L L wrote:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2LX4Q643aEU
Cool. You found one video of a conservative misbehaving. F**k that guy (the assailant). 99.9% of us are against that behavior and think it's wrong. That's not how we generally act, and you know it. Trying to categorize conservatives as violent fascists (like leftists) is disingenuous and intellectually lazy. Go back and watch this video and I think you'll be surprised how hateful and violent your cohorts are. Then again, you probably already know.
Fat hurts wrote:
No free lunch wrote:
zero-cost electricity?
i want some of what you're smokin'
You can get zero-cost electricity today if you want it. Just put solar panels on your roof and add three or four Tesla power walls. Then you can disconnect from the grid and get all your power for free.
There is a large up front cost. It's going to be around $50,000. But depending on where you live, the system will pay for itself in less than 15 years. After that, you get another 15 years of free electricity.
So if we improve the technology, we can extend the same principle to the entire power grid. There is still a big upfront cost, but eventually, the system pays for itself and we enjoy electricity that is essentially free from then on.
And with improvements in technology and infrastructure, the payback period gets shorter.
So this is a rich man's thing.
Fat hurts wrote:
You are wrong. And I think your math is probably messed up.
Show how. I'm using the same sort of math used in your study.
Fat hurts wrote:
But just go to the summary of the assessment:
With continued growth in emissions at historic rates, annual losses in some economic sectors are projected to reach hundreds of billions of dollars by the end of the century—more than the current gross domestic product (GDP) of many U.S. states.
That's losses of hundreds of billions of dollars EVERY YEAR.
Yes, hundreds of billions per year by the end of the century.
The current annualized GDP of the world is 75 trillion and assuming 3% growth (might be a lot more) until the end of the century that's 800 trillion annualized.
So hundreds of billions per year is a small figure, even smaller than the 10% I took (which I think was in the report).
Then we haven't addressed that the green new deal doesn't actually recapture those economic losses because it won't actually stop climate change.
Like I showed, if you take 0.1% of GDP out of the economy every year, compounded over 81 years that's an 8% loss of GDP which would be 16 trillion by 2100.
I'm using the same sort of math that your study is based on. You're just quoting big numbers and I'm providing the context.
Fat hurts wrote:
You also fail to consider that green energy leads to zero-cost electricity, which grows the economy.
Assuming you're talking about solar. Real estate costs money (scarce in some areas), solar panels cost money (has gotten cheaper), transferring the power costs money. In sunny locations, it works great. No one has solar panels in Seattle yet because there's not enough direct sunlight. So solar isn't "free" any more than digging up coal and burning it is free.
BTW if you can provide extremely cheap energy, people will use it without any government intervention, so there's no need for a Green New Deal. Where we should have government intervention is nuclear which requires lots of government approval.
Fat hurts wrote:
Sally Vix wrote:
My track record on Global Warming over the last 30 years versus the climate "scientists" is fair superior to theirs. Take a weekend and read the IPCC reports - just a joke. My record on Global Warming far surpasses theirs.
You have no track record.
You do not know more than the climate scientists.
CORRECT! On both counts.
Coal is just solar power via photosynthesis & millions of years of pressure. Cutting out the millions of years would generally benefit you greatly in the short term.
Remember the guy with the trump stickers all over his van then tried to send bombs to Democrats?
Or the white nationalist in Charlottesville that killed the woman with his car?
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=v-Plzx73K68
Or the New Zealand mass murderer?
Or the Arizona mass murderer?
L L wrote:
Or the white nationalist in Charlottesville that killed the woman with his car?
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=v-Plzx73K68Or the New Zealand mass murderer?
Or the Arizona mass murderer?
Oh don’t mind Gary the eternal victim. Only his examples count as accurate generalizations of liberals, but any evidence you find of hate on the right is simply a one off because he says so. He gets whacked in the head every time he posts but apparently he can’t get enough.
L L wrote:
There is no chance of a new GOP healthcare plan being passed in the next year and a half.
In 2017 the Republican controlled House passed a healthcare reform bill that even they really didn't like.
Trump had a celebration in the Rose Garden (I don't think he knew then that the senate had to vote on it).
Then as the senate was considering it, Trump called the bill mean because it threw so many people off of insurance.
The Republican controlled senate then could not agree on amendments and never even passed their version of a healthcare bill.
Now Trump thinks a new bill will be passed to totally repeal Obamacare with a Democrat controlled House?
Trump is doing everything he can to dismantle the ACA and take away its effectiveness.
But there is no replacement.
And if the election cry in 2020 is to win back the House to try again then - ha!
Getting rid of the ACA is political suicide for Trump and the Repubs. I can't imagine the party as a whole is happy with the move.
Likely this is some sort of backchannel method of blaming the Dems, who now control the House, for not coming up with a better plan. I also guess it's possible that House Republicans bring forth an alternative which will never get off the ground with the House Dems and then Trump can point at the Dems for not moving the replacement forward.
No free lunch wrote:
Fat hurts wrote:
You can get zero-cost electricity today if you want it. Just put solar panels on your roof and add three or four Tesla power walls. Then you can disconnect from the grid and get all your power for free.
There is a large up front cost. It's going to be around $50,000. But depending on where you live, the system will pay for itself in less than 15 years. After that, you get another 15 years of free electricity.
So if we improve the technology, we can extend the same principle to the entire power grid. There is still a big upfront cost, but eventually, the system pays for itself and we enjoy electricity that is essentially free from then on.
And with improvements in technology and infrastructure, the payback period gets shorter.
So this is a rich man's thing.
If you want it now, yes.
If you want everyone to have it in a few years, support the Green New Deal.
Fat hurts wrote:
No free lunch wrote:
So this is a rich man's thing.
If you want it now, yes.
If you want everyone to have it in a few years, support the Green New Deal.
If the Green New Deal passed today, how long before everyone can get free electricity?
Trump stepping up his border threats. I have a strong suspicion he is going to try to turn the mess he made into a strategic move... why not actually create an emergency and then force the country to have to help him clean up his mess so he gets his way? Fckng sick individual he is.
Barr will send a "properly redacted" Mueller Report by mid-April.
Does any trust this?
Wouldn't it be nice if the Independent Council reported to an independent entity to review the findings instead by a person appointed by the person being investigated?
The Fokus wrote:
L L wrote:
There is no chance of a new GOP healthcare plan being passed in the next year and a half.
In 2017 the Republican controlled House passed a healthcare reform bill that even they really didn't like.
Trump had a celebration in the Rose Garden (I don't think he knew then that the senate had to vote on it).
Then as the senate was considering it, Trump called the bill mean because it threw so many people off of insurance.
The Republican controlled senate then could not agree on amendments and never even passed their version of a healthcare bill.
Now Trump thinks a new bill will be passed to totally repeal Obamacare with a Democrat controlled House?
Trump is doing everything he can to dismantle the ACA and take away its effectiveness.
But there is no replacement.
And if the election cry in 2020 is to win back the House to try again then - ha!
Getting rid of the ACA is political suicide for Trump and the Repubs. I can't imagine the party as a whole is happy with the move.
Likely this is some sort of backchannel method of blaming the Dems, who now control the House, for not coming up with a better plan. I also guess it's possible that House Republicans bring forth an alternative which will never get off the ground with the House Dems and then Trump can point at the Dems for not moving the replacement forward.
Trump knows he has a credibility problem because he cant' help lying about almost everything. So his defense is to follow through on campaign promises, no matter the damage he does.
Get out of the Iran deal, no matter nuclear destruction and european allies
get out of paris for no good reason at all but el planeto destructo
build a stupid wall that wont' stop illegal immigration but will cost billions and take decades
end obamacare even if it takes away coverage from tens of millions.
etc.
he feels he has to follow through for political purposes - as a defense to his lying. And so he can say 'hey I'm not one of those politicians who make promises they can't follow through on.
And that's why the wall is so dangerous to him. If it doesnt' get built, dems will say his signature promise went unmet, and leave it at that.
Trollminator wrote:
Trump stepping up his border threats. I have a strong suspicion he is going to try to turn the mess he made into a strategic move... why not actually create an emergency and then force the country to have to help him clean up his mess so he gets his way? Fckng sick individual he is.
He threw Devos under the bus.
He’s not going to close the border. It would be political and economic suicide and grounds to roll out the 25th amendment talks again.
Border Patrol needs more processing capacity for those seeking asylum. That’s the emergency. Instead Trumo wants a wall.
Alan
L L wrote:
Barr will send a "properly redacted" Mueller Report by mid-April.
Does any trust this?
Wouldn't it be nice if the Independent Council reported to an independent entity to review the findings instead by a person appointed by the person being investigated?
And then we'd need an independent entity to review the independent entity.
Hardloper wrote:
Fat hurts wrote:
You are wrong. And I think your math is probably messed up.
Show how. I'm using the same sort of math used in your study.
Fat hurts wrote:
But just go to the summary of the assessment:
That's losses of hundreds of billions of dollars EVERY YEAR.
Yes, hundreds of billions per year by the end of the century.
The current annualized GDP of the world is 75 trillion and assuming 3% growth (might be a lot more) until the end of the century that's 800 trillion annualized.
So hundreds of billions per year is a small figure, even smaller than the 10% I took (which I think was in the report).
Then we haven't addressed that the green new deal doesn't actually recapture those economic losses because it won't actually stop climate change.
Like I showed, if you take 0.1% of GDP out of the economy every year, compounded over 81 years that's an 8% loss of GDP which would be 16 trillion by 2100.
I'm using the same sort of math that your study is based on. You're just quoting big numbers and I'm providing the context.
Fat hurts wrote:
You also fail to consider that green energy leads to zero-cost electricity, which grows the economy.
Assuming you're talking about solar. Real estate costs money (scarce in some areas), solar panels cost money (has gotten cheaper), transferring the power costs money. In sunny locations, it works great. No one has solar panels in Seattle yet because there's not enough direct sunlight. So solar isn't "free" any more than digging up coal and burning it is free.
BTW if you can provide extremely cheap energy, people will use it without any government intervention, so there's no need for a Green New Deal. Where we should have government intervention is nuclear which requires lots of government approval.
Your math is wrong. Those hundreds of billions per year is just in the US. Worldwide, the losses are in the trillions per year. And beyond the monetary losses, billions of people will die.
Whether or not the Green New Deal will work is not something you can know because it hasn't been defined yet.
But we do know how to mitigate climate change. And if we do it right, it will work.
Now to your comments about solar. I'm actually talking about other renewables as well. And if you think we can't power the nation on renewables then you are dead wrong.
Your example of Seattle is way off base. Washington state gets 2/3 of its power from hydro. And, there is abundant wind, so that source is growing fast. Washington will be relatively easy to wean off of fossil fuel because the already don't use that much of it.
Pro-Brexit (and pro-Russian) campaign in U.K. in 2016 admits election-law offenses, pays $80,000 fine. Sound familiar?
Flipping you off, Russia.
No free lunch wrote:
Fat hurts wrote:
If you want it now, yes.
If you want everyone to have it in a few years, support the Green New Deal.
If the Green New Deal passed today, how long before everyone can get free electricity?
It would probably take 15 to 20 years to completely switch to free energy. Rates would start to go down sooner than that.
The positive economic effects would start immediately as more and more people get jobs in the clean energy sector.
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