Greatest Female Marathon of All-Time: P. Radcliffe, C. Ndereba, N. Takahashi....?

ummmm, dumb@ss, why would there be Olympics in '02?

Vipam wrote:

A few posters stated that the Olympics and Worlds shouldn't account for that much; however, the fact that you have to put it together in one day makes medaling at either that more significant.

yet on the other hand, it **IS** only one day, which you could argue makes that one day insignificant in an otherwise great career (refer to the Norwegians). and we all know that shit happens beyond our control. still, history doesnt accept excuses for a "bad day,"--it's that one day that will separate her from the greats as the greatest........unless she pulls a muhammed ali and actually explicitly proclaims, "i am the greatest!"

Alfred China wrote:

ummmm, dumb@ss, why would there be Olympics in '02?

ever heard of a typo, dumbass?

Sarah wrote:

In running everything has to be perfect on the day and especially when you consider all the things that can go wrong ( or right) in a marathon.

exactly--and that's what separates the greats from the greatest.

princess of wales

I stated that one before but maybe the second time will sink in to UK boy. I said before and will say it again Paula is the most talented female marathoner ever (so far) but without one Gold she is simply the fastest not the greatest ever! The World Outdoor Championship is second only to the Olympic Marathon and Ndereba has medaled in both, won other major marathons, former world record, and several more extremely fast times (probably unmatched if you average her 10 fastest against other females), so maybe you need to get your face out of Paula's puddle and accept some people's opinion will differ from yours. If you asked 100 statistican who is the greatest do you think all of them or most of them would pick Paula without a marathoning Championship?

VIPAM

or put another way, would john elway or joe montana be considered the greatest QBs if they had perfect winnning records--except at the superbowl? afterall, the superbowl is only one day and anything can happen, right?

princess of wales wrote:

VA Beach wrote:

I'm astonished. Paula ran a 2:15 marathon. In that one single race, she became the best of all time. There can be no debate - she isn't immortal, but no one is even close.

why didnt taka-whatshername become the best of all time when she broke 2:20? or grete when she broke 2:30? or whoever it was who first broke 3:00. paula's record will not stand. the title of "world record holder" is only temporary. paula needs a permanent title like "world champ."

The IAA ranks PR's 2:15 = No.1 womens' distance race ever run.

The woman who wins a marathon race under 2:15 will then be the marathon runner that everybody else has to beat whether she wins O gold or not.

Gold medal means the competition was weaker on the day you showed up...Most athletes know Roger Bannister because of his time; they don't know or care about who won O gold 50 years ago!

Edith

Good on you Edith,

Your piece had me suddenly trying to remember just who did actually win the Olympic marathon in previous years.

Last year of course, I remember vividly.

Apart from Paula’s breakdown, who can forget that delightfully cute, bouncy Japanese girl who seemed to be able to run uphill at the same speed she ran downhill.

I did though have to check the spelling of her name before writing this.

But all the others?

Benoit in 84? Yes she’s most certainly memorable.

Mota? One remembers her long career, but wasn’t sure if she’d won a gold medal.

But Yergorova in 92 - and Roba of Ethiopia in 96?

Who the hell remembers them?

50 or a 100 years from now they’ll be just a footnote in athletic history books.

But Paula? - she’ll probably have a complete chapter to herself.

Remember the awed and anxious tone of Foster and Cram when Paula suddenly took off in her very first marathon?

They, like all of us were just waiting for her to die in the later stages.

But as she continued her relentless pace all the way to the finish - we knew we were witnessing the birth of a superstar.

And she’s OURS.

I still can’t get over the fact that what is on the surface, a normal, ordinary English girl, who came somewhere in the hundreds in her first cross-country race, could eventually run the three fastest marathon times ever - and by such a wide margin.

She’s a one-off.

Best appreciate her while we can - as with Coe, Ovett and Cram to a lesser degree - when she’s gone, no one’s around that could possibly replace her

SlgEdith, I can't believe you wrote this-

"Gold medal means the competition was weaker on the day you showed up..."

Wish I could use that excuse every time I lost, considering the Gold medal means you beat every country's Top 3 Marathoners in the World.

What separates a World Record Holder from the "Greatest" of All-Time is an ability to perform when it counts on the greatest stage of all, and in marathoning, this is the Olympics.

Where I am from, Radcliffe is just another Khalid Khannouchi, another Derek Clayton, another Jim Peters- she is an exceptional athlete, the fastest of our time, but she is not the BEST. In order to be the best, she must win.

Paula-Paula-Paula says it best when he/she compares her to Foster and Cram, both, who, according to the British media, had failed careers.

Paula Radcliffe up to this point has had a failed career, and you know who says this: Paula Radcliffe, not I.

Vipam wrote:

If you asked 100 statistican who is the greatest do you think all of them or most of them would pick Paula without a marathoning Championship?

VIPAM

Not all of them, but most of them.

Vipam wrote:

If you asked 100 statistican who is the greatest do you think all of them or most of them would pick Paula without a marathoning Championship?

When the Athletics Weekly team of stattos were asked, they all decided upon Paula.

end quote

outstanding response!

VIPAM

interesting stats concerning women the amount of times they've broken certain barriers, courtesy of iaaf

WOMEN

sub-2:20s & sub-2:21s: 4 – Paula Radcliffe

sub-2:22s & sub-2:23s: 5 – Catherine Ndereba

sub-2:24s: 8 – Ndereba

sub-2:25s: 9 – Ndereba

sub-2:26s: 10 – Ndereba

sub-2:27s: 14 – Joyce Chepchumba

sub-2:28s: 17 – Chepchumba

sub-2:29s: 19 – Chepchumba, Katrin Dorre

sub-2:30s: 21 – Dorre

You can easily tell the nationalistic responses on this board, especially Paula-Paula-Paula, when he/she wrote:

"Your piece had me suddenly trying to remember just who did actually win the Olympic marathon in previous years.

Last year of course, I remember vividly.

Apart from Paula’s breakdown, who can forget that delightfully cute, bouncy Japanese girl who seemed to be able to run uphill at the same speed she ran downhill.

I did though have to check the spelling of her name before writing this."

I don't want to say it's racist, just nationalistic, but over here in Japan and in Asia, you ask who is the better marathoner, Noguchi or Radcliffe, people will ask who? And then talk about Noguchi or Takahashi or Yuki.

I think Wang Junxia (WR holder 3K- 8:06; 10K- 29:31) said it best in an interview when asked about the phenomenal Radcliffe.. "who? Oh, I think I may have heard about her.."

I thought that was classic. See, in your myopic white world, Radcliffe is Queen, but step foot on the other side of the world (Japan, China, India, etc..) and people will do what they even do here- "Ratcliffe who? Oh, the WR holder who cannot race under pressure", and as her own teammate and countrywoman states (Liz McG), "the woman that is full of excuses, constantly."

Still, Paula will make this conversation moot when she wins the Marathon in 2008. Until then, there is no clear-cut "Greatest" yet, but Joan Benoit is up there (WR & Gold).

You've misquoted Wang Junxia there:

http://sport.guardian.co.uk/athletics/story/0,,1187970,00.html

Your argument holds no weight anyway. So what if Asian people who don't know much about athletics haven't heard of Paula Radcliffe. That just demonstrates their own ignorance of the sport.

(I think Wang Junxia (WR holder 3K- 8:06; 10K- 29:31) said it best in an interview when asked about the phenomenal Radcliffe.. "who? Oh, I think I may have heard about her..")

Yes, we’re all aware of Wang Junxia and her 'world records' and the methods employed to achieve them.

They were set at about the same time a horde of steroid-pumped up huge Chinese females suddenly appeared in the swimming and weightlifting arena, breaking the old world records set by our old East German comrades.

No surprise there, as they employed the ex-East German coaches.

Turtle soup? In yer dreams!

Alotta Libya wrote:

You've misquoted Wang Junxia there:

http://sport.guardian.co.uk/athletics/story/0,,1187970,00.html

Your argument holds no weight anyway. So what if Asian people who don't know much about athletics haven't heard of Paula Radcliffe. That just demonstrates their own ignorance of the sport.

Exactly. The reason Wang hadn't heard of Paula is because Wang no longer has any involvement with the sport at the international level. She probably wouldn't have known ANY top athletes (Mo Greene, Gebrselassie, Marion Jones, etc).

Besides, the point is moot as Wang does know who Radcliffe is.

You twerp!

Some countries seem quite content to import marathon (and 1500mts) runners from Africa to boost their ‘national records’ - but I’m certainly not going to apologise for celebrating Paula as our own native born, indigenous English girl who can probably trace her ancestry back to Alfred the Great.

She is of the same bloodstock that produced Shakespeare, Newton, Cook, Harvey, Faraday, Jenner, Fleming, Lister, Darwin, Rutherford, Arkwright, Stevenson, Nelson and a few thousand others that helped to shape modern civilisation.

Where on earth do you think the ‘Americans’ who fought for Independence, who wrote the Constitution came from?

Washington’s founding ancestor was a clergyman from Essex who landed in Virginia in 1657.

What countries blood flowed through the veins of Jefferson, Franklin, Madison - in fact all the forty odd souls who assembled in 1787to write the Convention?

Had it not been the fact that it was England’s genius and civililisation that was exported over to the thirteen colonies and implanted the perfect template for the colonists to adhere to - the USA today would be little different from those basket-case countries South of the Border.

I think we now have the definitive answer to the original question.

PAULA!!!!!!!!!!!!