So I came back from a run this afternoon and looked at my phone. There was a text from a top HS coach which said, "Grant Fischer is not the best kid in Michigan."
I wrote back facetiously, "Yeah you're right. He probably couldn't beat Ritz right now. Maybe in another 6 months. Who are you really talking about?"
"This Brazier kid. Black guy. 1:48.61 as a junior. 15:25 this fall. Never runs the mile. Tried to go after Fisher this weekend but not fit enough - 4:09.3. Watch the race. Talent level doesn't compare."
The race can be watched here:
http://usa.milesplit.com/articles/144664-watch-grant-fishers-indoor-season-debut-with-us-1-407-mile-
Before you say this is totally ridiculous. This coach does have an eye. I was at IC4as back in 2012 and he was there. He was watching the 1k and saw a kid from Monmouth, "Look at that guy. He's going to good," he said.
At the time, the guy from Monmouth had run just 4:08, now he's a 3:38 guy - Ford Palmer.
Brazier certainly is a stud. Not many guys run 1:48 as a junior. He's headed to Texas A&M next year.
Your thoughts?
I just got a text from a top HS coach: "Grant Fisher is not the best kid in Michigan." LetsRun, meet Donavan Brazier
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Brazier > Fischer
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I went to a track camp with brazier this summer, great kid. Amazing form, definitely has a lot of potential. BUT fisher never runs the 800 (so he could easily be a sub 1:50 guy, we don't really know) , and he's also ran 4:02 for the mile. So it's really hard to compare the two. 4:09 is far off from 4:02.
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If brazier runs 1:47.1 this year it's better than fisher running 3:59.1
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Don't sleep on Logan Wetzel, who was right behind Brazier, also in 4:09. Has split sub-1:50 for 800. Very undertrained from what I hear.
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After being by himself the entire race, Grant was able to power away from a charging Brazier over the last 120m with relative ease (winning by a touch over 2 sec).
Brazier's a beautiful runner, but lets not act like he's new to distance and was in unfamiliar territory over a mile. He ran a 4:15 1600m last spring, and then a 15:25 at the MI state meet for ~5th in cross (Fisher won 14:52, Wetzel was 2nd in 15:19).
He- and Wetzel- pretty much have nothing to lose when they step on the line with Grant from 1 mile on up. They can just take their brst shot and hope for an upset. Hopefully there's a few more of these battles through the spring. Plus I think we'd all like to see what Grant can do over 800m. -
Brazier has that relaxed Rudisha stride.
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I'm a MI senior and I've raced all 3 of these guys - Fisher, Brazier, and Wetzel. They're all incredible talents and nice guys too. IMO Michigan is one of the strongest distance running states in the country this year. Look for big things from these guys.
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We dont see too many African Americans distance runners so it was good to see him go under 4:10! Oh yeah don't forget about Drake Gauthier. He ran 1:58 as an 14 year old. He can run a 10 sec 100m, 21 sec 200m, and sub 50 400m. The kid has speed, i guarantee you if he had the right training he could easily break the 4 min mile barrier.
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Fisher has proven himself time and time again and yet people will still go on saying that some other kid is better even though they've done not nearly enough to warrant the claim. Just because he ran 1:48.61 as a junior and looks smooth when he runs? How is that even relevant to Fisher, who doesn't even compete in the 800? The excuses are nice too, "Never runs the mile. Tried to go after Fisher this weekend but not fit enough" It's real easy to say that kinda stuff when you can't exactly argue objectively with it. Brazier is no doubt immensely talented but Fisher is arguably one of the top talents to come out of U.S. prep distance running and this coach has the gall to say "talent level doesn't compare"? Sounds like a grade A d-bag to me.
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rojo wrote:
So I came back from a run this afternoon and looked at my phone. There was a text from a top HS coach which said, "Grant Fischer is not the best kid in Michigan."
I wrote back facetiously, "Yeah you're right. He probably couldn't beat Ritz right now. Maybe in another 6 months. Who are you really talking about?"
"This Brazier kid. Black guy. 1:48.61 as a junior. 15:25 this fall. Never runs the mile. Tried to go after Fisher this weekend but not fit enough - 4:09.3. Watch the race. Talent level doesn't compare."
Your thoughts?
Considering someone can't spell FISHER when it is all over the news...
Be careful throwing race labels around if you don't have a clue someone's genetic heritage. You'd be surprised in some cases as skin color doesn't equal someone's dominant DNA. While people think Fisher is rigid, he has the mitochondrial DNA from his mother, who was a great distance runner - and by the way, so does Matt Maton. So, the foundation for a superb engine was laid down by his Mother's body when he was in the womb. He's clearly brought that to life. I remember his soph year when he ran 4:24 for a PR and a week later ran 4:11 for a 1600. Our jaws dropped. It's been lights out since then and I don't expect that to change anytime soon. He's partially a product of scientific, smart training and not overdoing it. He runs 50-55 a week and does the little things.
While I agree that Brazier is talented and very smooth, I will maintain the MOST talented kid in MI is Wetzel. You don't run a 4:20 indoor Mile as a freshman on a developed distance running program. Sorry folks, that is raw talent. Hell, the kid doesn't barely have to shave a mustache. Wetzel also played soccer as a youth, at a national level. After his injury and surgery the concept shifted to keep him healthy and let a college coach have fun with him. This kid will run sub 4:00 as a college freshman. As he is developed he'll get better and stronger and the difference between Fisher and him will even out. Others will appear on the scene and compete with them.
Long term Brazier and Wetzel are 800/1500 guys. I'll throw out there 1:44/1:45 types and 3:32 type 1500M guys.
Fisher might be a 3/5k guy as he matures. I'll go 7:38/12:50 when its all said and done.
The interesting thing this year is do all three get invited to New York for all the marbles - both indoor and out. Don't be shocked if 1,2 or 3 are approaching 4:00 by June as they will have each other to push at a few races this winter and spring. -
MI Stronger wrote:
Long term Brazier and Wetzel are 800/1500 guys. I'll throw out there 1:44/1:45 types and 3:32 type 1500M guys.
Fisher might be a 3/5k guy as he matures. I'll go 7:38/12:50 when its all said and done. -
Did Brazier's father run for Aquinas College, in Grand Rapids ?
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I want to hear more about this coach who has such an eye for talent. I mean, who'd of thought someone running 1:48 as a junior or another kid running 4:08 would be any good. That's amazing. How does he do it? I've always thought if you ran one of the fastest marks in the nation you were destined to be extremely slow after high school. You know, like the clock hits midnight and you turn back into a hobbyjogger in college.
Seriously, where do you come up with this nonsense?
Grant Fisher is obviously the best kid in Michigan and he's got the hardware to prove it. -
rojo wrote:
"This Brazier kid. Black guy. 1:48.61 as a junior. 15:25 this fall. Never runs the mile. Tried to go after Fisher this weekend but not fit enough - 4:09.3. Watch the race. Talent level doesn't compare."
So the fact that Brazier failed to beat Fischer is evidence that Brazier is better than Fischer? Great logic. "Fischer isn't the best runner in Michigan anymore. Another kid tried to beat him, but couldn't do it!" -
"It's okay though! He just wasn't quite ready! He's still better than him, I know it!"
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Tried to go after Fisher this weekend but not fit enough -
Exactly, doesn't the better, stronger runner have more fitness? I have no idea what this statement is trying to prove? Isn't this Fishers first race since Cross, so I imagine he is not at the top of his fitness? -
Burcham was better than kidder when he beat him at the dream mile, right?
What happened to the last star Scannell coached? -
Fellow Scout In Awe! wrote:
I want to hear more about this coach who has such an eye for talent. I mean, who'd of thought someone running 1:48 as a junior or another kid running 4:08 would be any good. That's amazing. How does he do it? I've always thought if you ran one of the fastest marks in the nation you were destined to be extremely slow after high school. You know, like the clock hits midnight and you turn back into a hobbyjogger in college.
Seriously, where do you come up with this nonsense?.
Let me explain this pretty easily.
1) The 4:08 guy he spotted was a 4:08 midway through his junior year in college. In case you don't realize, 4:08 as a junior in college is far from great.
Last year, there were more than 200 kids at the D1 level that ran 4:08. 200 plus. 4:08.29 was #200.
2) Yes obviously 1:48 is an incredible talent for HS but the point of the post is to get people to think outside the box a little and giver Brazier some love.
There have only been 6 HSers in US history to go sub 1:48 while in HS. There have been 5 HSers to break 4:00 - yet most of LetsRun has never heard of the Brazier. Fisher is a household name. There shouldn't be that much of a dichotomy in terms of publicity.
Both are extremely talented.
I think Fisher deserves the extra press. Look at the guys who have gone sub-4 in HS. Lots of huge names - Ryun, Webb, Liquori, etc whereas the 800 guys aren't necessarily stars - Granville, Richardson.
And for me, the 4:02 and the 2 Foot Locker titles back to back is special. -
I'm sure it has been discussed before but I clearly think that Fisher's arm swing is off. Maybe he had a left right sway that he needed to work on, but he looks too stiff if this is a new form.
He will have to relax more if he is to break sub 4 in high school or even as a Frosh.
