Who wins? I think it is a very close call, and it is probably going to be a fairly even split if they raced 10 times.
Who wins? I think it is a very close call, and it is probably going to be a fairly even split if they raced 10 times.
I suppose Kenenisa could run about 5:52 in his prime, and Asbel might be able to do that, also.
mfoemfoe wrote:
Who wins? I think it is a very close call, and it is probably going to be a fairly even split if they raced 10 times.
I think Asbel would win more often than not (something like 7-3 or 8-2). The better comparison is Daniel Komen vs Asbel Kiprop.
reefermad wrote:
I suppose Kenenisa could run about 5:52 in his prime, and Asbel might be able to do that, also.
It is more likely that Bekele could have run 5:49 at his best. Not sure about Kiprop.
May as well throw El G into the mix, except I reckon El G would be the GOAT 2400m runner.
Old Man Winter wrote:
May as well throw El G into the mix, except I reckon El G would be the GOAT 2400m runner.
Yes, possibly, although I guess among ElG, Komen, Kiprop and Bekele the only other name that belongs might be Geb. Maybe Morceli or Cherono (Shaheen) could be factors, but maybe longshots to win.
RunWild wrote:
mfoemfoe wrote:Who wins? I think it is a very close call, and it is probably going to be a fairly even split if they raced 10 times.
I think Asbel would win more often than not (something like 7-3 or 8-2). The better comparison is Daniel Komen vs Asbel Kiprop.
No way Kiprop has the endurance to defeat Bekele 7 or 8 times out of 10. Bekele was much tougher than Kiprop.
eh ???
how come kennster was never "tough enough" to crack 3'32 when Abel has gone 3'26 & mo 3'28 ???
still, i see Asbel's limit distance being ~ 2k for maybe 4'45/4'46
my gut feeling is that Asbel's "wrong distance" is 1500 even though he couda had the wr if not for ridiculous 53.9 opener & too slow 2nd 400
i don't think he fully "lasts" 1500 even though possibly has the wr in it if monaco had been better paced
he is likely a better 800 runner off his training than 1500 but never really attacked a 800 from the gun
i estimated that souly, another primary 1500 guy couda run 1'41.5 in monaco if not ridiculous extra 8.5m on bends / lack of drafting in race / giving up at finish when knowing he was beat, in a "perfect 800"
if souly is capable of that, Asbel, a far superior talent, shoud be capable of dipping into 1'40s if he attacked the 800 from the gun in current shape
ventolin's little bro wrote:
Old Man Winter wrote:May as well throw El G into the mix, except I reckon El G would be the GOAT 2400m runner.
Yes, possibly, although I guess among ElG, Komen, Kiprop and Bekele the only other name that belongs might be Geb. Maybe Morceli or Cherono (Shaheen) could be factors, but maybe longshots to win.
Ummm...ever heard of Mo Farah. He could run 2400m with these guys.
Yeah, and Bernard Lagat at some point in his career could have run a pretty fast 2400m, fast enough to make Bekele's head spin.
I think El G would beat them both easily (beat Kenenisa in his prime in Olympic 5k so I think he obviously wins at 2400m as well, and I think he beats Kiprop at 1500m and had much better endurance so wins at 2400m for sure).
After El G, I would put Komen and Lagat in their primes before those two at this distance.
kartelite wrote:
I think El G would beat them both easily (beat Kenenisa in his prime in Olympic 5k so I think he obviously wins at 2400m as well, and I think he beats Kiprop at 1500m and had much better endurance so wins at 2400m for sure).
After El G, I would put Komen and Lagat in their primes before those two at this distance.
El G beat Bekele in a sit and kick 5k (after Bekele had run the 10k). I assumed the OP was talking about time trial ability. Do you really think El G could run 12:37?
ventolin^3 wrote:
eh ???
how come kennster was never "tough enough" to crack 3'32 when Abel has gone 3'26 & mo 3'28 ???
Ventolin your comment makes no sense. Kiprop and Mo both had perfect rabbit attempts or someone to chase in those races. What are Farah's next recent best times? Somewhere around 3:32 I'm guessing.
Bekele's 3:32 was from a race that had very uneven pacing. He was racing. He was good for sub 3:30 that day. I think his opening lap was pretty quick and his 2nd or 3rd was very slow.
Oopsies wrote:
kartelite wrote:I think El G would beat them both easily (beat Kenenisa in his prime in Olympic 5k so I think he obviously wins at 2400m as well, and I think he beats Kiprop at 1500m and had much better endurance so wins at 2400m for sure).
After El G, I would put Komen and Lagat in their primes before those two at this distance.
El G beat Bekele in a sit and kick 5k (after Bekele had run the 10k). I assumed the OP was talking about time trial ability. Do you really think El G could run 12:37?
Yeah you sound like you know what you're talking about, champ.
1) When did I imply El G could run 12:37? He could certainly have run 12:4x though. This was about 2400m, not anyone's 5k potential.
2) Who said anything about time trials? This was about racing, where does the OP mention time trials? Where does your assumption come from?
3) El G beat Bekele after rounds and an incredibly tough fight in the 1500m against Lagat. He probably had a more grueling path to the 5k finals than Bekele (who won the 10k easily in a pedestrian time for him), and if Bekele couldn't beat El G in a 5k you'd be crazy to take him in a 2400m. But I'd have been quick to take the other side of that bet.
kartelite wrote:
1) When did I imply El G could run 12:37? He could certainly have run 12:4x though. This was about 2400m, not anyone's 5k potential.
2) Who said anything about time trials? This was about racing, where does the OP mention time trials? Where does your assumption come from?
3) El G beat Bekele after rounds and an incredibly tough fight in the 1500m against Lagat. He probably had a more grueling path to the 5k finals than Bekele (who won the 10k easily in a pedestrian time for him), and if Bekele couldn't beat El G in a 5k you'd be crazy to take him in a 2400m. But I'd have been quick to take the other side of that bet.
You implied it when you said Bekele couldn't beat El G in a 5k. If Bekele can run 12:37 then that means you think El G can run faster than 12:37.
El G did not have an "incredibly tough fight" with Lagat. It was a sit and kick race that was decided in the last ~50m just like the 5k vs Bekele was. No, 10k is longer than all of El G's rounds added together.
Oopsies wrote:
You implied it when you said Bekele couldn't beat El G in a 5k. If Bekele can run 12:37 then that means you think El G can run faster than 12:37.
I'm very curious if you can quote where I said (or came anywhere close to implying) that Bekele couldn't beat El G in a 5k? Very, very curious.
Even if I had said that, it's possible that El G could beat Bekele heads up more often than not in a 5k even if he didn't have the same time trial ability.
And remind me again, WHEN DID THIS BECOME ABOUT TIME TRIALS? OR 5K? Oh that's right, it's not! I feel like I'm trying to debate a fruit fly here.
It was not sit and kick. They closed the last 800m in 1:46. It wasn't a time trial scenario but it was a long drive. Sit and kick and time trial aren't the only two kinds of races
8 man field (Minimum for para-mutual wagering) w 1500/3000 prs
Kiprop - 3:26.69/ 7:42.32
Bekele- 3:32.35/ 7:25.79
Komen- 3:29.46/ 7:20.67
Lagat- 3:26.3/ 7:29.00
Farah- 3:28.81/ 7:33.1
El G- 3:26.00/ 7:23.09
H.G.- 3:33.3/ 7:25.09
Auoita- 3:29.46/ 7:29.45
For a 2400 meter race my Trifecta bet would be El G, Komen, then Lagat in a nose over the rest of the field
El G's 4:44.79 2000 M WR is "equivalent" to a 2400 of approx. 5:47
Komen's 7:20.67 3000 M WR is "equivalent" to a 2400 of approx. 5:46
Komen was 5:51 low at 2400 en route to 3000 M WR. With that in mind, it seems likely that both EL G and Komen could break 5:50 for an all out 2400. I give edge to El G over Komen, due to more extensive championship racing credentials and faster finishing speed. Just my opinion.
kartelite wrote:
I think El G would beat them both easily (beat Kenenisa in his prime in Olympic 5k so I think he obviously wins at 2400m as well, and I think he beats Kiprop at 1500m and had much better endurance so wins at 2400m for sure).
After El G, I would put Komen and Lagat in their primes before those two at this distance.
This ^^^
Kiprop is a 1k/1500m guy, Bekele was a 3k/5k/10k guy
El G, Komen, and Lagat had that mid-range
El G- 3:26 (WR)/4:44 2k (WR)/7:26 3k/12:49 5k
Komen- 7:20 3k (WR)/12:39 5k 3:29 speed
It would be close between these two, I really can't decide, but I'd still have to go w/ El G
Then 3rd Lagat- transitioned from 3:26 to 12:53 over the years w/ 7:29 3k
8 Man Field wrote:
8 man field (Minimum for para-mutual wagering) w 1500/3000 prs
Kiprop - 3:26.69/ 7:42.32
Bekele- 3:32.35/ 7:25.79
Komen- 3:29.46/ 7:20.67
Lagat- 3:26.3/ 7:29.00
Farah- 3:28.81/ 7:33.1
El G- 3:26.00/ 7:23.09
H.G.- 3:33.3/ 7:25.09
Auoita- 3:29.46/ 7:29.45
For a 2400 meter race my Trifecta bet would be El G, Komen, then Lagat in a nose over the rest of the field
El G's 4:44.79 2000 M WR is "equivalent" to a 2400 of approx. 5:47
Komen's 7:20.67 3000 M WR is "equivalent" to a 2400 of approx. 5:46
Komen was 5:51 low at 2400 en route to 3000 M WR. With that in mind, it seems likely that both EL G and Komen could break 5:50 for an all out 2400. I give edge to El G over Komen, due to more extensive championship racing credentials and faster finishing speed. Just my opinion.
Good field but Morcelki needs to be there with 3:27.37 7:25.11.
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