Surely it's not because they are somehow genetically more intelligent? You'd agree that blacks are at a disadvantage due to racism etc. i.e. cheating?

So why is it racist for a white European like me to claim that the success of African running over the last 25 years might be partly due to cheating?

I'm sure you can put your Ivy League education to a good use and come up with an answer.

Mewhawi Kudus is better than Teklehaimanot, but it's nothing to do with being so much lighter than European cyclists.

Of course there will be talent there, you just need the means to find it.

If a bunch of Renatos decided there was money in African cycling, they would exploit it. Otherwise, it's down to Dimension Data and charities like Qhubeka to do it fairly.

In other words, why do you accuse me of racism, when you are making the racist argument?

It's a fact that African athletes have dominated distance running for decades. Either they are in some way naturally more gifted, or they have gained an unfair advantage through cheating.

I say it's cheating, you say black athletes are superior. You are the racist, not me.

And I've never said Africans always cheated. There in no reason to believe that runners like Henry Rono or Filbert Bayi cheated. In fact, Rono took performance impeding drugs yet was still a legend.

It's plausible that the Africans developed a doping culture, likely began by Aouita and the North Africans, which spread to the Kenyans and Ethiopians helped by the increasing financial rewards and lack of testing in their part of the world.

Given the domination of white runners in the 60s,70s, and 80s, (with a few notable exceptions such as Rono), and taking into account the population growth and economic progress of Africa, you would expect Europe/America and Africa to be about equal in producing elite runners now. The fact that it is entirely balanced towards Africans, suggests PED use (not to mention the huge roll call of failed tests etc).

Well why would you dominate cycling when you can dominate running instead?

trollism wrote:

Of course there will be talent there, you just need the means to find it.

If a bunch of Renatos decided there was money in African cycling, they would exploit it. Otherwise, it's down to Dimension Data and charities like Qhubeka to do it fairly.

Well yes. You have 14 year old African kids spotted by Premier League talent scouts and their parents bribed with millions of pounds to let them traffick them into the UK to sign 10 year contracts and train full time at their academies.

There isn't as much money in cycling as premiership football, but the likes of Team Sky are comparable in terms of professionalism and resources. If Kenyans were so superior in endurance, I'm sure talent scouts would have unearthed a talented African by now. It's got nothing to do with Kenyans being too light or too heavy. Kenyan 800m runners like Rushida certainly aren't too light, and their 5000/10000 guys certainly aren't too heavy.

Actually, the reigning Tour de France champion and four time winner - Chris Froome - was born and grew up in Kenya. So I assume there must be at least a cycle track in Kenya.

Heard it from a friend wrote:

Well why would you dominate cycling when you can dominate running instead?

Because there is a lot more money in cycling.

Chris Froome earns £3 million a year with Team Sky. The winner of the Tour de France gets half a million. I'd wager that Chris Froome is the richest Kenyan born athlete ever.

Heard it from a friend wrote:

Well why would you dominate cycling when you can dominate running instead?

I don't have an opinion as to who is good at what and why. The answer to YOUR question is that cycling is more lucrative.

According to Google, the net worth of Lance Armstrong is $175 million. The net worth of Mo Farah is $5 million.

Froome only really started cycling seriously after he moved to South Africa.

There are a few decent Kenyan cyclists though, Froome aside.

Eritrea has some top notch bikers, and its a very poor country.

No telling what they could produce if they had the money for equipment and coaches.

And usually this means the Ethiopians could be decent too.

The biggest reason you dont get more bikers from Africa is infrastructure. Both in terms of equipment, bikes coaches, and places to train. The roads there are dangerous. Sadly I dont see things changing much.

The Africans genetic superiority is all about running economy, since they have perfect running bodies. They don´t have higher Vo2max or power than the rest of the world.

We often read on LR that if the Kenyans took up XC skiing they would dominate that, too. Well, I think you can travel for months in Rift Valley and still not find one single Kenyan who look like this:

http://www.adressa.no/incoming/article1346225.ece5/ALTERNATES/w980-default/Marit%20Bj

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Heard it from a friend wrote:

Well why would you dominate cycling when you can dominate running instead?

Agree that if you can dominate or nearly dominate running, why try something different?.

Running is much simpler and easier than cycling.

And running much more predictable than road race cycling. No crashes, no team tactics, no significant drafting, no mechanical failures.

after the very basics of function & fit, equipment is by far the least of the problems for the African bike racer. In the U.S. a world-class (except for wheels) race bike can be had for $1500 list, let alone $500 used bikes that remain superb.

development & coaching in a bike racing culture is HUGE, however and only South Africa has it to any great degree. If one could identify superior talent and export it to South Africa or Australia or Europe, there'd almost certainly be a # of elite black African racers, at least akin to those say from northern Spain.

Some injurned, burned out runners could perhaps transition over like Michael Woods did but again, that entails being in a cycling culture.