WEBB IS BACK, BABY, 13:37

ryan foreman wrote:

I had a question, not a point. And btw, the question still stands.

He answered your question, idiot, what else did you need answered?

rootie twootie tootie rootie wrote:

He could have opted for the second section (where he would have gotten second with that time) but NO!! Webb chose to run with the big guys... showing no fear at all, I can still run with the big dogs.

Long live the King!! King Webb is back!!!

Yup, long live the King of time trialing!!!

Isn't 13:37 the same time he ran a 5K at a turkey trot against RUPP about a year or two ago?

Ben L. Wrong wrote:

It's a nice season opener. He won't be running 13:10 this year...but it would be interesting if he run something in the range of 13:15/13:18, which is not out of the cuestion seeing his splits.

13:37 first race out dying isn't horrible. Was anyone else in their first race of the year?

Nonetheless, to be a factor in the US now on the world level, you need to be able to go sub 13:00. Rupp, Lagat, and conceivably Lomong are at that level.

If Webb gets to 13:15 shape, even with his speed I don't see him making the team. So 13:37 to 13:00 is a long way.

I'm most interested that they just threw Webb into this race for his opener. Maybe they figured he might hit it out of the park and what's the point of him doing a rust buster as it would be evaluated by Alan Webb with his lofty standards?

But if things don't go great like yesterday, now what?

The mental side of Alan Webb fascinates me.

The presumption has always been the incredible talent is there but now that Webb is getting older, I think some are wondering if the physical gifts are still there.

I didn't think too much beforehand what Webb would run. I guess I might have predicted he'd fade to the 13:30s. Easy to say now right?

he's back suckin

I wouldn't constitute a 13:37 as being back, but I don't think it's overly discouraging either. It's an OK effort from a guy who probably should have run about 10 seconds faster.

The bigger issue to me is how often he changed coaches and for what reason... he's been doing it since high school. For me, the issue is Alan trying to find reasons why he isn't performing at the level he wants without addressing the biggest one, his lack of self confidence.

It's always the "new Alan Webb", or the "new coach", or "I'm finally figuring out what was wrong before". There's always a reason for his inability to race tough, and the only real answer is to take responsibility for being a baby. It's becoming and old tune.

I hope he runs well, but there are way better guys to cheer for and get behind than the talented Mr. Ripley. I'd rather see him quietly start racing well again, instead of doing interviews where he sounds more like someone trying to convince himself that they belong on the track with these guys.

If I were a real betting man, I would not put my money on Webb. I think he will always be a legend but unfortunately, his days are over. While time tells us something, so does position. The fact that there are 20 people in front of him means he would have to improve while everyone remains the same or deteriorates.

If you remove emotion out of this, you will realize that there are a lot of things that are not on his side. These include the great crop of American runners right now, current crop of international runners, his age, and his recent history. This means that even at his best later this year, he will not have an easy time making the American team. Also based on his running history, he fits one of those rare guys who peak early in life. A typical athlete improves gradually with age and experience, plateaus, then recedes (if they don't realize it is time to retire). However, a small group improves more dramatically in teen to mid 20s than their peers but also plateau and recede dramatically fast as well; Webb is the latter.

speaking of the mental side of webb, I would look to put him in races he could win, rather than putting him up against much faster guys.

he's got to turn a corner mentally - get him to race instead of retreating into his head every race. Let him feel that adrenaline rush when you take the lead.

unwashed phenomenon wrote:

Can Webb run a 4;01 now?

How many Olympic medals does Webb have?

Yes.

What's the head-to-head record, Rupp vs. Webb?

How many major track WINS does Rupp have? (Golden/Diamond League, WC, Olympics)?

Webb: 1

Rupp: 0

WEJO: agree really interested in why jerry would throw him into this one at his current level of conditioning. I think if I were his coach, my strategy would be to strip him of his previous view of himself...ie like marine training, tear him down mentally and then build him back up. I would make him race out of shape and brick a few races, I would convince him that he is no longer "Alan Webb AR Holder" and that he is something new, unproven, and an underdog. Get him out there beaten up a few times and then be happy about it. Call it another step forward.

30 year old legs definitely dont have the same zip as 24 year old legs, but this is a guy with a ridiculous VO2 max and aerobic power. I think he runs sub 13:10 this year if he can stay healthy and not freak out. If Jerry can convince him that he is starting over from scratch then 13:37 opener is not bad. He is healthy and on a positive trajectory. Every race the goal should just be to run faster. I would also have him race evry week so that he didnt get a chance to get inside his own head with prolonged training periods in the spring. Just alternate 3k-5k ....never run the mile except in practice. If he starts to talk to the press or runs a 1500m he might slip back into his mental downward spiral again....will be interesting to watch.

No he didn't.

coach bigfoot wrote:

ryan foreman wrote:

I had a question, not a point. And btw, the question still stands.

He answered your question, idiot, what else did you need answered?

I don't think we should be judging Alan's year this year based on whether or not he is likely to make the World team. To make the world team this year the runners are gonna have to either be in sub-13 shape or close to it with a great kick. Is anyone actually expecting that out of Webb this year? I don't think so. I mean sure if he'd had a solid fall and winter buildup with no problems, which would mean he would have done something indoors, then it would be a possibility. But considering he's opening his year at the end of april, and its been 6 years since he was last at top form, and its his first year training for the 5k, a reasonable goal is to get him close to his PR of 13:10, not be running sub 13. that'll come next year.

If he runs 13:15 this summer he's back b/c for someone as talented as him with his inconsistent training for the last half of his career, that means he's one solid year of training away from competing with the best.

Early season results for Webb are always intriguing. Due to his immense talent, Webb fans love to draw hopeful conclusions from his races, no matter what the clock says. One always assumes a slow time in April/May simply means Webb is training through or just taking it easy as a means of injury-prevention. And a couple of years ago I made these assumptions too. But we've been making these assumptions for the past 5 years, and at this point it's really hard to believe Webb will make it back to the top.

Quite simply - Webb is talented, dedicated, and works hard. So, at his peak he ran a few superb time trials and won at least one major international race (Paris 2007). However, he does not have the psychological make up of a champion. Never has. Now he has suffered too many setbacks and coaching changes over the past few years and he's tangled in a mental knot that no one can untangle for him. The physical tools are still there for a couple more years, but no coach will be able to unlock them before Webb ages out.

this was probably the best race webb could of been in. he's been working out with his whole crew that was entered, solinksy and he are kind of in the same boat so in theory he'd have a teammate to work with which may of made him relax and feel a bit more comfortable. He was running pretty well for 4,000m then pulled the slow fade. Not bad for a first race out and yes, he did get throttled but who the f0ck really expects him to be the man again?

Everyone talks about his speed at the end but shit, rupp and lomong are damn near just as fast these days....and he's old. remember kennedy's last few years in the 5k on the track....

Webb is a real beast, but I guess it's difficult for him to comeback to world top level.

We are in a time that you have to be a 12:50 guy to really have a word to say in a big competition. Webb's deal was always racing against the clock, I think he will get into 13:15-13:20 shape in the summer, but the years doesn't stop and he is getting to old...

Anyway his career was really impressive and looking for the last years seems that he is in good road.

didn't salazar have him running 13:37 at the silicon valley turkey trot a few years back...in NOVEMBER?

ryan foreman wrote:

I had a question, not a point. And btw, the question still stands.

You had a pointless question.

Quick question: Has Alan Webb negative split any race in the last 3 or so years? It seems like in every race I have seen him in he goes out relatively hard and fades, I mean maybe that's not the best strategy for him ,at least try something a bit different. He is the fastest miler in pretty much any race he runs, so why is he trying to be a pace maker for his competitors in every race? I would much rather see him win a 5k in 13:50 with a 54 sec last lap then run 13:37.

I like the the Solinsky/ Webb PR comparison being 28 secs slower for Solinsky and he is thrilled, and 27 secs slower for Webb and it is a disappointment? If there are two very talented head cases in distance running I would be hard pressed to find 2 better examples. So hopefully Webb can get on the Solinsky train and improve right along side him.

As for throwing him in this race right off the bat, I do like it. As long as they put him in some lower key meets in between this and U.S champs. I think it is a good indicator of where he stands and what his training indicates. He could be running close to the same in workouts as the other guys, but if he is racing 15-20 secs slower then some things may have to be adjusted a bit.

wejo wrote: 13:37 first race out dying isn't horrible. Was anyone else in their first race of the year?

But if things don't go great like yesterday, now what?

...

The mental side of Alan Webb fascinates me.

The main issue with Webb, as it has always been, is where is he mentally. 1337 is a great 5k time. His last laps are what makes you wonder what is up.

Did he slow down and save it for later?

Was he simply tired out?

Or, did he mentally decide he wasn't finishing in 1315, and rather than run high 131x, or low 1320x, he thought too much about the time and ended up at 1337.