After Mo's 3:28.81, what is the ideal tactic to beat him at 5K/10K?

rrri wrote:

Mo is old wrote:

Because he just ran 3:28, a race that wasn't sit and kick. That's why you have no argument

Are you kidding? We're talking about the 5k/10k not the 1500. Don't be dumb.

No, it sounds dumb when you say "he's no longer in great 5k or 10k shape". So you're saying he hasn't been training for the events that he's doing at Worlds? Educate yourself.

killarney wrote:

Keyword HAS. Past tense.

This is hilarious.

Perhaps Mo has worked the speed end of things so much that he no longer has the specific endurance to run a very fast time over 10k. That is the only hope for the Kenyans and Ethiopians. They've got to use team tactics and run fast from the gun.

Mo is old wrote:

No, it sounds dumb when you say "he's no longer in great 5k or 10k shape". So you're saying he hasn't been training for the events that he's doing at Worlds? Educate yourself.

It sounds dumb when you can't read. That's not what I said. I said it's likely that he's no longer in great 5k or 10k shape. Also, that's in no way saying that he hasn't been training for those events.

You are the one with horrible reading comprehension so go educate yourself.

Fat Joe wrote:

Perhaps Mo has worked the speed end of things so much that he no longer has the specific endurance to run a very fast time over 10k. That is the only hope for the Kenyans and Ethiopians. They've got to use team tactics and run fast from the gun.

Yes, Salazar does emphasize speed year-round, but he never loses touch with the endurance aspect. NOP frequently does workouts like 6 x mile, 6 mile tempos, and hard long runs. They cover every base.

rrri wrote:

Mo is old wrote:

No, it sounds dumb when you say "he's no longer in great 5k or 10k shape". So you're saying he hasn't been training for the events that he's doing at Worlds? Educate yourself.

It sounds dumb when you can't read. That's not what I said. I said it's likely that he's no longer in great 5k or 10k shape. Also, that's in no way saying that he hasn't been training for those events.

You are the one with horrible reading comprehension so go educate yourself.

So you say that you never said that, yet you go on to make the same claim the next sentence? Wow.

I would secretly replace his PEDs with Folgers crystals. He'd never know the difference.

Elbows

Mo is old wrote:

rrri wrote:

It sounds dumb when you can't read. That's not what I said. I said it's likely that he's no longer in great 5k or 10k shape. Also, that's in no way saying that he hasn't been training for those events.

You are the one with horrible reading comprehension so go educate yourself.

So you say that you never said that, yet you go on to make the same claim the next sentence? Wow.

Reading comprehension.

rrri wrote:

Mo is old wrote:

So you say that you never said that, yet you go on to make the same claim the next sentence? Wow.

Reading comprehension.

It's good that you know what you have to work on. You're on your way!

someone had to do it wrote:

"Merga" him into a bush

It'll take more than a phantom push to knock Mo Farah off of the track.

By having the '02-'04 Ethiopians run team tactics. Specifically having Bekele and Sihine trade laps and negative split. Bekele closes in 53. Sorry but Farah could not hang with that. (I realize this is historical.)

With 3:28.81 1500m and past 26:40ish, he can certainly challenge the world records at 3k and 5k, if not also 10k. And he has shown the best kick at 5k and 10k of any of them in slow or medium race. Only injury, fall, or father time can beat him now.

rrri wrote:

Mo is old wrote:

No, it sounds dumb when you say "he's no longer in great 5k or 10k shape". So you're saying he hasn't been training for the events that he's doing at Worlds? Educate yourself.

It sounds dumb when you can't read. That's not what I said. I said it's likely that he's no longer in great 5k or 10k shape. Also, that's in no way saying that he hasn't been training for those events.

You are the one with horrible reading comprehension so go educate yourself.

why the f*ck would the defending 5k/10k world champion and olympic gold medallist, who has been specifically training all year with those events in mind, and who has already won a world class 5k this year, not be in good 5k/10k shape?? What indication is there that this is the case?

Seriously some of you people say things that are so stupid it makes me want to smack my head into a wall. Absolutely unbelievable.

The Waterboy wrote:

Have the Ethiopians or Kenyans run a 70 second first lap from the leaders, so cocky Mo Farah will go right to the back in 75-76 like he always does.

Then have 3 or 4 of them make an immediate break and run the remaining 24 or 11.5 laps at 26:40 pace or 12:50 pace, trading the lead to help pace each other.

Winning time will be 26:46 or 12:59, but Farah will have lost too many seconds after the first lap to catch up if they take off right away, or if he does catch up he will be burnt out by the time the last lap rolls around because he will have to run at PR pace for 90% of the race plus a surge to make up the 5 second gap from him to the front.

Brilliant, only problem is it probably won't be a 5-6 second gap. Usually even a fairly strung-out field only takes 3 seconds to pass.

Interestingly, they DID almost do exactly this in the Olympic 5,000 - watch the race about 70 seconds in. Someone made a move and immediately had about 4 seconds on Farah. Farah recognized he was alone and didn't budge. If the Ethiopians do it as a team and catch him off guard, it might work.

Try to tire Farah with a very fast 10000m, followed by running his 5000m heat with seriously negative splits? A hard last mile in Farah's heat while he still has the 10000m in his legs might soften his kick a bit - enough to make him beatable? Dunno

rojo wrote:

But how would i beat him? Yes, you are right, it would have to be maybe be a time trial affair. The problem is you need rabbits and they have to be spot on.

Today's race was suicidal. Whatever pace is set, Mo is giong to be smart enough to sit in the back of the pack and not ruin the race for himself like some of the guys today.

First of all, Salazar is not stupid and he is not static. I'm sure he knows what others of us know, which is the performance of Rupp against Lagat at USATF looked like a weakness. The Africans are going to push the pace and kick off a fast pace.

But if I know this, Salazar knows this, and what you saw today and what you will see in London are countermeasures: THEY are working at kicking off a faster pace and concentrating more on 1500-style training, which is what Lagat used to dust Rupp after Ben True opened things up.

I do think they way to beat them is to do what True did. If you push the pace in the early or middle, he can sit at the back and rest or run even splits. But if you push the pace in the last 1500-2000m, with somebody like True who is a threat, he has to respond. Then if you have someone like Lagat (or, say Choge) who is trained to run fast 1500s, that guy can win.

But none of this is the question TODAY. You could beat Salazar's training. Lagat showed that.

But the question now, is how do you respond to Salazar's countermeasures?

The cat and mouse game continues.

If you have 2 or 3 guys good enough to win, you could just send one at a maximum sustainable pace. The rest sit back to kick later. If Farah doesn't take the bait, that guy runs an even pace for the gold medal. If Farah takes the bait, the guy in front accelerates slightly so Farah dies at the end and the rest of your team runs them down at the end. Yes, I know this is basically old school cross country strategy, but I think that's how you have to play this game.

They have to take the risk of making it a very hard pace from the gun. Farah might still be able to hang but it is worth a shot since he has never been really tested by a fast pace. You know you will lose in a kick but it is unknown as to what will happen in a fast race. If he is not feeling 100% on the day they might be able to crack him if they work together. It is worth a shot to make it fast because you are not winning any other way.

Yes, a police raid.

This guy has no problem looking hugely suspect. Seems like his main goal in life. Salazar, those needlessly strong last laps, 1500m ER... Come on, control yourself!