Greatest Female Marathon of All-Time: P. Radcliffe, C. Ndereba, N. Takahashi....?

Vipam,

Doesn't Rosa Mota have a far more impressive championship record than Ndereba? Gold in the World Championships AND the Olympics.

Doesn't Grete Waitz have a more dominating record over a longer period of time? Didn't she bring marathon running to a completely new level?

Vipam,

I think Nguchi's championship record is better than Ndereba's. Gold in Athens and Silver in Paris is better than the other way round, unless of course you think running faster on easier courses is what it's all about. In which case there's only one athlete to consider.

Thanks for Mota's background SJD. My list of Ndereba, Waitz, Radcliffe, Benoit & Mota looks better as this thread goes.

Terrorizing Statistics wrote:

I think the point is that in order to justify calling Nereba the best of all-time, people are making the case for why she is better than Radcliffe, thereby conceding Radcliffe's status.

The only reason is because all the 12 year olds with a boner or on here calling Paula the greatest ever, because they don't know what "great" means. Greatest is NOT the same as fastest, see above where "Californian" compares his time to Pauvo Nurmi. A World Record DOES NOT make you the greatest ever (see Montgomery (100 meters), Bekele (10,000 meters), Mike Powell (LJ), etc).

Supposedly, she is trying to train for the marathon.Her coach is Mike Manly She was quoted saying she could do a 2:18 something. Only Time will tell.

Joanie without a doubt. Gold Medal winner and former world record holder. C'mon.

inmate #1AJ7892LG wrote:

Madein_82 wrote:

I’m partial to blue collar athletes, so Ndereba is defiantly my favorite female marathoner.

and she works in a women's prison. there's something strangely sexy about that.

I heard the announcer say that on espn during the Boston Marathon, but it's doubtful. Maybe she used to, but why would she waste her time answering phones at a prison. She made $100k at Boston last week. Maybe she has a title there like some kenyans run for the armed forces even though they probably don't do anything except run.

Catherine the Great is my favorite marathoner. She is truly a gracious women and sets even a higher standard for women other than running.

To see her at the awrds ceremony in a sparkling sequins dress wearing heels praising God was simply exquisite.

Back in Kenya she has an orphange for girls and helps to mentor them to become the best that they can be.

Lost wrote:

Greatest is NOT the same as fastest, see above where "Californian" compares his time to Pauvo Nurmi.

Depends on whether the fastest is only a little better than the rest or a lot. Radcliffe's WR is almost eight seconds per mile faster than Ndereba's fastest time and she holds four of the top five performances in an event that only lends itself to a couple of shots a year.

Also, did Californian say he was the world-record holder in the 10K or merely faster than Nurmi? Because, see, we're talking about the best of the best here. Nimrod.

So championships in the Marathon don't mean anything just time?

does anyone here know how much faster grete waitz ran than her competitors? how much faster ingrid ran than her rivals?

50 years from now, people arent gonna be talking about how much faster paula ran than her competitors. if she doesnt get a major win (ie WC/Olympics), **THAT** is what they'll talk about--her untapped potential to win the big prize. if paula doesnt have a complete resume of wins, there will always be questions and the dreaded, "BUT SHE DIDNT WIN THE WCs or Olympics."

ultimately, it's grete waitz who transformed the sport for women. running the first sub 2:30--who in teh late 70s/early 80s believed women could run that fast, especially when the sport had barely developed for them yet? the fact that paula runs 2:15-2:20 came as no huge shocking surprise, it was expected--eventually--and she wasnt the first to do it. paula has made the sport more competitive, but not on an earth shattering level like grete.

princess of wales wrote:

does anyone here know how much faster grete waitz ran than her competitors? how much faster ingrid ran than her rivals?

Most have a good idea, but the key thing is whether or not they were dominant with it. Kristiansen, Waitz, Benoit and Mota didn't have the same kind of dominance that Paula currently has. Paula's opposition at the weekend was pretty top-class, but she made them all look like amateurs.

The fact she dropped the pacemakers at 6miles and ran the world-leading time for a half marathon this year just underlines her dominance.

I agree that a global title would secure the deal for Radcliffe as being one of the best ever. But, in my opinion (and many others'), she already is the greatest.

Actually... athletics weekly ran a feature of top-ten marathoners of all time a year or so ago. I'll try and dig it out.

SJD wrote:

Actually... athletics weekly ran a feature of top-ten marathoners of all time a year or so ago. I'll try and dig it out.

Found the article, and I'll summarise their top ten below. Keep in mind that this list was published in July 2003 (before Ndereba's WCh win and OG silver and before Radcliffe's NYC and London wins).

There are Athletics Weekly's views (July 2003):

1. Paula Radcliffe

Sensational 3 marathons, 2 world bests and European Record in the other. Left world class fields in her wake each time. Was almost a mile ahead of Kastor when she set the AR. Has become dominant in the marathon.

2. Grete Waitz

Got nod over Kristiansen based on both championship and big-city-marathon performances. Won '83 WCh and won silver in '84 OG. Formidable in big city marathons. Nine NYC victories and two in London. Set 4 WRs. First truly world class marathoner.

3. Ingrid Kristiansen

Held WR for 13 years. Four London wins. More remembered for her big city marathons. Topped the world marathon rankings on four occasions in the 80's.

4. Rosa Mota

True champion, focused more on winning than setting fast times. Three European titles, World Champ, Olympic Champ (plus bronze). Won the World Marathon Cup. Three Boston wins, two in Chicago.

5. Joan Benoit Samuelson

Olympic champ. Held AR for 18 years. Former WR holder (Boston '83).

6. Tegla Loroupe

Twice broke WR. Three Rotterdam wins, two New York wins, plus wins in London and Boston. Fastest in the world each year from 1997-1999.

7. Naoko Takahashi

First woman to break 2.20, but WR lasted just seven days. Olympic champ. Won 1998 Asian Games in far from ideal conditions in 2:21:47.

8. Catherine Ndereba

Former WR holder. Two Boston wins, two Chicago wins. Finished 2nd to Radcliffe on each of her WR-breaking runs. Fastest in the world 2000-2001. Three sub-2:20 marathons.

9. Uta Pippig

Best in big city marathons. Three-time Boston winner, three-time Berlin winner, also won NYC. Her 2:21:45 was highlight of her career (although it raised eyebrows).

10. Lisa Martin-Ondieki

Won first two commonwealth games marathons. Silver in 1988 Olympics. Two commonwealth marathon records.

==================

Just to reiterate - the above list was published by Athletics weekly in July 2003. No doubt if there were to do another top ten today, then Ndereba would be in the top three.

Interestingly, my top ten list was very similar. I had nine of the ten women they chose (I had Dorre while they had Martin-Ondieki). My list was:

Radcliffe, Ndereba, Waitz, Kristiansen, Mota, Takahashi, Dorre, Benoit, Loroupe, Pippig.

A good way to see who is the most dominant....

Think of the word "marathon" and which female comes to mind first?

Gotta be Paula.

Vipam,

I think we will be able to write this in the next five years after Ndereba and Radcliffe have retired. It is still too early.

Radcliffe has run very few marathon races but she has just been stunning.

try asking that question 50 years from now. not a few days after paula/catherine have been headline news in the media.

when i think of the word marathon, i think "grete" and "joan benoit."

when i think of the words "greatest female marathoner", there is no clear cut individual that comes to mind.

ya'know you're right. 50 years from now there could be another young lady rolling along the roads. But Grete is plain and simply awesome...no gold, but still awesome.

She was the break out gal and just went home with it!

patti wrote:

ya'know you're right. 50 years from now there could be another young lady rolling along the roads. But Grete is plain and simply awesome...no gold, but still awesome.

She was the break out gal and just went home with it!

there were other breakout girls before grete (eg. whoever it was that broke 3 hours first), but when she broke out, she removed any lingering doubt that women could run short, long, and fast, and maintained her competitivenes for over a decade. paula and catherine, fast as they are, havent shattered any significant mental barriers for women.

Yeah, but Paula dropped out of the Olympics and she was on the ropes.