Is anyone working in academia actually happy with their career path?

I love this. The correct answer is no, unless you're a star in your field.

I'm a new Asst. Prof. in one of the "flyover" states. I made a mistake. Most of my colleagues feel the same way. I had a great job in NYC and then LA for 60k-70k and lots of perks 7 years ago. I decided to go back and get my masters. I had several job offers for a bit more than my old salary after the masters but decided to pursue academia. It took me 5 more years to get the PhD. I'm 34 now and I've been in higher ed for 11 years. 11 years of lost income. Ok, take out undergrad - that's 7 years of lost income. The interns I hired are now making over 150k.

I am lucky to work in a field where I'm making $170k as an Asst. Prof. this year. I was extremely lucky. As far as academia goes, I'm in the 1%. For every person like me in my program there are 4 that have no job or are making half of my salary and teaching twice as much.

Oh you say, that's so much money! It is a 3 year contract and my combined loans from the 3 degrees is over 100k. When you break down my loans and the lost earnings it was a stupid decision. My chances of tenure at this institution are about 15% based on the hires over the last 15 years. I'm a moron, so I'm probably screwed. I'm already in a flyover state so I'm facing a big salary cut in another city or looking for a new career in 3 years. It will be 6 years if I'm lucky. The pressure that creates sucks. Your job skills force you to move your family.

I also sought industry jobs in my field and I was offered a similar salary in a major coast city. I chose to pay off my loans and move to the college town in a "flyover" state. As I approach 40 those offers will disappear in my field. My story is better than average.

I would not recommend a PhD to many people. However... the professors that I do know that are research active and tenured in their 60s love their job. If you make it to that stage you're living the dream. You set your own schedule, you pick what you work on, you get paid well, and you're colleagues are jealous of you and respect you. I hope I make it.

I went to an expensive liberal arts college and pretty much all of my professors were very happy with their lives. Get 120K per year, have a spacious office in a beautiful old building, work on your own schedule, spend your days thinking about something that's interesting to you, teach 2 discussion classes per semester, take your dog to work, spend your days in the middle of what is essentially a park, travel all over the world for conferences, take 3-month summer breaks and go on year-long sabbaticals every few years... Working at a rich school is a paradise.

*the above post describes the life of a professor on the tenure track. Visiting assistant professors' lives are more precarious.

I always thought my career would be in academia (biociences) but I recently escaped to industry and am very happy with my decision. The biggest problem with academia is that there’s a huge glut of PhD/postdocs who do all the actual work and limited tenure-track professorships that have 1000 applicants for each position. And nothing in between. I did a postdoc in a world-leading lab but only ended up with 1 high-impact first-author paper and started to see the writing on the wall that I’d be a perma-doc if I didn’t change things. I did another short postdoc with a big pharma company which lead to a permanent job fairly quickly.

I was a bit reticent about going over to the dark side, but it has been a pleasant surprise just how “academic” my research has been here. We are encouraged to follow interesting tangents and publish where we can. Also there’s the opportunity to get more involved in other aspects of the company and move away from the lab into all sorts of business areas. I realize the company could be suddenly bought out or I could be made redundant, but it still feels a lot more stable than the boom and bust of grant funding.

Every time I see my old friends who are still postdocs all they talk about is the politics of getting papers out and obsessing over impact factors. They all seem really stressed and/or depressed. I think some of them will be following my path in the coming years.

I'm a tenured professor and am mostly happy. I think grad school (PhD) in X is a decent idea if a) you're really really good as an undergrad in X ,b) you're obsessed with X and have a hard time imagining doing anything else, c) you're willing to live in real poverty during your grad school years (don't take on debt!), you're willing to move anywhere to go to grad school and are willing to move several times again anywhere before maybe! settling down in a job anywhere.

That's how I put it to my students. Most choose not to go. But some do go. And I think they'll (many!) will be part of the profession.

There are some ducking psychopaths in academia.

Bravo to this poster. All true. I left my pure academic position in biz school despite being offered tenure because the culture of my mid-tier university was bereft of genuine curiosity. The apathy was killing my soul despite summer off, etc... Loved teaching but disliked the feeling of being a short phase in students' lives.

I'm a professor and I've worked as an administrator in higher ed. You are almost certainly not making 170k/year as a visiting asst professor (which is what you are if you're on a 3 year contract). Did you mean over the course of 3 years?? There are very few tenured professors making 170/year and the ones who are do not work in the 'flyover' states.

My own experience has been a mixed bag. Despite the caca you read on here, the lives of even tenured professors are dominated by their work. The average work week is probably 70-80 hours during the school year and 40 or more during the summer, depending. Given all the cuts to education over the last 25 years, the pay, in general, is not good. Small private liberal arts institutions are facing extinction. Administrators in general are very bad at their jobs. The US hardly has a culture which respects intellectuals.

That said, I love most of the day to day of my job. I love working with students, teaching, and, when I get the time, research. I work very hard, but I have some flexibility. There's probably only 20 hours per week when I have to be somewhere definite doing something specific. Because I'm a mathematician, I can do research anywhere - some of my best ideas have come to me on long runs. So there's that.

I think if I didn't have a family, this would have been an idyllic choice. But finding time to spend where I"m really focused on my boys has entailed making sacrifices professionally. The pay sucks and so, despite being a native speaker and good teacher in a field in which there are few of either, I make only enough, by myself, to afford a lower middle class lifestyle for my family.

I do recommend that some of my students pursue a PhD. I do issue caveats when I do, though.

So, bottom line, it's probably like most professions. Some good some bad.

The experiences of those in academia are similar to those in other professional occupations in terms of life/work satisfaction. There is one difference, though, academics seem to find the time to reflect on their current situation more than any other profession.

ohhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh wrote:

hhmmmmmmmmmmmm wrote:

Oh you mean a niche field that effects millions of people.

Nice try though.

Why don't you man up and tells us what field of research you are in. Or are you afraid its just another nich field full of hacks.

DO YOU REALIZE WHAT YOU HAVE DONE?

LRC THIS IS IRONY. THIS IS YOUR DEFINITION.

chill dude. it's an online message board...

I also teach inner city, and this completely unnecessary attack about sums up why people can't stand academics. Is public education perfect? Of course not. But there is also an opinion that professors lack oversight and accountability. Now that's probably not true, but teachers face untrue stereotypes as well, so how does it feel?

And what the hell does "deserving and capable" students even mean!? I'm assuming something along the lines of: white, upper middle class. So what's your solution, shut down schools in major urban centers? Capital idea. I'm sure there will be far fewer "illiterate morons and imbeciles" that way.

Academics "teach" students who are already motivated and reasonably successful. Teachers teach every single student. Every single one, and we don't turn anyone away. Non-English speakers, immigrants, homeless students, students with incarcerated parents/deported parents/murdered parents, you name it. So no, they won't all be as successful as your upper middle class, hungover white kid in class courtesy of daddy's money. But some of them will be, and the ones that are will surpass the average college student because they have true grit.

But, continue on conducting the hundred thousandth study on whether or not coffee and dark chocolate help prevent cancer. I'm sure you're doing God's work.

somebloke wrote:

why the hell HS teachers are expressing their opinions here? OP is asking about something completely different. Last time I checked HS teacher don't do research.

"Your welcome".

High School teachers are too busy to learn difficult words like academia..

What's with all the people complaining about the pay for professors? I just looked it up, and the average prof salary at my school is $160K (2013-14 numbers, so maybe a bit higher now). The article I read also mentioned that my school has the lowest average professor salary in its conference, so all the other schools are paying even more.

I get that being an adjunct or assistant can be rough, but the salary once you are a full professor doesn't seem to terrible.

$160K isn't bad wrote:

What's with all the people complaining about the pay for professors? I just looked it up, and the average prof salary at my school is $160K (2013-14 numbers, so maybe a bit higher now). The article I read also mentioned that my school has the lowest average professor salary in its conference, so all the other schools are paying even more.

I get that being an adjunct or assistant can be rough, but the salary once you are a full professor doesn't seem to terrible.

For every full professor, there are >10 NTT (non tenure track) faculty where I am. NTT faculty generally don't cross over to TT in R1 schools.

Working your way up to $160k usually takes a number of years - for most people reaching full status takes 10-12 years.

Negotiating large salary raises usually requires a bona fide offer from another institution. For 5-6 years, I was literally looking for a job every year - I only brought the one offer I would have taken back. For that, I went from making $90k to $130k per year. It is very stressful to go on interviews, etc.

If I hadn't done all that, I would probably still be making $90k.

The one benefit that no one has mentioned is that at most schools, you can earn up to 22% of your base salary during the summer months if you have external grants. Under extraordinary circumstances, you can even get 33% if you sign a letter stating that you won't take vacation.

Oh great, another bleeding heart who is saving the inner city one misunderstood soul at a time.

Let's see what the educational establishment has given us over the last 50-60 years:

1) New Math - lets confuse kids with base 6 and inequalities before they even understand the number line! Great job guys!

2) Social promotion/self esteem - Take away all accountability for students and fill their heads with nonsense over their self worth

3) NCLB - people love to blame Bush for this one, but we all know he's not smart enough to come up with something so stupid and devastating to schools

4) Common Core - hey guys, you know what? American kids don't suck enough at math. Let's make them learn a confusing formula for addition that is not single-valued and can be used to prove that 10 + 9 = 21.

For many years, there has been no accountability in your profession. Because of the clout of the NEA and member organizations, you were untouchable. People are finally pushing back, and I expect systemic change over the next 10-20 years.

Here's a novel concept - school is for learning. It's not for saving your children of murder victims, baby mammas, wanna be gangbangers, etc. Those are indeed terrible circumstances, but it is up to the community to address them, not the educational system. You have been robbing Peter to pay Paul for many years. The NEA has been fighting every move that could help the few students worth saving for the last 30 years whether it be vouchers, charters, or anything else.

I, and pretty much every other teacher I've ever spoken with, believe Common Core (the math in particular) is severely flawed. There are good ideas, but it's just another new initiative cooked up by textbook companies and the Secretary of Education, who never taught in his life. Do you seriously believe teachers write that garbage? I am not sure why you're blaming us for that.

You go on to imply that TEACHERS of all people support/even somehow wrote NCLB!? Good God, teachers are its harshest critic! Am I misreading you?

The self esteem crap is parenting, and if schools don't coddle kids enough, parents get in the administration's face, which doesn't want to deal with it, so it comes down to us. I don't like that part either, believe me. If it was up to me kids would still be allowed to sit in a corner with a dunce cap on.

If my students don't succeed, I have to account for that to the powers that be. A lot of kids absolutely are illiterate morons. You won't get an argument from me on that one. But there are legitimate reasons. Some are severely mentally disabled, some aren't fluent in English yet, etc. Even with those handicaps, my students still have to show growth under my instruction. If not, I will be fired. That is 100% true, teachers aren't nearly as untouchable as you might think. I have seen it happen many times.

I guess I just don't understand the reason for your bombastic tone, Professor. I am busy for the rest of the weekend so I won't be responding, but have a good fall semester doing whatever it is you do.

+1

llort_vbo sounds like a pompous ass who feels the need to bash others in order to feel important.

How pathetic.

I was an adjunct making $10k a year for a while. The football coach made $2.7 million a year. That was the end of it for me.

I am an adjunct Prof at a local JC and love it. My situation a bit different than the other posts I have read on adjuncts here though. I have a full time gig that I also like, just show up and teach nights @ the JC and have complete control of my curriculum and what I teach. I rarely have to deal with the on-campus politics and insignificant admin bickering. The adjunct pay is also decent in terms of the hourly rate. My prep time is about nil as I have been doing it for nearly a decade and have the subject matter wired. I also teach and train younger employees at my "real job." Teaching rules.

I could see myself transitioning to more teaching if/when I leave the current job. Getting these kids to commit to a 4 year JC/University plan and become successful makes it all worth it.

hhmmmmmmmmmmmm wrote:

somebloke wrote:

Your field is nothing like mine, and likely nothing like anything other than the very specific case of educational research.

You are in a very specific niche. One I consider to be full of hacks, actually.

Oh you mean a niche field that effects millions of people.

Nice try though.

Why don't you man up and tells us what field of research you are in. Or are you afraid its just another nich field full of hacks.

It affects millions of people, millions of kids. It is important. I feel given its importance it should draw better researchers. It does not. It is very niche-y.