Sub 2min 800m training advice/workouts

Sub2Tim wrote:

I feel like i need to bring down my 400m time a bit to do this.

correct. improve your 400 by a sec or two and you should run sub 2

Well you are obviously more of a miler. Probably even more of a 2-miler. But if you want to bring down your 800 time ask your coach to run the 4x400 if you can at the end of meets. Do strides a lot. Maybe finish your workouts with a couple of fast 200s.

br0ski wrote:

Well you are obviously more of a miler. Probably even more of a 2-miler. But if you want to bring down your 800 time ask your coach to run the 4x400 if you can at the end of meets. Do strides a lot. Maybe finish your workouts with a couple of fast 200s.

Yea you're probably right about being more of a 1600/3200 runner but going sub 2min is like a bucket list thing for me and im probably not gonna be running in college. i feel like theres no reason why i cant do it. If i dont see good results midway through the season i'll most likely switch my focus back on the 1600.

You can take a look here. Not really advice for the endurance type like you, but many training principles you can use in your training.

http://800mtraining.wordpress.com/

I have mile/2mile types that run 2:00ish on the relay usually when in top shape around the same ability level as you. The key thing i do is try to get in something for leg turnover etc almost everyday. So two easy days a week they run 8x80m sprints after and a third easy run day they do a combo of plyo and sprints. After threshold workouts they do 200s or 150s after. After their race pace workout at the beginning of the week they do 8x100m or 4-6x150s with each 50m faster or an all out short interval at the end (e.g. 8x600 200m jog rest and then an allout 300 or 400 after the last 600). All these things can help improve your speed and kick at the end of the race.

Run a couple legs in the 4x400m. Work in strides. Ask your coach if you can do kick work during thresholds. Work in some 150m sprints into your workouts.

citius5000 wrote:

I have mile/2mile types that run 2:00ish on the relay usually when in top shape around the same ability level as you. The key thing i do is try to get in something for leg turnover etc almost everyday. So two easy days a week they run 8x80m sprints after and a third easy run day they do a combo of plyo and sprints. .

It's funny, isn't it? For a 1-2-4 runner, or a hurdler, a session like 5 x 80m on 10 mins recovery is not an easy day. It's pretty taxing on the body.

If someone can cruise 8 x 80s after an easy run, what exactly is it doing for them? Ditto doing a few strides here and there, the classic call from the distance type runner's approach to speeding up 800s.

The simple answer is this: if you want your 400 to get faster, you have to train speed. Regularly, and properly.

Yet again, sir, you are splendidly correct. The only way to get good at chess is to practice chess. The only way to improve raw speed is to learn how to sprint-that is, acceleration, max velocity, and sustaining that improved velocity over longer and longer distances, or lengths of time if you prefer.

Ecoeco wrote:

You can take a look here. Not really advice for the endurance type like you, but many training principles you can use in your training.

http://800mtraining.wordpress.com/

Thanks this had TONS of useful info! Definitely gonna work this into my training

Ok so the consensus that I'm getting from all this is to work on pure speed between 60-150m repeats. This seems good to know. For speed during winter track my coach has us do 12-16x200m at 32sec or better, 6-8x400m at 68sec or better, and 20x100m hill sprints. We do at least one of these workouts once or twice a week and then 4-8mile runs at moderate/hard pace the rest of the week. Idk if he plans to mix it up for spring (I hope so.) And I completely forgot about doing strides! My idea of strides is pretty much gradually building up speed for about 100m and opening up your stride as much as u can. Please correct me if I'm wrong about this. Also how many should I do and when should I do them? Thanks to everyone who's posted on this! It's all been great feedback

Not quite. What Karma Police and I are saying is, and I hope I can speak on his behalf, is this:

You are familiar with the term 'base' as it refers to building up layers of endurance. However, you also need a speed 'base'. As far as actual running goes, this starts with acceleration (4-6 seconds only), max velocity work (6-10 seconds all out), and the general strength, core and other work designed to improve your general athleticism. This running work is with FULL REST between reps. As a rule, one minute for every 10m run will suffice.

There is then a progression of workouts involving full and partial rest to train different paces.

Look up Ron Grigg, as an example to someone who is on top of this sort of thing. Do not listen to the average LetsRun distance grinder.

On the site that the below link takes you to, Grigg has an excellent program, which you have to pay for, that goes through the whole deal. It is designed for 4/6/8 runners, but is definitely worth it if you want to extract the best out of yourself speedwise, and combine that with whatever endurance capability you have.

http://completetrackandfield.com/ron-grigg/

You need to go to a sprint coach to do the acceleration and max velocity work properly, if you have any aspiration to run a decent 800m.

Strides- After a regular run on a non-workout day do anywhere from 5-10 strides between 100-200 meters. focus should be on correct form while maintaining a strong pace but dont do them so hard you are hurting at the end.

Workouts- I think it is foolish for you to only focus on getting faster in the 800 so forget the speed focused workouts others are suggesting. We want to improve your mid distance running ability to make you a better 800, miler, and 2 miler. Talk to your coach about your desire to break 2. He may let you do mid distance work. for 200s try 8-10 in 30 or under. or 2x400 @65, 4x200@30, 4x150 all out. The hill sprints are good. Focus on good form while running uphill.

Also does anyone have any advice about hitting a plateau? When i started track my junior year i went from 4:50 to 4:35 in the 1600 and 2:12-2:04 in the 800 by the end of the season. And i started my senior year XC season at low 18s and high 17s to 16:20 towards the end of the season. I was really pumped with how i was improving so fast so i expected to do well during winter track in the 1000m but i was stuck between 2:44-2:41 all season. I tried every racing strategy in the book from starting fast, even splits, and sitting and kicking and nothing got me to qualifying for states (2:40 flat).

This can be because of a lot of factors. First your going to improve a lot in the beginning like most but thats going to slow down at some point. The other thing is it could be because of the training that is being done in general. Also the taper may not be right if you indeed tapered for the end of the season.

citius5000 wrote:

This can be because of a lot of factors. First your going to improve a lot in the beginning like most but thats going to slow down at some point. The other thing is it could be because of the training that is being done in general. Also the taper may not be right if you indeed tapered for the end of the season.

Towards the end of the winter season my coach had us doing more high intensity track workouts and less volume distance work. i was feeling pretty burned out and unmotivated during the last few weeks of the season. Its my first time doing a running sport back to back. i was a wrestler for 5 years before i decided to run winter track this year. I still gave 100% in what i did but i REALLY had to force myself and it wasnt fun. But i still managed to win the county meet in the 1000m and immediately took two weeks off from running. I still stayed active though, Ive been doing strength training and plyometrics 2-5 times a week. Last week i started getting back into running with some 20min runs and some tempo runs mixed with my ST and Plyo workouts. Now im looking and researching track workouts to help with my speed and bust me out of the plateau.

This can definitely happen. The cold/winter weather can be a huge factor on training and motivation. What might of happened is doing to much hard training for to long. You reach a point where the fitness gains stop, you stagnate and eventually start to slowdown. Thats why you dont want to spent to much time in the specific training phase. I once had a coach that gave us a week off after XC where i did 20miles easy and the rest of my teammates did nothing. Week one we were doing intervals at 5k pace (5xmile(2:00)) and 400s at mile pace(12-16x400(60-90sec) etc. Did this end of november, all of december, january, frebuary and by the time i was hitting March i was burnt out. Some people forget theres phases to training.